Rape Culture

evince said:
Its all coming from YOUR fucking head.

GET IT


kids make silly mistakes like experimenting with booze.

that does not mean someone should be able to rape them because of that mistake.


Its like saying if you fall down in the road its your fault if someone runs over you.
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Im glad you mentioned mistakes. And no, it doesn't make it okay. But if you wanted to stop rape, you'd examine the events leading up to it.

Im glad you compare making a conscious choice to drink, often illegally in the case of minors, to falling down in the road. I can see why you thought it worked.
 
Dionaea said:
I'm not blaming the victim. Im asking for all parties involved to step and be admit that there are things that can be done to help prevent this. It disgusts me that the moment I mention preventative measures and personal responsibility the Care Bear Patrol steps up to stifle the conversation. The victim gets traumatized, but I wonder what changes they really make to prevent it again. . .
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If a young man gets drunk and then gets mugged, do you blame the victim or the mugger?

Why can't women be safe around men, even if they are drunk? or even if they aren't wearing a burqa? Do you think so little of men that you think they can't learn to NOT RAPE WOMEN.

It's pretty simple.

And yes, of course, we talk to ALL our young people about ways to get through life more safely -like not drinking too much, like not walking in unsafe neighborhoods at 3 in the morning.

But it is the criminal who does the crime. They are responsible.
 
Dionaea said:
Or, I have to focus on the victim to avoid a crucial piece of the puzzle from being washed away. All relationships involve two entities, at least. We need to study both, and your stubborn refusal to look at all sides of the matter really show just how 'tolerant' and 'open minded' you are.
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According to this logic Banks shouldn't have signs on them saying Bank because they are just asking to be robbed by advertising they are a bank!

And according to this logic freeways shouldn't be repaved because as soon as you so that they are just asking for people to speed on them.

And if someone runs over me, even if they do run a red light and I am in the crosswalk it is my fault for getting in their way.

Yes, there are no victims only people who aid and abet in their own victimization!
 
Dionaea said:
Im glad you mentioned mistakes. And no, it doesn't make it okay. But if you wanted to stop rape, you'd examine the events leading up to it.

Im glad you compare making a conscious choice to drink, often illegally in the case of minors, to falling down in the road. I can see why you thought it worked.
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Yeah like teaching young men its OK to rape because the girl is just asking for it


jesus your as dumb as a box of round rocks
 
Dantès said:
According to this logic Banks shouldn't have signs on them saying Bank because they are just asking to be robbed by advertising they are a bank!

And according to this logic freeways shouldn't be repaved because as soon as you so that they are just asking for people to speed on them.

And if someone runs over me, even if they do run a red light and I am in the crosswalk it is my fault for getting in their way.

Yes, there are no victims only people who aid and abet in their own victimization!
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No, Banks would be at fault if they didn't use security protocol.

No, I fail to see a strong correlation between a new road and speeders. And even if that was so, freeways have speed limits and are patrolled. They use precautions, and even the autobahn now has security measures.

No, if somebody runs you over it wasn't because you were 'asking for it'. It was because somebody, probably both parties, weren't watching the road. You telling me you don't watch the road when you cross it? That's not conscious of your environment.
 
Taking your point that some things do happen without active provocation, why does the idea of using rape prevention techniques on both potential victims and their aggressors offend you? If there is any chance that one person a day, just one, can go without being violated, don't you want to explore that avenue?
 
dear fucking IDIOT, STOP pretending the victim has NOT been blamed all through history.


How has that LONG tradition stopped rapes?
 
Blaming the victim is compounding the crime you fucking dense ass fool.

STOP making excuses for the raper.
 
Dionaea said:
Im glad you mentioned mistakes. And no, it doesn't make it okay. But if you wanted to stop rape, you'd examine the events leading up to it.

Im glad you compare making a conscious choice to drink, often illegally in the case of minors, to falling down in the road. I can see why you thought it worked.
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Rape and other crimes against women and minorities are the only places where these kinds of arguments appear. A bank robber never says, I saw all that money and I just couldn't control myself. And people like you never say, "well we have to think about the poor bank robber the money was just laying out there and what could he or she do, Sure he was wrong to steal it but gee when I see money like that I get all excited too." Or we never say about shoplifters, "well the store shouldn't have their goods out like that where just anyone can take them" and you don't say, "well the store was to blame too because they have all this shit just laying around in there and they are just asking to be ripped off." Do you ever say that kind of crazy shit? No, you don't! But when someone attacks a woman or a Black person then all of a sudden we have to begin looking at both sides to see what provoked this attack! Why is that? If crime is crime then it really shouldn't matter what the other person did or didn't do. The criminal is responsible for their actions aren't they?
 
Dionaea said:
Taking your point that some things do happen without active provocation, why does the idea of using rape prevention techniques on both potential victims and their aggressors offend you? If there is any chance that one person a day, just one, can go without being violated, don't you want to explore that avenue?
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What a sad thing that our men can't be trusted, that women have to do "rape prevention techniques" to protect themselves - and are blamed if they don't.

Don't get me wrong - a good self-defense class is great for anyone, male or female.

but when someone does get victimized - then don't say it's their fault because they were drunk, dressed wrong, in the wrong neighborhood, didn't scream, didn't take the class, or whatever. It is not their fault. The fault rests solely on the person perpetuating the crime.
 
