Settling the Biological Virus Debate

[Scott]

Why does each virus have a unique sequence without overlaps with other viruses?

Think of these alleged viruses as akin to building unique structures with lego blocks, with the legos in this case being the various building blocks one tends to find in living matter. Just because you can build unique structures with legos in computer models doesn't mean that said structure ever existed in the real world, let alone having the capability of being a parasitic being.

The problem with your argument is that building blocks produced by cells are found in all cells. DNA can only produce a limited number of proteins that have an exact structure. Virus RNA is only found in diseased cells.
When a sequence of RNA is found that can't be produced by the DNA then where did it come from?

I suspect your notion that this viral RNA is unique is simply based on the fact that the de novo construction of the Cov 2 virus (that is, a computer guessing how the viruses are sequenced) is unique.

The length of the snippets are 50 - 100 bp(base pairs)
The suggestion is a million reads of snippets before assembly and ordering of base pairs.
The length of the Covid-2 virus is 30,000 bp.

With 1,000,000 different snippets that means you have roughly 75,000,0000 bp that you are looking for overlap to assemble to something that is only 30,000 bp long.
That isn't guessing. It is looking for matches and assembling them. This is a simple sorting exercise that computers can do rather quickly.

Forget about sequencing, there's no solid evidence that the Cov 2 virus has even been -isolated-, as journalist Iain Davis points out in his article, COVID19 -Evidence of Global Fraud. Quoting from it:

**
The WUHAN researchers stated that they had effectively pieced the SARS-CoV-2 genetic sequence together by matching fragments found in samples with other, previously discovered, genetic sequences. From the gathered material they found an 87.1% match with SARS coronavirus (SARS-Cov). They used de novo assembly and targeted PCR and found 29,891-base-pair which shared a 79.6% sequence match to SARS-CoV.

They had to use de novo assembly because they had no priori knowledge of the correct sequence or order of those fragments. Quite simply, the WHO’s statement that Chinese researchers isolated the virus on the 7th January is false.
**

Not isolating this alleged virus has secondary effects, something which Iain gets into in the introduction to his article:

**
COVID 19, and the subsequent governmental responses, appear to be part of an international conspiracy to commit fraud. It seems there is no evidence that a virus called SARS-CoV-2 causes a disease called COVID 19.

Sometimes you have to go with your gut. I am not an expert in genetics and, as ever, stand to be corrected. However my attention was drawn to some research published by the Spanish medical journal D-Salud-Discovery. Their advisory board of eminently qualified physicians and scientists lends further credibility to their research. Their claim is astounding.

The genetic primers and probes used in RT-PCR tests to identify SARS-CoV-2 do not target anything specific. I followed the search techniques outlined in this English translation of their report and can corroborate the accuracy of their claims about the nucleotide sequences listed in the World Health Organisations protocols. You can do the same.

D-Salud-Discovery state there are no tests capable of identifying SARS-CoV-2. Consequently, all claims about the alleged impact of COVID 19 on population health are groundless.

The entire official COVID 19 narrative is a deception. Ostensibly, there is no scientific foundation for any part of it.

If these claims are accurate we can state that there is no evidence of a pandemic, merely the illusion of one. We have suffered incalculable loss for no evident reason, other than the ambitions of unscrupulous despots who wish to transform the global economy and our society to suit their purposes.

In doing so this “parasite class” have potentially committed countless crimes. These crimes can and should be investigated and prosecuted in a court of law.
**

 

[Scott]

Not true. The difference is that we have no problem "isolating" humans. There is no solid evidence that a virus has ever been isolated. If virologists don't know where the genetic snippets they're sequencing are coming from, the notion that they're coming from viruses is a hypothesis with no scientific basis.

That's a very broad question, but I believe the following essay gives the outlines of an answer:

The Terrain Theory vs. The Germ Theory | drrobertyoung.com

As you may know, all animals, plants, fungi, and many unicellular organisms, are eukaryotes:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eukaryote

Small RNA molecules are abundant in eukaryotic nucleus:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_RNA_biology

Therefore, there are -plenty- of places where RNA can be found other than alleged viruses.

Think of these alleged viruses as akin to building unique structures with lego blocks, with the legos in this case being the various building blocks one tends to find in living matter. Just because you can build unique structures with legos in computer models doesn't mean that said structure ever existed in the real world, let alone having the capability of being a parasitic being.

A virus exists by definition, dude.

Repeating a claim without evidence doesn't make it more persuasive to anyone who believes that evidence for a claim is important.

 

[Scott]

Asking questions is fine, but that's not solid evidence that biological viruses exist, let alone proof.

Attributing diseases to alleged biological viruses without solid evidence that biological viruses exist isn't solid evidence that viruses exist.

From what I've read, there's never been any solid evidence that alleged viral diseases such as the flu or covid are contagious.

Next time you get a cold or flu, I guess you created it.

