APP - Republican Ideology through History

[midcan5]

[Please check later posts for any updates]

Roaring Twenties, America turned inward after WWI, laissez faire economics prevail
Harding reduces taxes on the wealthy to spur growth
Three consecutive republican administrations, supply side economy, little regulation
Republicans align themselves with big business
Coolidge/Hoover presidencies, a bubble mentality ensues as wall street speculation grows
Bubble bursts, banks collapse, economy collapses
Rigid republican policy prevents creative, workable solutions
Great Depression begins - Hoover ineffective
Hoover a businessman gets advice from the wealthy and National Association of Manufacturers
Hoover does little substantive, eventually fails completely
FDR elected, first 100 days creates job programs
FDR creates strong regulatory structure, starts minimum wage at 25 cents
These are the times of radio and newspapers
FDR creates the greatest single asset for all Americans: Social Security
FDR masterfully fought WWII along with Churchill and Stalin
FDR wins three terms and is ranked by most as the greatest modern period American president
Sixty years of American exceptionalism follow FDR's presidency
Truman ends the savagery of World War II with Japan with the ultimate savagery
Truman uses UN in Korean war effort over fear of communism's spread
Truman extends New Deal and Civil rights
WWII end brings prosperity to America due to GI Bill, home growth, and durable goods growth
High tax rates continue until seventies and eighties
American corporations support the American worker with pensions and healthcare
Eisenhower ignores right wing war mongering republicans, extends civil rights
Warren court hands down ruling on public school segregation
Eisenhower continues progressivism, Vietnam involvement continues from Truman
Eisenhower's grand idea and job's program, the Interstate highway begins
Eisenhower commits to helping South Vietnam
The 'Cold War' clouds the mind of America creating an atmosphere of fear and distrust
Nixon loses to Kennedy in first TV election
Kennedy buys into ridiculous Bay of Pigs plan from Eisenhower administration
America's youth gain power prestige and purchasing power
Advertising, aka propaganda, grows as TV replaces radio
Kennedy reduces taxes for wealthy
Battle for space with Russia consumes America's resources
Blacks decide waiting any longer for equality is too long
Rosa Parks, among others, and Martin Luther King motivate a freedom movement long pass due
Camelot ends in Dallas
LBJ foolishly listens to war cries concerning domino effect and tragically involves America in Nam
LBJ advances civil rights and extended welfare so all Americans can have a little of the pie
Voter rights extended to all under Johnson Administration
Like FDR, Lyndon Baines Johnson moves America a bit closer to fairness and equality
LBJ creates the second great American accomplishment for seniors Medicare
Anti-war demonstrations change attitudes and diminish LBJ social achievements
Nixon has secret plan for ending Vietnam but paranoid personality ruins administration
Nixon opens up trade to China and negotiates with Mother Russia
Internet begins with DOD project to protect communications against Armageddon
Nixon's fear of loss and his administration misfits create Watergate
Fearing impeachment Nixon resigns, Ford takes helm
Watergate changes campaign financing regulations
Carter elected, religion enters politics
Carter inherits stagflation economy from Nixon / Ford
Carter supports Afghanistan against Russian occupation, seeds are set for growth of insurgency terrorism
CNN and the start of 24 by 7 news begins
Carter reduces taxes for wealthy and increases military spending
Iranian militants take Americans captive
Oil embargo hurts Carter but efforts at energy policy are forgotten as Reagan wins
Reagan starts the destruction of the middle class in part by making government the problem
Reagan starts destruction of regulatory agencies that eventually lead to the Great Recession of today
Reagan reduces taxes for wealthy - corporations and think tanks gain persuasive powers
Reagan or his administration realize their errors and raise taxes several times, including largest peace time tax
America becomes a debtor nation under Reagan, invades Grenada
Reagan escapes impeachment over Iran Contra
Bush Sr experiences effect of Reagan economic policies, economy collapses, real estate boom crash, S&L scandal, bailouts to rescue nation again after republican policies
Enron scandal exemplifies corporate fraud and the need for better regulatory structure
G.H.W. Bush loses to William Jefferson Clinton as Republican policies once more fail the nation
Internet commercialization grows as browsers develop and business goes online
Clinton raises taxes, economy recovers aided by millennium and Internet bubble
Clinton buys into financial nonsense, supporting NAFTA, regulatory and welfare reform
Clinton raises minimum wage and job growth continues
Armies of money and power go after Clinton on healthcare proposal, spending publicly and privately millions
Silly DADT policy implemented after republican opposition to more open policy
Clinton moves right and sells out progressive values
Monica and the meaning of 'is' fill the news and blanket real issues
Republicans with nothing else on their agenda investigate and try to impeach Clinton
Millions are spent to remove a democratically elected president
Gore wins popular vote, republicans fight Florida recount
Bush-Gore election goes to Bush as SCOTUS has moved from interpreters of law to corporate ideologues
Bush proves himself inept in all ways, but 911 attack creates fear and more war cries
Bush proves himself an incompetent leader who creates massive debt and war deaths
Clinton surplus is squandered on tax relief primarily for the wealthy
'War on Terror' clouds the mind of America creating an atmosphere of fear
Bush, as Reagan did, grows government and creates massive federal debt
Katrina incompetence represents firsthand the failure of republican governance
Loss of regulatory structure starting with Reagan and continuing with Clinton and Bush helps creates housing bubble
Bush invades Iraq based on trumped up propaganda about WMDs and scare tactics
Real estate bubble bursts over poor investments and just plain greed and stupidity on wall street and investment firms
Loss of regulatory structures again leads to economic collapse in America and the world
Great depression fears grow again after eight years of republican governance
National Association of Manufacturers and other corporations today own congress due to need for election monies
Economy collapses under Bush and bailouts are once again required during a republican administration
One in four children in America suffers hunger. Job loss and poverty increase again under republican business governance
Obama wins election for 'change' due to the total failure of Bush and the republicans
Armies of money and power again mount offensive attacking the American values of justice and fairness represented by Obama
Election loss creates powerful forces against change of status quo
Outsourcing automation and downsizing negatively affect job growth in America
Big money conservatives again fight against the workings of democracy
Republican judicial appointees mount war against voter rights and democratic government
Obama's help of GM is a financial and job saving success
Republican presidents have worst job record with the Bushs as the worst of the lot
Tea party forms supported by big money and rigid ideology
The corporatist SCOTUS decides corporations are really people
Obama attempts at bipartisanship and compromise prove impossible
Market up under Obama (30% at time of writing)
Stimulus for America helps but republicans fight against American values of sharing the pie
Obama passes Healthcare policy, keeps campaign promises on wars
America is too scared to live up to its principles of a fair trial and creates military tribunals
DADT is finally removed but Obama shows no guts as billions are squandered on Bush's tax policy that failed completely
Job numbers improve greatly from Bush but European fears and globalism affect markets
Big money fights healthcare and think tank rhetoric distorts potential cost savings
Wall street fights hard to maintain its wild west greed mentality
Mid term elections prove once again America's workers and working class don't vote in sufficient numbers
Republicans block all job bills and block Obama's nominations for public office
Obama's Libyan policy is successful with minor expenditure
Tea party ideologues try to sabotage government on dept ceiling to bring down America's elected president
Bush Jr tax policies still govern America as republicans fight for big oil and big money
Poverty in America increases as republicans fight for the wealthy and the corporations
America's credit rating is downgraded due to intransigence of republicans in congress
Republican presidential candidates kowtow to tea party and Norquist tax pledge
Wages for working Americans have been flat since Reagan with minor jump during Clinton
Election cycle begins again as focus moves back to power rather than governance
Republican governed state houses work to bring back Jim Crow and voter suppression
Republicans cheer loudly for death penalty numbers
Republican debate audience demonstrate 'compassionate conservative' was always an oxymoron
Republicans with nothing productive to do try to capsize Obama administration as they did Clinton
Only 12% of Americans think Congress is doing a good job and a majority want their own representatives removed from office
Romney moves into Flip-Flopville and Perry gains strength due to his extreme views and cowboy image
Republicans still mention taxes and regulation as economic panaceas after their proven failure
While republicans often mention freedom they are the least free politicians, ideology prevents working towards solutions
The rigid republican ideology explains their failures when given the reigns of governance
Republicans today only want power back and stand in the way of jobs and rebuilding America
America's political system, and even our court system, has moved away from practical politics that works for the people to a system that works only the politician, big money and corporations....And so it goes....

