October surprise? Why OPEC's planned price hike could pummel Democrats

cawacko said:
Let me ask you this, there are environmentalists who celebrate higher gas prices because they believe people will drive less, buy more fuel efficient cars and make transitioning to alternative energy sources more economically viable. We believe that in California where we put massive taxes on fuel and all kinds of regulations that drive up energy costs in the name of combatting climate change. If the hardest working Americans are economically harmed by that then that's the price we have to pay (they should have gone to college).
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But, by the same token, those same liberals are also voting FOR improved social safetynets, higher minimum wages, etc. So in total the LIberal position is better than the Conservative position which is simply to rejoice anytime a "lib is owned" no matter how. Even if it harms them as well.

And shouldn't this action by the Saudi's help in the long run get us off fossil fuels faster? So from that perspective is this a bad thing what the Saudi's are doing?
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In many ways that's true. In the 1970's America actually started looking at SMALL CARS for the first time in forever mainly because gas shortages at the time. Again, due to OPEC.

The key is to push for these changes without leaving people behind. The Liberal position, like it or not, is more internally consistent than the "Own the LIbs at all costs" Conservatives.
 
cawacko said:
Let me ask you this, there are environmentalists who celebrate higher gas prices because they believe people will drive less, buy more fuel efficient cars and make transitioning to alternative energy sources more economically viable. We believe that in California where we put massive taxes on fuel and all kinds of regulations that drive up energy costs in the name of combatting climate change. If the hardest working Americans are economically harmed by that then that's the price we have to pay (they should have gone to college).

And shouldn't this action by the Saudi's help in the long run get us off fossil fuels faster? So from that perspective is this a bad thing what the Saudi's are doing?
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Hey, I'm hearing you! SHORT RUN- YES, AMERICA WILL BE IMPACTED BY THE PRICE INCREASE!

But in the longer run- YES, AMERICA WILL DO WHAT WE HAVE TO DO, AND WHAT WE HAVE TO DO EVEN MORE NOW IS MOVE ON THE ALTERNATIVE GREENER FUELS- AND TRULY BECOME INDEPENDENT ON FUEL, NOT JUST CRUDE- AND THE USA WILL BECOME THE MORE ECONOMICALLY SECURE AND HAVING THE BEST ENVIRONMENTALLY SAFEST WAY TO FUEL OUR CARS!

THANKS SAUDIS! THANKS AMERICAN OIL PRODUCERS WHO ARE SITTING ON THEIR HANDS IN TIMES OF ECONOMIC CRISIS CAUSED BY THEIR INSISTENCE TO DO NOTHING ABOUT IT!
 
Geeko Sportivo said:
Hey, I'm hearing you! SHORT RUN- YES, AMERICA WILL BE IMPACTED BY THE PRICE INCREASE!

But in the longer run- YES, AMERICA WILL DO WHAT WE HAVE TO DO, AND WHAT WE HAVE TO DO EVEN MORE NOW IS MOVE ON THE ALTERNATIVE GREENER FUELS- AND TRULY BECOME INDEPENDENT ON FUEL, NOT JUST CRUDE- AND THE USA WILL BECOME THE MORE ECONOMICALLY SECURE AND HAVING THE BEST ENVIRONMENTALLY SAFEST WAY TO FUEL OUR CARS!

THANKS SAUDIS! THANKS AMERICAN OIL PRODUCERS WHO ARE SITTING ON THEIR HANDS IN TIMES OF ECONOMIC CRISIS CAUSED BY THEIR INSISTENCE TO DO NOTHING ABOUT IT!
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I don't work in the oil industry so I'm not going to pretend like I fully understand their business model. I do know they exist to extract oil but I also know that their projects take long term planning and execution and generally aren't things you are start and stop on a whim. So if I'm an oil guy and I hear all this anti fossil fuel rhetoric coming from the highest levels of our government where is my incentive to do anything more than I think I need to do?

It seems a very mix message to me that they are both basically evil for the damage they do to the planet but then are called on to be patriotic and produce more so short term costs come down.
 
cawacko said:
I don't work in the oil industry so I'm not going to pretend like I fully understand their business model. I do know they exist to extract oil but I also know that their projects take long term planning and execution and generally aren't things you are start and stop on a whim. So if I'm an oil guy and I hear all this anti fossil fuel rhetoric coming from the highest levels of our government where is my incentive to do anything more than I think I need to do?

It seems a very mix message to me that they are both basically evil for the damage they do to the planet but then are called on to be patriotic and produce more so short term costs come down.
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Well, I'm not a petroleum engineer either.

But, even the world's smartest petroleum engineers have revealed that there is not enough crude left in the world to fuel the world's demands for gasoline past another 35 years- based on the world's current demands.

SO, the writing has been on the wall for the Saudis and the American Oil producers that their bird nest on the ground is going away and sooner than they want.