Dantès said:
Rape and other crimes against women and minorities are the only places where these kinds of arguments appear. A bank robber never says, I saw all that money and I just couldn't control myself. And people like you never say, "well we have to think about the poor bank robber the money was just laying out there and what could he or she do, Sure he was wrong to steal it but gee when I see money like that I get all excited too." Or we never say about shoplifters, "well the store shouldn't have their goods out like that where just anyone can take them" and you don't say, "well the store was to blame too because they have all this shit just laying around in there and they are just asking to be ripped off." Do you ever say that kind of crazy shit? No, you don't!
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I couldn't help myself is one the biggest excuses I hear. Im too tempted, or I just got angry and did it, or it was an opportunity. Its everywhere in our society, an opportunistic chance for immediate thrill.

AA? Step one is to admit we are powerless to stop ourselves, we cannot handle ourselves, we are morally weak.

But when someone attacks a woman or a Black person then all of a sudden we have to begin looking at both sides to see what provoked this attack! Why is that? If crime is crime then it really shouldn't matter what the other person did or didn't do. The criminal is responsible for their actions aren't they?
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Of course they are. And they should be punished. 'I couldn't control myself' says the drunk driver, or 'I wanted the soda so I stole it' says the teenager. Criminals, morally weak. We agree on that much, I think. But now lets look at safeguarding ourselves, shielding ourselves further from the assault. Seat belts are worn to protect from auto crashes. Back braces to protect against strain. people aren't too keen on taking their children out for Halloween, even with adult supervision nowadays. We lock our doors and buy alarms, and take precautions.

Why should rape prevention be any different. We all have to take precautions. We all recognize we can do more, even if in hindsight. If we want to change the situation, we have to start with us. Arm the women, with mace and whistles if you please. Teach them to say no, to think ahead. Hell, teach guys to do the same.

Why would you miss out on a chance to improve the lives of everyone and prevent a crime? We have all this education and we can't devote more of it to improving ourselves and protecting ourselves?
 
I don't think I speak for everyone, but if like any conflict there are two sides, and thus more than one way to skin a goat. I have no wish to ameliorate the crime, but to recognize more solutions.
 
Dionaea said:
I couldn't help myself is one the biggest excuses I hear. Im too tempted, or I just got angry and did it, or it was an opportunity. Its everywhere in our society, an opportunistic chance for immediate thrill.

AA? Step one is to admit we are powerless to stop ourselves, we cannot handle ourselves, we are morally weak.



Of course they are. And they should be punished. 'I couldn't control myself' says the drunk driver, or 'I wanted the soda so I stole it' says the teenager. Criminals, morally weak. We agree on that much, I think. But now lets look at safeguarding ourselves, shielding ourselves further from the assault. Seat belts are worn to protect from auto crashes. Back braces to protect against strain. people aren't too keen on taking their children out for Halloween, even with adult supervision nowadays. We lock our doors and buy alarms, and take precautions.

Why should rape prevention be any different. We all have to take precautions. We all recognize we can do more, even if in hindsight. If we want to change the situation, we have to start with us. Arm the women, with mace and whistles if you please. Teach them to say no, to think ahead. Hell, teach guys to do the same.

Why would you miss out on a chance to improve the lives of everyone and prevent a crime? We have all this education and we can't devote more of it to improving ourselves and protecting ourselves?
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So what you are insisting that all women including moi now be required to wear "the chastity belt" as a preventive measure like "the seat belt" and maybe an alarm that goes off if someone starts to grop me in a bar or something. Is that your preventive measure? Is that what women are supposed to do to protect themselves from all you men who are just so overcome by lust that the only thing you can do is rape us. Is that it? WOW! You really are a little twisted aren't you? I think I'll just keep carrying my mace. Because I can tell you this lady is not putting on a damn chastity belt just because you don't know where your cock belongs!
 
chastity belt? If that suits you. Perhaps a little on the extreme side, but I bet it would work.

How about we all agree that we can't always 'go crazy' without attracting crazy? If I had a dollar for every time a man hit on me, well . . . I did for a time.

I would rather we encourage sensible, safe decisions amongst our children, and hold everyone accountable when something happens. Women shouldn't have to be strong or sensible, I agree, but in this day and age our society calls for it. We discourage interpersonal bonding, we encourage a sensationalist lifestyle, we encourage mutual masturbation. All these things we do and then scratch our heads when somebody takes it too far. We cannot tolerate rape, and if we cannot than we must do everything reasonable to prevent it.

And, also, do you think I as a man have never woken up next to a girl I wish I hadn't?
 
Dionaea said:
Or, I have to focus on the victim to avoid a crucial piece of the puzzle from being washed away. All relationships involve two entities, at least. We need to study both, and your stubborn refusal to look at all sides of the matter really show just how 'tolerant' and 'open minded' you are.
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What do you think is that crucial piece of the puzzle?
 
Dionaea said:
Or, I have to focus on the victim to avoid a crucial piece of the puzzle from being washed away. All relationships involve two entities, at least. We need to study both, and your stubborn refusal to look at all sides of the matter really show just how 'tolerant' and 'open minded' you are.
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Rape is not a relationship--it is a crime!

And fuck that fucking rape fantasizing creep I HATE WOMEN for coming on this thread in any capacity!
 
The effect of our society, our popular media, and the long-term effects of our relatively new social values on our mentality. For both men and women. In the past 60 years we have changed American culture more than the previous 150.

If every society has its positives and negatives, what are the negatives of our own at this moment?
 
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