Recent: Obama's job plan will help unemployment and American states and cities rebuild, just as Roosevelt's did, but republicans again sidetrack real issues with malarkey about spending, taxes, and regulation, proving once again that the love of money is the greatest evil and the average voter has a short memory and pays little attention to results. It would seem that republicans with corporate support are still fighting Franklin Roosevelt's accomplishments and the freedoms given all by Lyndon Baines Johnson? President Obama is finally on the attack, recognizing when politics is only about power and money, and not about America, compromise is impossible.


[If anyone decides to counter this factual history please provide substantive information as evidence. Blanket statements will be considered irrelevant. Ad hominem statements are not counterpoints.]

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Hmmm no comments from the right?

 

[Crashk]

I'm surprised too. There's so much here for them to apply their skewed revisionist history to. Where's Ann Coulter when you need her?

"Sixty years of American exceptionalism follow FDR's presidency"
Pretty much says it all. It took 30 yrs of failed conservative ideology to ruin the liberal ideas that made this country great.

 

[midcan5]

I was thinking the same thing? Usually I get a one aspect rewrite or contrary history, and in the mind of the wingnut they feel all happy inside. Maybe they are waiting for Heritage Foundation, American Enterprise Institute, or the Center for Strategic and International Studies to tell them what to think? Today 50% of all made up historical reality on TV comes from conservative think tanks, why they call corporate propaganda 'thinking' is beyond me. The least they could be is honest and state near the bottom the following full disclosure comment: "We are paid for and supported by Corporate Money and thus anything we write will have a positive corporate slant. Thank you for repeating it and the check is in the mail."

"Call it Corporate America vs. We the People. Globalization vs. Mother Earth. Privatization vs. the Public Good. Wall Street vs. Main Street. Plutocracy vs. Democracy. Which side are you on?" Scott McLarty http://www.commondreams.org/view/2011/05/19-0

 

[Crashk]

Maybe they're starting to realize that they've been duped and have voted against their own self interest and the interests of a prosperous America.

Naaaa

 

[midcan5]

Addendum

The Wall Street dissenters prove again the hypocrisy and phoniness of republicans, conservatives, and blends of each ideological tag. Freedom only means freedom for markets and for corporate exploitation, when people are free, the conservative republican demeans them. Bailing out the poor is wrong, but as the last conservative republican administration and the current congress demonstrate, bailing out the rich with tax incentives is just lovely.

The republican debate audience and candidates demonstrated their rigid ideological stance, their lack of tolerance, and their heartlessness. The good part of this presentation of the real republican is the American people see them for who they really are. Freedom only means freedom for the privileged few in the republican party.

 

[Bfgrn]

Addendum

The Wall Street dissenters prove again the hypocrisy and phoniness of republicans, conservatives, and blends of each ideological tag. Freedom only means freedom for markets and for corporate exploitation, when people are free, the conservative republican demeans them. Bailing out the poor is wrong, but as the last conservative republican administration and the current congress demonstrate, bailing out the rich with tax incentives is just lovely.

The republican debate audience and candidates demonstrated their rigid ideological stance, their lack of tolerance, and their heartlessness. The good part of this presentation of the real republican is the American people see them for who they really are. Freedom only means freedom for the privileged few in the republican party.

Harry Truman summed it up back in 1948:

"Republicans approve of the American farmer, but they are willing to help him go broke. They stand four-square for the American home--but not for housing. They are strong for labor--but they are stronger for restricting labor's rights. They favor minimum wage--the smaller the minimum wage the better. They endorse educational opportunity for all--but they won't spend money for teachers or for schools. They approve of social security benefits-so much so that they took them away from almost a million people. They think modern medical care and hospitals are fine--for people who can afford them. They believe in international trade--so much so that they crippled our reciprocal trade program, and killed our International Wheat Agreement. They favor the admission of displaced persons--but only within shameful racial and religious limitations.They consider electrical power a great blessing--but only when the private power companies get their rake-off. They say TVA is wonderful--but we ought never to try it again. They condemn "cruelly high prices"--but fight to the death every effort to bring them down. They think American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire of Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it."
President Harry S. Truman

I never gave anybody hell. I just told the truth and they thought it was hell.
Harry S. Truman

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Roaring Twenties, America turned inward after WWI, laissez faire economics prevail
Harding reduces taxes on the wealthy to spur growth
Three consecutive republican administrations, supply side economy, little regulation
Republicans align themselves with big business
Coolidge/Hoover presidencies, a bubble mentality ensues as wall street speculation grows
Bubble bursts, banks collapse, economy collapses
Rigid republican policy prevents creative, workable solutions
Great Depression begins - Hoover ineffective
Hoover a businessman gets advice from the wealthy and National Association of Manufacturers
Hoover does little substantive, eventually fails completely

Hoover without question was a failure.

FDR elected, first 100 days creates job programs
FDR creates strong regulatory structure, starts minimum wage at 25 cents
These are the times of radio and newspapers
FDR creates the greatest single asset for all Americans: Social Security

Disagree, the single greatest asset for Americans was Glass Steagall. There was a reason it was put in place. To protect citizens savings from the adventures of Wall Street. More on this when appropriate. That said, Social Security as FDR created it would provide about 1/4 of the benefits we see today (inflation adjusted)

FDR masterfully fought WWII along with Churchill and Stalin

LMAO.... tell us please how FDR masterfully fought WWII. That is a severe stretch by any sense of the imagination.

FDR wins three terms and is ranked by most as the greatest modern period American president

In all that you fail to mention that the Depression lasted for almost the entire time FDR was in office?

Sixty years of American exceptionalism follow FDR's presidency
Truman ends the savagery of World War II with Japan with the ultimate savagery
Truman uses UN in Korean war effort over fear of communism's spread

That is a rather odd way of stating that Truman took us to war.... AGAIN.

Eisenhower ignores right wing war mongering republicans, extends civil rights
Warren court hands down ruling on public school segregation
Eisenhower continues progressivism, Vietnam involvement continues from Truman
Eisenhower's grand idea and job's program, the Interstate highway begins
Eisenhower commits to helping South Vietnam

addition: Eisenhower was the last fiscally responsible President. He was the last to actually LOWER the nations debt year over fiscal year.

The 'Cold War' clouds the mind of America creating an atmosphere of fear and distrust
Nixon loses to Kennedy in first TV election
Kennedy buys into ridiculous Bay of Pigs plan from Eisenhower administration
America's youth gain power prestige and purchasing power
Advertising, aka propaganda, grows as TV replaces radio
Kennedy reduces taxes for wealthy
Battle for space with Russia consumes America's resources
Blacks decide waiting any longer for equality is too long
Rosa Parks, among others, and Martin Luther King motivate a freedom movement long pass due
Camelot ends in Dallas

ok with the above... though Kennedy increased involvement of 'advisers' in Viet Nam. If you are going to mention Ike doing so, you should remain consistent. That said, after the increase, Kennedy proposed prior to his death to pull out. LBJ opposed this.