So, there obviously will be attempts to milk the crude oil prices until it's all gone for what they can get out of it- by making it short of demand so that the price will be as high as it can get.

It is just nature taking it's ugly greedy course- THIS IS WHAT MAN DOES!

But, then again, I remember when radio was the big thing- AND THEN CAME ALONG TELEVISION AND THE RADIO BECAME SOMETHING YOU DO IN THE CAR WHILE DRIVING.

IT'S CALLED INNOVATION!

It's called progress!

I just find it odd that Republicans are the only ones trying to hold America back from innovation and progress- and it is not hard to figure out as they continue to seek money from the Petroleum industry to get themselves elected every election.

That is not progress- THAT IS CORRUPTION!
 
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Walt said:
They are predicting a two thirds chance that Republicans will lose the Senate, and a two thirds chance Republicans will win the House. That means a real chance that Republicans will lose both.
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you may be right if between now and the election they change the election for congress to a national "generic" election.......do you expect that to happen?......
 
Geeko Sportivo said:
Let's get this straight- YOU'RE HOPING THE SAUDIS INTENTIONALLY HURT'S THE DEMOCRATS CHANCES IN THE ELECTION EVEN THOUGH THIS SAUDI DECISION IS HURTING AMERICA'S HARDEST WORKING AMERICANS- NOT JUST THE DEMOCRATS!

ARE YOU A TRAITOR? OR JUST SO DESPERATE TO WIN, YOU RELY ON FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS TO HELP YOU OUT?
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so its a bad thing for the Saudis to fuck over the American oil consumers by cutting production but its a good thing that Biden fucked over the American oil consumers by cutting production?......how does that work in your mind?.....
 
PostmodernProphet said:
so its a bad thing for the Saudis to fuck over the American oil consumers by cutting production but its a good thing that Biden fucked over the American oil consumers by cutting production?......how does that work in your mind?.....
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Its all of OPEC that is bending towards the Chinese and against the West.
 
Perry Phimosis said:
But, by the same token, those same liberals are also voting FOR improved social safetynets, higher minimum wages, etc. So in total the LIberal position is better than the Conservative position which is simply to rejoice anytime a "lib is owned" no matter how. Even if it harms them as well.



In many ways that's true. In the 1970's America actually started looking at SMALL CARS for the first time in forever mainly because gas shortages at the time. Again, due to OPEC.

The key is to push for these changes without leaving people behind. The Liberal position, like it or not, is more internally consistent than the "Own the LIbs at all costs" Conservatives.
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If Hershel Walker and Dr. B-OZ-O is the answer to "Owning the libs" KNOCK YOUR LITTLE PINK PANTIES OFF TRUMPTARDS!

What's next? You TRUMPTARDS GOING TO ENDORSE THE 3 STOOGES? :laugh:
 
PostmodernProphet said:
nothing in this thread is about the Chinese.......I don't think it is fair for you to charge XI for this post......
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Yeah, some folks on the Right just get going and they have to list out all their favorite bugbears (a list given to them by Trump) and it was China's time to come up even though this is probably completely unrelated to China.

The important thing is to complain about SOMEONE SOMEWHERE WHO ISN'T US (and by "us" obviously I only mean the good people who are Trump Lickspittles)
 
Perry Phimosis said:
Yeah, some folks on the Right just get going and they have to list out all their favorite bugbears (a list given to them by Trump) and it was China's time to come up even though this is probably completely unrelated to China.

The important thing is to complain about SOMEONE SOMEWHERE WHO ISN'T US (and by "us" obviously I only mean the good people who are Trump Lickspittles)
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I know a lot more than you do.

That's what the education was for.
 
Perry Phimosis said:
But, by the same token, those same liberals are also voting FOR improved social safetynets, higher minimum wages, etc. So in total the LIberal position is better than the Conservative position which is simply to rejoice anytime a "lib is owned" no matter how. Even if it harms them as well.



In many ways that's true. In the 1970's America actually started looking at SMALL CARS for the first time in forever mainly because gas shortages at the time. Again, due to OPEC.

The key is to push for these changes without leaving people behind. The Liberal position, like it or not, is more internally consistent than the "Own the LIbs at all costs" Conservatives.
Click to expand...
The problem is that this nation changes regimes every 4-8 years.

Obama put minimum fuel efficiencies into place, and trump did away with them.

We will probably never become a nation that recognizes the importance of using less fossil fuel. There's too much money involved.
 
Perry Phimosis said:
It isn't as simple as how much WE produce vs how much OPEC+ produces. The oil price is a function of BOTH of those things and OPEC+ probably has a MUCH bigger lever. If they slash production it drives up the cost ACROSS THE BOARD>
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About 50% of that OPEC cut is just on paper since most of the nation's could not meet their current allotment.
 
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