LBJ foolishly listens to war cries concerning domino effect and tragically involves America in Nam

This is just bloody revisionist. He was a strong proponent to escalation. One of the many reasons conspiracy nuts thought he had a hand in Kennedy's assassination is that he wanted the war, Kennedy did not.

LBJ advances civil rights and extended welfare so all Americans can have a little of the pie
Voter rights extended to all under Johnson Administration

ok

Like FDR, Lyndon Baines Johnson moves America a bit closer to fairness and equality

Whole lot of fairness in the draft. Equal rights to die for all.... unless of course you were a Senator's son or rich mans son etc... then you were not forced to provide yourself the opportunity to die in Johnson's war.

LBJ creates the second great American accomplishment for seniors Medicare

Currently about $60 Trillion in unfunded liabilities. Thanks LBJ!

Anti-war demonstrations change attitudes and diminish LBJ social achievements
Nixon has secret plan for ending Vietnam but paranoid personality ruins administration
Nixon opens up trade to China and negotiates with Mother Russia
Internet begins with DOD project to protect communications against Armageddon
Nixon's fear of loss and his administration misfits create Watergate
Fearing impeachment Nixon resigns, Ford takes helm
Watergate changes campaign financing regulations

ok

Carter elected, religion enters politics
Carter inherits stagflation economy from Nixon / Ford

Total and complete bullshit on the second. Stagflation took effect under Carter.

Inflation was at 5.22% when Carter took office. High, but nowhere near the double digit levels Carter left to Reagan. http://inflationdata.com/inflation/inflation_rate/historicalinflation.aspx

GDP Growth was 5.4% in 1976. http://www.bea.gov/national/index.htm#gdp

Carter supports Afghanistan against Russian occupation, seeds are set for growth of insurgency terrorism
CNN and the start of 24 by 7 news begins
Carter reduces taxes for wealthy and increases military spending
Iranian militants take Americans captive
Oil embargo hurts Carter but efforts at energy policy are forgotten as Reagan wins

addition: Carter appoints Volcker. Volcker then increases interest rates dramatically to combat out of control inflation. Carter initially allows it, then when it appears it could hurt his re-election, the push to drop rates back down. Volcker would have to wait for Reagan for his plan to be fully implemented.

Reagan starts the destruction of the middle class in part by making government the problem
Reagan starts destruction of regulatory agencies that eventually lead to the Great Recession of today

Wrong. The Middle Class was substantially better off under Reagan than Carter.

Carter began deregulation efforts. Reagan continued them, because too much regulation CAN be a hindrance to growth. This is not to say that all regulation is bad. Glass Steagall is the perfect example.... more on that later.

Reagan reduces taxes for wealthy - corporations and think tanks gain persuasive powers
Reagan or his administration realize their errors and raise taxes several times, including largest peace time tax

This is quite silly. Corporations and their execs have had great power in DC long before Reagan even stopped acting. See Kennedy, Rockefeller etc...

America becomes a debtor nation under Reagan, invades Grenada

Wrong. America became a debtor nation in 1973.

Reagan escapes impeachment over Iran Contra
Bush Sr experiences effect of Reagan economic policies, economy collapses, real estate boom crash, S&L scandal, bailouts to rescue nation again after republican policies

Revisionism again. Bush Sr. raised the income tax rates. The economy THEN went into recession.... a MILD recession. -0.2% GDP in 1991. Then the tech/internet/telecom boom began and started to pull the economy back.

Enron scandal exemplifies corporate fraud and the need for better regulatory structure

Is this out of place by accident or on purpose? The Enron scandal occurred during Clinton's tenure. It was discovered under Bush.

G.H.W. Bush loses to William Jefferson Clinton as Republican policies once more fail the nation

LMAO.... Democrats controlled the House from 1949-1994. But let me guess, they were powerless?
Democrats controlled the Senate from 1988-1994. So they had BOTH Houses of Congress under their control. THEY created the legislation under BushI. But let me guess... you think Bush controlled all policy/rules/regulations during that time.

Internet commercialization grows as browsers develop and business goes online
Clinton raises taxes, economy recovers aided by millennium and Internet bubble

LMAO... the economy SHRANK after the Clinton tax increases, just as it did under Bush. The economy didn't start taking off again until the REP led Congress forced Clinton to cut cap gains tax rates and adopt a more business friendly economy. Clinton listened and the economy benefited.

Clinton buys into financial nonsense, supporting NAFTA, regulatory and welfare reform
Clinton raises minimum wage and job growth continues

Nice try. Raising the minimum wage had nothing to do with job growth continuing. It continued due to the boom despite the minimum wage.

Armies of money and power go after Clinton on healthcare proposal, spending publicly and privately millions
Silly DADT policy implemented after republican opposition to more open policy
Clinton moves right and sells out progressive values
Monica and the meaning of 'is' fill the news and blanket real issues
Republicans with nothing else on their agenda investigate and try to impeach Clinton
Millions are spent to remove a democratically elected president

1) EVERY impeachment attempt would be against a 'democratically elected President'
2) THIS is where we revisit Glass Steagall. As it was Clinton (and the vast majority of Congress) that repealed it in 1999. This allowed the investment banks to merge with insurance companies and retail banks. Eliminating firewalls that were designed to protect consumers from the unscrupulous activity that ended up creating the financial meltdown less than a decade later.

Gore wins popular vote, republicans fight Florida recount
Bush-Gore election goes to Bush as SCOTUS has moved from interpreters of law to corporate ideologues

Revisionist. Gore did win the popular vote, but he lost the electoral vote. SCOTUS made the appropriate decision. In the 'recount' efforts that followed, they showed Bush won Florida. Hence Gore LOST. Deal with it.

Bush proves himself inept in all ways, but 911 attack creates fear and more war cries

He failed in most ways, especially fiscally. That said he did have a few positive accomplishments so saying 'in all ways', while close, is a bit inaccurate.

Bush proves himself an incompetent leader who creates massive debt and war deaths
Clinton surplus is squandered on tax relief primarily for the wealthy

There was NO SURPLUS. EVER. It was a myth created by the idiots in both parties in DC to justify spending more of our money. Not one single fiscal year did Clinton lower the nations debt. Though he gets props, along with the REP Congress, for coming damn close in 2000. ($19B deficit)

'War on Terror' clouds the mind of America creating an atmosphere of fear
Bush, as Reagan did, grows government and creates massive federal debt
Katrina incompetence represents firsthand the failure of republican governance
Loss of regulatory structure starting with Reagan and continuing with Clinton and Bush helps creates housing bubble
Bush invades Iraq based on trumped up propaganda about WMDs and scare tactics

Take a look at the numbers.... how much debt was accumulated under a Dem led Congress with Bush vs. the Rep led Congress?

Real estate bubble bursts over poor investments and just plain greed and stupidity on wall street and investment firms
Loss of regulatory structures again leads to economic collapse in America and the world

True... everyone got greedy. Wall Street, DC politicians, lenders AND borrowers. Plenty of blame to go around. But it all started with the repeal of Glass Steagall.

Great depression fears grow again after eight years of republican governance

How convenient of you to 'forget' that DEMS controlled Congress 2007-2008 under Bush.

National Association of Manufacturers and other corporations today own congress due to need for election monies
Economy collapses under Bush and bailouts are once again required during a republican administration

Which was a direct result of the repeal of Glass Steagall under Clinton.

One in four children in America suffers hunger. Job loss and poverty increase again under republican business governance

Link to your stats.

Obama wins election for 'change' due to the total failure of Bush and the republicans

Obama then continues on with most of Bush's 'failed' policies.

Armies of money and power again mount offensive attacking the American values of justice and fairness represented by Obama
Election loss creates powerful forces against change of status quo
Outsourcing automation and downsizing negatively affect job growth in America
Big money conservatives again fight against the workings of democracy

Link.....

Republican judicial appointees mount war against voter rights and democratic government

Link...

Obama's help of GM is a financial and job saving success

ROFLMAO.... yeah, great success story. Hey, can you make money if we eliminate all of your non-union stockholders and eliminate your debt and most other liabilities? You can??? You're AWESOME!

Republican presidents have worst job record with the Bushs as the worst of the lot
Tea party forms supported by big money and rigid ideology
The corporatist SCOTUS decides corporations are really people
Obama attempts at bipartisanship and compromise prove impossible

Seriously... stop.... Obama did not attempt bipartisanship. Not even close.

Market up under Obama (30% at time of writing)
Stimulus for America helps but republicans fight against American values of sharing the pie

Do explain...

Obama passes Healthcare policy, keeps campaign promises on wars
America is too scared to live up to its principles of a fair trial and creates military tribunals
DADT is finally removed but Obama shows no guts as billions are squandered on Bush's tax policy that failed completely
Job numbers improve greatly from Bush but European fears and globalism affect markets

So.... unemployment going from 7.8% when Obama took office, to the present 9.1% is 'improvement' to you?

Big money fights healthcare and think tank rhetoric distorts potential cost savings

There are no cost savings. The smoke and mirrors the idiots in DC used to 'create' the illusion of savings is already showing false.... and we haven't even gotten to the implementation of the expenses yet. Hence the thousands of exemptions to favored political friends of Obama.

Wall street fights hard to maintain its wild west greed mentality
Mid term elections prove once again America's workers and working class don't vote in sufficient numbers

No, it proves that the left's failed ideas are not welcome among working class people. Ever happen to see those voting stats that say it is the poor and elite that tend to vote Dem and the middle class that tends to support Reps?

Republicans block all job bills and block Obama's nominations for public office

LMAO... the Senate under Reid is where the bills are being blocked. The Dems block every effort of the Reps to put forth a plan.

Obama's Libyan policy is successful with minor expenditure
Tea party ideologues try to sabotage government on dept ceiling to bring down America's elected president
Bush Jr tax policies still govern America as republicans fight for big oil and big money
Poverty in America increases as republicans fight for the wealthy and the corporations

Who did Wall Street donate to in 2008? Oh yeah... predominantly OBAMA. No wonder Dodd/Frank did nothing to put the components of Glass Steagall back in place.

America's credit rating is downgraded due to intransigence of republicans in congress

Wrong. It was downgraded due to the insane levels of deficit spending the two parties continue pretending isn't a problem.

Republican presidential candidates kowtow to tea party and Norquist tax pledge
Wages for working Americans have been flat since Reagan with minor jump during Clinton
Election cycle begins again as focus moves back to power rather than governance

Obama has proven that. All he cares about is re-election, hence putting forth a bill he knew couldn't pass in a game to try and win votes.

Republican governed state houses work to bring back Jim Crow and voter suppression

Total bullshit.

Republicans cheer loudly for death penalty numbers

ROFLMAO... a couple of people cheer and suddenly it is 'Republicans'??? Yeah, please continue posting your 'facts'

Recent: Obama's job plan will help unemployment and American states and cities rebuild, just as Roosevelt's did, but republicans again sidetrack real issues with malarkey about spending, taxes, and regulation, proving once again that the love of money is the greatest evil and the average voter has a short memory and pays little attention to results. It would seem that republicans with corporate support are still fighting Franklin Roosevelt's accomplishments and the freedoms given all by Lyndon Baines Johnson? President Obama is finally on the attack, recognizing when politics is only about power and money, and not about America, compromise is impossible.

Wrong, it will do little to improve the unemployment numbers.

[If anyone decides to counter this factual history please provide substantive information as evidence. Blanket statements will be considered irrelevant. Ad hominem statements are not counterpoints.]

That is quite humorous. You ask for those countering the above with substantive information as evidence, yet we see no substantive information as evidence to support any of the mostly partisan nonsense you just posted. You state ad homs are not counterpoints, yet the above is filled with ad homs. Too funny.

 

[USFREEDOM911]

Hoover without question was a failure.



Disagree, the single greatest asset for Americans was Glass Steagall. There was a reason it was put in place. To protect citizens savings from the adventures of Wall Street. More on this when appropriate. That said, Social Security as FDR created it would provide about 1/4 of the benefits we see today (inflation adjusted)



LMAO.... tell us please how FDR masterfully fought WWII. That is a severe stretch by any sense of the imagination.



In all that you fail to mention that the Depression lasted for almost the entire time FDR was in office?



That is a rather odd way of stating that Truman took us to war.... AGAIN.



addition: Eisenhower was the last fiscally responsible President. He was the last to actually LOWER the nations debt year over fiscal year.



ok with the above... though Kennedy increased involvement of 'advisers' in Viet Nam. If you are going to mention Ike doing so, you should remain consistent. That said, after the increase, Kennedy proposed prior to his death to pull out. LBJ opposed this.



This is just bloody revisionist. He was a strong proponent to escalation. One of the many reasons conspiracy nuts thought he had a hand in Kennedy's assassination is that he wanted the war, Kennedy did not.



ok



Whole lot of fairness in the draft. Equal rights to die for all.... unless of course you were a Senator's son or rich mans son etc... then you were not forced to provide yourself the opportunity to die in Johnson's war.



Currently about $60 Trillion in unfunded liabilities. Thanks LBJ!



ok



Total and complete bullshit on the second. Stagflation took effect under Carter.

Inflation was at 5.22% when Carter took office. High, but nowhere near the double digit levels Carter left to Reagan. http://inflationdata.com/inflation/inflation_rate/historicalinflation.aspx

GDP Growth was 5.4% in 1976. http://www.bea.gov/national/index.htm#gdp



addition: Carter appoints Volcker. Volcker then increases interest rates dramatically to combat out of control inflation. Carter initially allows it, then when it appears it could hurt his re-election, the push to drop rates back down. Volcker would have to wait for Reagan for his plan to be fully implemented.



Wrong. The Middle Class was substantially better off under Reagan than Carter.

Carter began deregulation efforts. Reagan continued them, because too much regulation CAN be a hindrance to growth. This is not to say that all regulation is bad. Glass Steagall is the perfect example.... more on that later.



This is quite silly. Corporations and their execs have had great power in DC long before Reagan even stopped acting. See Kennedy, Rockefeller etc...



Wrong. America became a debtor nation in 1973.



Revisionism again. Bush Sr. raised the income tax rates. The economy THEN went into recession.... a MILD recession. -0.2% GDP in 1991. Then the tech/internet/telecom boom began and started to pull the economy back.



Is this out of place by accident or on purpose? The Enron scandal occurred during Clinton's tenure. It was discovered under Bush.



LMAO.... Democrats controlled the House from 1949-1994. But let me guess, they were powerless?
Democrats controlled the Senate from 1988-1994. So they had BOTH Houses of Congress under their control. THEY created the legislation under BushI. But let me guess... you think Bush controlled all policy/rules/regulations during that time.



LMAO... the economy SHRANK after the Clinton tax increases, just as it did under Bush. The economy didn't start taking off again until the REP led Congress forced Clinton to cut cap gains tax rates and adopt a more business friendly economy. Clinton listened and the economy benefited.



Nice try. Raising the minimum wage had nothing to do with job growth continuing. It continued due to the boom despite the minimum wage.



1) EVERY impeachment attempt would be against a 'democratically elected President'
2) THIS is where we revisit Glass Steagall. As it was Clinton (and the vast majority of Congress) that repealed it in 1999. This allowed the investment banks to merge with insurance companies and retail banks. Eliminating firewalls that were designed to protect consumers from the unscrupulous activity that ended up creating the financial meltdown less than a decade later.



Revisionist. Gore did win the popular vote, but he lost the electoral vote. SCOTUS made the appropriate decision. In the 'recount' efforts that followed, they showed Bush won Florida. Hence Gore LOST. Deal with it.



He failed in most ways, especially fiscally. That said he did have a few positive accomplishments so saying 'in all ways', while close, is a bit inaccurate.



There was NO SURPLUS. EVER. It was a myth created by the idiots in both parties in DC to justify spending more of our money. Not one single fiscal year did Clinton lower the nations debt. Though he gets props, along with the REP Congress, for coming damn close in 2000. ($19B deficit)



Take a look at the numbers.... how much debt was accumulated under a Dem led Congress with Bush vs. the Rep led Congress?



True... everyone got greedy. Wall Street, DC politicians, lenders AND borrowers. Plenty of blame to go around. But it all started with the repeal of Glass Steagall.



How convenient of you to 'forget' that DEMS controlled Congress 2007-2008 under Bush.



Which was a direct result of the repeal of Glass Steagall under Clinton.



Link to your stats.



Obama then continues on with most of Bush's 'failed' policies.



Link.....



Link...



ROFLMAO.... yeah, great success story. Hey, can you make money if we eliminate all of your non-union stockholders and eliminate your debt and most other liabilities? You can??? You're AWESOME!



Seriously... stop.... Obama did not attempt bipartisanship. Not even close.



Do explain...



So.... unemployment going from 7.8% when Obama took office, to the present 9.1% is 'improvement' to you?



There are no cost savings. The smoke and mirrors the idiots in DC used to 'create' the illusion of savings is already showing false.... and we haven't even gotten to the implementation of the expenses yet. Hence the thousands of exemptions to favored political friends of Obama.



No, it proves that the left's failed ideas are not welcome among working class people. Ever happen to see those voting stats that say it is the poor and elite that tend to vote Dem and the middle class that tends to support Reps?



LMAO... the Senate under Reid is where the bills are being blocked. The Dems block every effort of the Reps to put forth a plan.



Who did Wall Street donate to in 2008? Oh yeah... predominantly OBAMA. No wonder Dodd/Frank did nothing to put the components of Glass Steagall back in place.



Wrong. It was downgraded due to the insane levels of deficit spending the two parties continue pretending isn't a problem.



Obama has proven that. All he cares about is re-election, hence putting forth a bill he knew couldn't pass in a game to try and win votes.



Total bullshit.



ROFLMAO... a couple of people cheer and suddenly it is 'Republicans'??? Yeah, please continue posting your 'facts'



Wrong, it will do little to improve the unemployment numbers.




That is quite humorous. You ask for those countering the above with substantive information as evidence, yet we see no substantive information as evidence to support any of the mostly partisan nonsense you just posted. You state ad homs are not counterpoints, yet the above is filled with ad homs. Too funny.

"Hoover without question was a failure."

That's because nature abhors a vacuum

 

[midcan5]

Interesting, a thought out reply. I have to review later, but social security helps all people, even those in need, Glass Steagall only protects some of us. I don't have time but Reagan was horrible for America, period, and history bears that out - Clinton was better but by so little it is hard to measure. More later when I read through it. Hopefully I get at least one or two good challenges and not partisan BS. I'd like a real thought from the revisionists who have failed these past 30 years.

"....there's a growing realization that the starting point for many of the catastrophes confronting the United States today can be traced to Reagan's presidency. There's also a grudging reassessment that the "failed"- presidents of the 1970s--Richard Nixon, Gerald Ford and Jimmy Carter--may deserve more credit for trying to grapple with the problems that now beset the country." http://www.opednews.com/articles/Ronald-Reagan-Worst-Presi-by-Robert-Parry-090605-584.html

 

[Minister of Truth]

So, Carter and Clinton weren't good for America. Will Obama change this trend?

 

[midcan5]

"A people that values its privileges above its principles soon loses both." Dwight D. Eisenhower


Superfreak,

Back. Thanks for reply.

I'll stick with SS, GS was noted in my regulatory comment. But since you are for freedom, why is GS needed? I thought all we needed was freedom and nirvana followed? Did I miss some sea change? Thought you were a bit of a libertarian.

No stretch, FDR and Churchill made an excellent team. See Manchester's 'The Glory and Dream' for this and much of the 20Th century.

Depressions are bad things, you noticed. But check FDR's record of consistent improvement. http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/Timeline.htm

Truman took us to war? You must realize by now presidents are not in complete control. And yes, the involvement of the UN helped what could have been a quagmire similar to Nam or Afghanistan.

Note too that Eisenhower followed Democratic presidents and called and labelled his administration 'progressive.' Curious how republicans only do well after a democrat set the stage. The reverse is not true these past hundred years.

Vietnam involvement started long before our common knowledge admits and politics and the politics of fear make for bad policy. You have heard of the red scare? Your party used it often, I didn't even mention McCarthy.

LBJ anguished over the war in most histories I have read. But it is complex I admit, and you have to include the 'neocons' of those times in the equation. Think Iraq. Ever hear of McNamara?

Draft? I am in favor of duty to one's nation, but not sure where this entered the discussion. Let me remind you again Nam started before Johnson and bad information is bad information. Do you excuse Bush Jr? I find it especially ironic that Friedman had input into the decisions to eliminate the draft. There's that rhetorical word or is that device again: Freedom. Free to partake in our society but under no obligation to contribute in any way.

Stagflation? "Nixon confronted a series of economic problems during his presidency. By 1973 the inflation rate was 9 percent; the Dow-Jones average of industrial stocks fell 36 percent between November 1968 and May 1970; and the unemployment rate reached 6.6 percent by the end of 1970. Nixon imposed wage-price controls in 1971, but they did little good.

Factors beyond Nixon's control undermined his economic policies. In 1973 the war between Israel, Egypt and Syria prompted Saudi Arabia to impose an embargo on oil shipped to Israel's ally, the United States. Other member nations of the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) quadrupled their prices. Americans faced both shortages and rapidly rising prices. Even when the embargo ended the next year, prices remained high. Higher energy prices affected all areas of American economic life: in 1974 inflation reached 12 percent, causing disruptions that led to even higher unemployment rates. This era of recession and inflation ("stagflation") brought an end to the unprecedented economic boom America had enjoyed since 1948." http://countrystudies.us/united-states/history-126.htm

Carter's selection of Volcker and many of the policies he implemented helped Reagan. Take note again of this fact, republicans do well after democrats.

The decline of the middle class starts with Reagan, all stats demonstrate that. At first Reagan spent like a Keynesian but soon it got out of hand. I give Reagan credit for raising taxes many times and for his help with Social Security. But Reagan's destruction of unions and policies protecting worker rights put corporations in the position of power they occupy today.

Growth is another meaningless economic term. Rhetoric not substance. Growth for whom for instance.

Corporate power gained great strength under Reagan, I lived then and still live in Corporate America. Conservative judges and our congress worship at the corporate trough. See http://mitworld.mit.edu/video/827

Debtor nation. "The rate of growth in Federal spending fell from 4% under Jimmy Carter to 2.5% under Ronald Reagan. As a short-run strategy to reduce inflation and lower nominal interest rates, the U.S. borrowed both domestically and abroad to cover the Federal budget deficits, raising the national debt from $997 billion to $2.85 trillion. This led to the U.S. moving from the world's largest international creditor to the world's largest debtor nation. Reagan described the new debt as the "greatest disappointment" of his presidency." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reaganomics

Clinton raises taxes and we did fine in spite of all the crying from the right wing corporate think tank economists. The surplus he left Bush Jr could have done great things for all had greed not given it to the wealthy and two unnecessary wars.

Enron is sorta miss placed. It was unraveling for a bit before Bush but I have to check into that and outline the power of corporations in America. http://www.amazon.com/Invisible-Hands-Making-Conservative-Movement/dp/0393059308/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8

Democrats are not saints either, the period in which they controlled the house covers most of our best times. I am not going to argue that many of them today are any better than the other side of the aisle. Both are only in it for themselves, an attitude that reflects the attitude of most Americans today.

Clinton lost an opportunity to be great by moving center and listening to wall street hacks. He is part of the mess too. But he sure as hell did better than most recent republican presidents, that may have been luck as NAFTA and other nonsense is useless when it comes to helping jobs in this nation.

My point on minimum wage was life went on and armageddon didn't follow as most conservative corporate think tanks preach.

Republicans cheered? Did I misspeak? Who were these people? They even cheered death panel thinking.

Jobs are jobs and jobs make other jobs as everyone spends, that seems so simple, maybe I'll win the Noble prize in economics for that obvious idea as some of the idiocy that wins misses that simple fact. Sitting on your hands doesn't help the economy and a deteriorating America helps no one. You think I could win? Nominate me.

Thanks for your effort, I was hoping for a real challenge but none appeared. I do always go away a bit more knowledgeable. Argument is often tainted but it helps clarify.

If you need a link to something I missed or you disagree with, just ask.


"President Eisenhower describes his administration's political philosophy as 'dynamic conservatism,' then as 'progressive, dynamic conservatism,' then as 'progressive moderation,' then as 'moderate progressivism,' and then as 'positive progressivism.'" William Manchester in 'the Glory and the Dream'

 

[PostmodernProphet]

I find it interesting that this is titled a history of Republican ideology when so many of the items that are complained of begin with Kennedy did.....LBJ did.....Clinton did......

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Interesting, a thought out reply. I have to review later, but social security helps all people, even those in need, Glass Steagall only protects some of us. I don't have time but Reagan was horrible for America, period, and history bears that out - Clinton was better but by so little it is hard to measure. More later when I read through it. Hopefully I get at least one or two good challenges and not partisan BS. I'd like a real thought from the revisionists who have failed these past 30 years.

Social security helps most people. Not all. For one, not everyone contributes to SS and thus those people do not receive any benefits. It also does not help anyone who is single that dies, yet has paid into the system.

Glass Steagall protected EVERYONE. It kept retail and investment banks separate. It wasn't until it was repealed that the investment banks were able to leverage up to the extent they did in the ten years from repeal to economic meltdown. Had it not been repealed, we could have simply let the investment banks go under. It would not have reverberated through the system with anywhere near the same fury.

"....there's a growing realization that the starting point for many of the catastrophes confronting the United States today can be traced to Reagan's presidency. There's also a grudging reassessment that the "failed"- presidents of the 1970s--Richard Nixon, Gerald Ford and Jimmy Carter--may deserve more credit for trying to grapple with the problems that now beset the country." http://www.opednews.com/articles/Ronald-Reagan-Worst-Presi-by-Robert-Parry-090605-584.html

If you were looking for a truly revisionist take on history... that article you linked to is a perfect example of it. I don't have time to go through the numerous erroneous claims in it.

1) Carter refused to make tough choices, that is why other countries walked all over him. It is evident in the FACT.... and I do mean FACT, that Volcker TRIED to implement the tough choice under Carter. Carter let him for a couple of months and then Carter caved.

2) It was under Reagan that the tough choice was made. He let Volcker raise interest rates dramatically to kill Carter's stagflation. It resulted in a recession (ie... Reagan was willing to accept the pain) that cost Republicans in the Mid terms. But by the time 1984 rolled around, the public realized that Volcker's plan worked.... and Reagan got credit for allowing him to do what was necessary. Reagan also gained respect for making that tough choice.

3) As to some of your other nonsense.... the middle class was far better off under Reagan than it was under Carter. It isn't even close. Inflation, high unemployment, stagnant growth all made life miserable for the middle class.

4) As for the Carter warned us about dependency on foreign oil... yes, he did. But like other Dems, he blocked the US from producing more of its own energy resources. Carter was an absolutely horrid President. Granted he was good compared to Bush II and Obama, but still, he was horrible.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

"A people that values its privileges above its principles soon loses both." Dwight D. Eisenhower


Superfreak,

Back. Thanks for reply.

I'll stick with SS, GS was noted in my regulatory comment. But since you are for freedom, why is GS needed? I thought all we needed was freedom and nirvana followed? Did I miss some sea change? Thought you were a bit of a libertarian.

The above represents a common fault among the left. They constantly try to portray libertarians as against all regulations. That is not the case. There are some things the government does need to regulate. Glass Steagall was one of the best examples of effective regulation.

No stretch, FDR and Churchill made an excellent team. See Manchester's 'The Glory and Dream' for this and much of the 20Th century.

Depressions are bad things, you noticed. But check FDR's record of consistent improvement. http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/Timeline.htm

TEN years of a Depression. TEN years of double digit unemployment. The only thing that pulled unemployment down in the end was WWII.

As for that timeline.... many on the left like to harp about the period from 1945-1964 being the best economic boom ever. They then turn and point to FDR's policy and proclaim it was because of his policies. It was not. It was because Europe was in shambles, Japan obliterated, China irrelevant economically, Russia in tatters. Yet those same policies of FDR existed into the period of 1965-1980 and we had one of the WORST economic periods in our history. Why? Oh yeah, because we started seeing competition again.... from Europe, Russia, Japan...

Truman took us to war? You must realize by now presidents are not in complete control. And yes, the involvement of the UN helped what could have been a quagmire similar to Nam or Afghanistan.

Truman and the other allied leaders most certainly created that war. They arbitrarily decided to divide Korea (much the same way they arbitrarily gave away Israel, much the same way they divided up the Ottoman empire after WWI). Then it became a proxy war. It is funny though how you point out that Presidents are not in complete control, but then turn around and assign complete responsibility to Republican Presidents when something goes wrong.

Note too that Eisenhower followed Democratic presidents and called and labelled his administration 'progressive.' Curious how republicans only do well after a democrat set the stage. The reverse is not true these past hundred years.

There is nothing wrong with being 'progressive'... but simply calling oneself that doesn't make it true. Like many 'progressives' today that actually fight tooth and nail to maintain the status quo of systems that are obviously doomed to fail as they exist today.

You are completely wrong in your Reps only do well after Dems. That is pure nonsense. Reagan did not do better due to anything Carter did. He was in many ways the anti Carter. He took the risks Carter refused to take. He stood up against the Soviets whereas Carter was seen as weak by most foreign leaders. He brought us out of stagflation that Carter and his policies brought us. He set the stage for the tech/telecom/internet revolutions that Bush I tried to fuck up and that Clinton benefited from (though initially he too tried to fuck it up). Clinton in turn left Bush with a recession. Bush II was the mother of all fuck ups and Mr. Hope and Change is following the Bush path.

Vietnam involvement started long before our common knowledge admits and politics and the politics of fear make for bad policy. You have heard of the red scare? Your party used it often, I didn't even mention McCarthy.

Yes, involvement began long before. But it was Johnson that escalated it into a full blown War.

LBJ anguished over the war in most histories I have read. But it is complex I admit, and you have to include the 'neocons' of those times in the equation. Think Iraq. Ever hear of McNamara?

It was absolutely more complex and it was the military industrial complex that Ike warned us about that pushed it. LBJ fought Kennedy on the matter. He wanted to go in, Kennedy wanted to pull out. Yes, many Republicans were on board in Congress. I did not mean to imply it was just LBJ and the Dems. Much like Iraq.... Bush is the one that took us there, ultimately it was his call. Though the Dems were certainly complicit as well in that one.

Draft? I am in favor of duty to one's nation, but not sure where this entered the discussion. Let me remind you again Nam started before Johnson and bad information is bad information. Do you excuse Bush Jr? I find it especially ironic that Friedman had input into the decisions to eliminate the draft. There's that rhetorical word or is that device again: Freedom. Free to partake in our society but under no obligation to contribute in any way.

You mentioned how 'fair' LBJ was... I was being a bit of a smart ass on that one. Pointing to the fact that the draft was not in any way fair.

Stagflation? "Nixon confronted a series of economic problems during his presidency. By 1973 the inflation rate was 9 percent; the Dow-Jones average of industrial stocks fell 36 percent between November 1968 and May 1970; and the unemployment rate reached 6.6 percent by the end of 1970. Nixon imposed wage-price controls in 1971, but they did little good.

Factors beyond Nixon's control undermined his economic policies. In 1973 the war between Israel, Egypt and Syria prompted Saudi Arabia to impose an embargo on oil shipped to Israel's ally, the United States. Other member nations of the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) quadrupled their prices. Americans faced both shortages and rapidly rising prices. Even when the embargo ended the next year, prices remained high. Higher energy prices affected all areas of American economic life: in 1974 inflation reached 12 percent, causing disruptions that led to even higher unemployment rates. This era of recession and inflation ("stagflation") brought an end to the unprecedented economic boom America had enjoyed since 1948." http://countrystudies.us/united-states/history-126.htm

None of which changes the data I posted. Inflation was under control in Ford's last year and the economy was growing again. Period. No matter what happened under Nixon, it is complete erroneous to claim Carter inherited stagflation.

Carter's selection of Volcker and many of the policies he implemented helped Reagan. Take note again of this fact, republicans do well after democrats.

Again, complete bullshit. Carter was weak. He refused to let Volcker continue with his plan. REAGAN allowed Volcker to continue, despite the hit he would take during the recession. Due note: appointing an individual to a post is NOT enacting policy. Again, you are full of shit to state that Reps do well after Dems as some sort of result of Dem policies. Carter's policies failed by and large. His reigning in Volcker is the prime example.

The decline of the middle class starts with Reagan, all stats demonstrate that. At first Reagan spent like a Keynesian but soon it got out of hand. I give Reagan credit for raising taxes many times and for his help with Social Security. But Reagan's destruction of unions and policies protecting worker rights put corporations in the position of power they occupy today.

Again this is nonsense. The middle class rose under Reagan (as did the definition of what middle class meant). Reagan did what is needed again today. He lowered corporate tax rates and individual income tax rates and he eliminated many of the loopholes and deductions. (cleaning up the tax code).

What policies did he enact that hurt 'workers rights'?

Growth is another meaningless economic term. Rhetoric not substance. Growth for whom for instance.

Corporate power gained great strength under Reagan, I lived then and still live in Corporate America. Conservative judges and our congress worship at the corporate trough. See http://mitworld.mit.edu/video/827

Debtor nation. "The rate of growth in Federal spending fell from 4% under Jimmy Carter to 2.5% under Ronald Reagan. As a short-run strategy to reduce inflation and lower nominal interest rates, the U.S. borrowed both domestically and abroad to cover the Federal budget deficits, raising the national debt from $997 billion to $2.85 trillion. This led to the U.S. moving from the world's largest international creditor to the world's largest debtor nation. Reagan described the new debt as the "greatest disappointment" of his presidency." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reaganomics

Again with more nonsense. Corporations have had power over politicians since before Reagan was born. It is pure nonsense to claim otherwise. He did nothing to change that aspect, nor did any Dem before or after him.

The US became a debtor nation for the first time under NIXON, not Reagan. No matter how many times you claim otherwise.

Clinton raises taxes and we did fine in spite of all the crying from the right wing corporate think tank economists. The surplus he left Bush Jr could have done great things for all had greed not given it to the wealthy and two unnecessary wars.

Wrong. As soon as he raised taxes, the economy slowed. It wasn't until he cut capital gains taxes that it started growing again. Again, THERE WAS NO SURPLUS. Clinton left Bush with a recession. There is no denying that. The imaginary surplus was nothing more than projections from the CBO. Not one year did Clinton have an ACTUAL surplus. The recession he left Bush caused the 'projections' to be completely erroneous. yet both parties kept harping about these imaginary surpluses so that they could spend the money on their respective pet initiatives.

So for the final time to lefties.... THERE WAS NO SURPLUS.... Period.

Enron is sorta miss placed. It was unraveling for a bit before Bush but I have to check into that and outline the power of corporations in America. http://www.amazon.com/Invisible-Hands-Making-Conservative-Movement/dp/0393059308/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8

Almost all of the fraud occurred under Clinton. It was in early 2001 that the accounting used by Enron was called into question and the stock began to plunge.

Democrats are not saints either, the period in which they controlled the house covers most of our best times. I am not going to argue that many of them today are any better than the other side of the aisle. Both are only in it for themselves, an attitude that reflects the attitude of most Americans today.

Clinton lost an opportunity to be great by moving center and listening to wall street hacks. He is part of the mess too. But he sure as hell did better than most recent republican presidents, that may have been luck as NAFTA and other nonsense is useless when it comes to helping jobs in this nation.

Clinton was better than most recent Reps. On that I agree. Certainly better than the two Bush's, Ford and Nixon. I would put Reagan ahead of Clinton given what the two had to deal with during their tenures. Reagan had much more difficulties to face. Clinton benefited from Reagan's policies.

My point on minimum wage was life went on and armageddon didn't follow as most conservative corporate think tanks preach.

The higher minimum wage goes, the more you price unskilled workers out of the market and the more you cause wage inflation.

Republicans cheered? Did I misspeak? Who were these people? They even cheered death panel thinking.

Yes, you did. You pretend that because a few people in a crowd cheered, that labeling them as Republicans and trying to portray Republicans in general as having cheered is ok. It is not. It is a blatant distortion of the facts.

 

[midcan5]

There's no need to quote me, I know what I know and check what I don't. Imagine a martian reading A, and A says X happened at this time under this president and B saying no, nonsense. Hopefully the martian has Google, or could both A and B be correct - at least online, we'll leave the reality for a moment? In today's revisionist world in which money and the desire to paint one's party in pretty colors creates history, one can find translations of reality of all sorts. I remember when publicists first noted we were a debtor nation.

I see that several stumbling blocks will keep our positions on opposite sides but so what. You write as if Carter started the economy from scratch, he inherited a mess, it is one reason the nation moved to elect a democrat, largely unknown. Stagflation as a concept for the economy was already in use, did he work any magic, no, but neither did Reagan, the Fed worked some one time magic which later did not work. Oil prices and embargoes hurt both Nixon/Ford and Carter. Get real.

Was the economy better under Reagan for the middle class? Maybe, but I can tell you from my experience it was not. Stats below say no too. And I can provide lots of links on just how bad he was. It was the beginning of corporate downsizing and the eventual collapse of voodoo economics. This occurred even as Reagan raised taxes on us constantly. These things I witnessed and experienced - seeing many good people let go to only boost the bottom line. This continues today with outsourcing and moving manufacturing overseas.

Of course you can disagree with the article stating Reagan was asleep at the wheel, it conflicts with your mental image. Reality is made up. Yes, I too am guilty. But there is the pudding and 'It's the economy Stupid!' became the cry after Reagan/Bush. So while we see things differently there is something out that happened and it is why Clinton won.

"No matter how we cut it, the rise in the surplus during the Clinton years was truly historic. Mr. Reagan however, was unable to trim a single penny from the deficit from where it was when he began his presidency. Mr. Clinton cut the deficit every year until we had record surpluses." http://zzpat.tripod.com/graphs.htm

To your other question on how Reagan hurt workers see this article and for those interested in history check out the book. "The Reagan administration also made weakening the power of unions a top priority. The people he appointed to the National Labor Relations Board were qualitatively more pro-management than appointees by prior Democratic or Republican presidents. This allowed companies to ignore workers' rights with impunity. Reagan also made the firing of strikers an acceptable business practice when he fired striking air traffic controllers in 1981. Many large corporations quickly embraced the practice. Also, his high dollar policy in the mid-'80s was a severe blow to manufacturing unions, who suddenly had to compete against low-cost imports that were essentially subsidized by an overvalued dollar." http://www.cepr.net/index.php/op-ed...ince-1980-a-right-turn-leading-to-a-dead-end/


Superfreak wrote, "Almost all of the fraud occurred under Clinton." That line demonstrates the fantasy-land you live in and believe in. Did you miss the Saving and Loan debacle? Again for the interested reader check out baker's book in link above.

Minimum wage is just another of your bogeymen, weird how all of you have the same bogeymen, proves my points about the power corporate propaganda has on you, and the power they have in politics. Have you ever talked to an honest person about Wal-Mart and its disgusting practices? Time you did. "Not only does there seem to be widespread social fragmentation and disillusionment with democracy in the United States, but the possibility of reversing this sense of alienation appears to many of us to be already lost. Any democratic president who wants to institute the desperately needed reforms in health, welfare and the environment faces one of two options. He can stick by his reform program and suffer a loss of public confidence through orchestrated campaigns to publicly portray him as 'too liberal' and ineffectual (the Carter image) or too indecisive or sexually indiscreet (the Clinton image). Alternatively, a reforming democratic president can move further to the Right, forget his promises and become part of the propaganda campaign. Given the history of democratic propaganda in the United States, some of us doubt that another Roosevelt or New Deal is possible. The political system is now so attuned to business interests that this kind of reformer could no longer institute the substantial health, welfare, education, environmental and employment reforms the country needs." Andrew Lohrey, Introduction, Alex Carey "Taking the Risk Out of Democracy"

But I have to say when I started work in what was once the largest corporation on earth, things were different, I have had a good life and don't write for myself, if the adage about age and conservatism were true I'd be on your side but that goes against my moral upbringing.

And Republicans cheered, that is fact, to deny that is deny reality. Does the word include every known republican on the face of the earth? Doesn't matter, republicans booed a veteran and cheered death panels and executions. Skirt it, excuse it, however you like.

One element that often goes unnoticed is the power of the conservative corporate side to rail against any democrat who they see as they threat to their power and priviledge. I don't remember as much with Carter but Clinton and Obama have been attacked from the beginning. This aspect of American politics has changed greatly in my life time.

"For anyone born after 1945, the welfare state and its institutions were not a solution to earlier dilemmas: they were simply the normal conditions of life - and more than a little dull. The baby boomers, entering university in the mid sixties, had only ever known the world of improving life chances, generous medical and educational services, optimistic prospects of a upward social mobility and - perhaps above all - an indefinable but ubiquitous sense of security. The goals of an earlier generation of reformers were no longer of interest to their successors. On the contrary they were increasingly perceived as restrictions upon the self-expression and freedom of the individual." Tony Judt 'Ill Fares the Land' http://www.amazon.com/Ill-Fares-Land-Tony-Judt/dp/1594202761/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8


Taxes.

"The Reagan administration, with the help of Democrats in Congress, lowered the tax rate on the very rich to 50 percent and in 1986 a coalition of Republicans and Democrats sponsored another "tax reform" bill that lowered the top rate to 28 percent. Barlett and Steele noted that a schoolteacher, a factory worker, and a billionaire could all pay 28 percent. The idea of a "progressive" income in which the rich paid at higher rates than everyone else was now almost dead." from Howard Zinn 'A People's History of the United States"

"There is no historical evidence that tax cuts spur economic growth. The highest period of growth in U.S. history (1933-1973) also saw its highest tax rates on the rich: 70 to 91 percent. During this period, the general tax rate climbed as well, but it reached a plateau in 1969, and growth slowed down five years later. Almost all rich nations have higher general taxes than the U.S., and they are growing faster as well." Tax cuts spur economic growth
The Idolatry of Ideology-Why Tax Cuts Hurt the Economy by Russ Beaton
Spending Cuts Vs. Tax Increases at the State Level, 10/30/01
The rich get rich because of their merit.

 

[Liberty]

I find it interesting that this is titled a history of Republican ideology when so many of the items that are complained of begin with Kennedy did.....LBJ did.....Clinton did......

You mean, "you read all that?"

 

[PostmodernProphet]

You mean, "you read all that?"

yes...I think midcan was the one who didn't.....

consider some of these entries from the perspective of a chronic conservative hater like midcan.....

Eisenhower ignores right wing war mongering republicans, extends civil rights
Eisenhower continues progressivism, Vietnam involvement continues from Truman
Kennedy reduces taxes for wealthy
LBJ foolishly listens to war cries concerning domino
Carter elected, religion enters politics
Carter reduces taxes for wealthy and increases military spending
Clinton buys into financial nonsense, supporting NAFTA, regulatory and welfare reform

 

[midcan5]

yes...I think midcan was the one who didn't.....

consider some of these entries from the perspective of a chronic conservative hater like midcan.....

Eisenhower ignores right wing war mongering republicans, extends civil rights
Eisenhower continues progressivism, Vietnam involvement continues from Truman
Kennedy reduces taxes for wealthy
LBJ foolishly listens to war cries concerning domino
Carter elected, religion enters politics
Carter reduces taxes for wealthy and increases military spending
Clinton buys into financial nonsense, supporting NAFTA, regulatory and welfare reform

That's kinda impossible since I wrote it, but thanks for reading it. If it were a completely accurate - meaning if it covered the minutia and the usual key aspects covered in MSM and our politcal system - it would go on forever. My focus was the sea change from small democracy to a large democracy, large being industrial, corporate, scientific and all the baggage that change creates. Most history covers the aspects that power and prestige deign worth recording, it is why Howard Zinn is so hated by those who live their lives blind to reality.

This is great stuff for those interested in how we deceive ourselves. Trivers mp3 is worth the time. http://cdn.conversationsnetwork.org/ITC.PopTech2005-RobertTrivers-2005.10.22.mp3

http://www.amazon.com/Folly-Fools-L...tion/dp/0465027555/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8

 

[midcan5]

It often seems the republicans of today are still fighting Franklin Delano Roosevelt. Roosevelt helped make America what it is today, and his achievements are still visible and still important to our national well being, excellent review below.

"Michael Hiltzik presents a history of the New Deal. The author examines the origins of Franklin D. Roosevelt's plans to confront the nation's economic depression and the President's relationships with his inner-circle of advisors, which ranged across the social spectrum."

Cspan video provides a brief but important review. http://www.booktv.org/Program/12826/The+New+Deal+A+Modern+History.aspx

"The joy and moral stimulation of work no longer must be forgotten in the mad chase of evanescent profits, these dark days will be worth all they cost us if they teach us that our true destiny is not to be ministered unto but to minister to ourselves and our fellow men." Quote from link below

http://www.amazon.com/New-Deal-Modern-History/dp/1439154481/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8