You apparently haven't considered the possibility that a cold or flu might be caused by something other than a virus. Some definitely have. I personally found Arthur Firstenberg's book The Invisible Rainbow to offer a compelling alternative to this belief.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

I extend an olive branch and you hit me with more insults -.-. I'm used to this type of thing, but it's still pretty sad. It certainly doesn't help that JPP staff member Phantasmal is cheering you on, such as when he liked your insult laden post #408. Again, it's something I'm used to, but it certainly makes me less inclined to read your full posts when you do this stuff, let alone respond to all your actual points, which I think is sad as it slows down productive discussion.

You have no argument. Saying you have no argument is not hitting you with insults. It is hitting you with the truth. The fact that you are insulted by the truth speaks volumes.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

Forget about sequencing, there's no solid evidence that the Cov 2 virus has even been -isolated-, as journalist Iain Davis points out in his article, COVID19 -Evidence of Global Fraud. Quoting from it:

**
The WUHAN researchers stated that they had effectively pieced the SARS-CoV-2 genetic sequence together by matching fragments found in samples with other, previously discovered, genetic sequences. From the gathered material they found an 87.1% match with SARS coronavirus (SARS-Cov). They used de novo assembly and targeted PCR and found 29,891-base-pair which shared a 79.6% sequence match to SARS-CoV.

They had to use de novo assembly because they had no priori knowledge of the correct sequence or order of those fragments. Quite simply, the WHO’s statement that Chinese researchers isolated the virus on the 7th January is false.
**

Not isolating this alleged virus has secondary effects, something which Iain gets into in the introduction to his article:

**
COVID 19, and the subsequent governmental responses, appear to be part of an international conspiracy to commit fraud. It seems there is no evidence that a virus called SARS-CoV-2 causes a disease called COVID 19.

Sometimes you have to go with your gut. I am not an expert in genetics and, as ever, stand to be corrected. However my attention was drawn to some research published by the Spanish medical journal D-Salud-Discovery. Their advisory board of eminently qualified physicians and scientists lends further credibility to their research. Their claim is astounding.

The genetic primers and probes used in RT-PCR tests to identify SARS-CoV-2 do not target anything specific. I followed the search techniques outlined in this English translation of their report and can corroborate the accuracy of their claims about the nucleotide sequences listed in the World Health Organisations protocols. You can do the same.

D-Salud-Discovery state there are no tests capable of identifying SARS-CoV-2. Consequently, all claims about the alleged impact of COVID 19 on population health are groundless.

The entire official COVID 19 narrative is a deception. Ostensibly, there is no scientific foundation for any part of it.

If these claims are accurate we can state that there is no evidence of a pandemic, merely the illusion of one. We have suffered incalculable loss for no evident reason, other than the ambitions of unscrupulous despots who wish to transform the global economy and our society to suit their purposes.

In doing so this “parasite class” have potentially committed countless crimes. These crimes can and should be investigated and prosecuted in a court of law.
**

You are now repeating the same ridiculous arguments over and over. Are you arguing that we have to follow Koch's postulates or not? Isolation is the requirement in Koch's postulates. Humans, worms, wombats can't be isolated. Do they not exist?
The argument that viruses don't exist because they haven't been isolated has been shown to be false. Stop repeating bullshit that has been repeatedly shown to be bullshit.
Failure to isolate is not proof something doesn't exist. Period. Full stop. Any attempt to repeat that argument on your part will be called out as bullshit.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

Repeating a claim without evidence doesn't make it more persuasive to anyone who believes that evidence for a claim is important.

Where is your proof that something can't exist unless it has been isolated? When have humans been isolated?

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

None of them were meant for Koch's postulates either. Koch's postulates were intended for microbes only. Read Wikipedia's entry on Koch's postulates yourself if you don't believe me:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koch's_postulates

Since viruses were not known at the time of Koch's postulates they also don't apply to viruses so stop trying to apply them to viruses and stop using sources that are trying to apply Koch's postulates to viruses.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

You apparently haven't considered the possibility that a cold or flu might be caused by something other than a virus. Some definitely have. I personally found Arthur Firstenberg's book The Invisible Rainbow to offer a compelling alternative to this belief.

The problem is you have not provided any valid theory that would tell us what is causing cold and flu. The virus theory fits the evidence.

Cold and flu are contagious and are passed through contact.
RNA is found in people sick that matches the RNA found in other people that are sick but that RNA isn't found in people that aren't sick.
Because the RNA is found in large quantities and appears to increase in quantity as more and more people become sick, it must be replicating in some fashion.

Denying that illnesses are contagious is denying reality.
Claiming the RNA comes from somewhere else without providing a valid explanation for its replication and increase is not a valid argument that disputes virus theory.


All you have for an argument is denial. You have no theory that meets the evidence.

 

[Phantasmal]

Since viruses were not known at the time of Koch's postulates they also don't apply to viruses so stop trying to apply them to viruses and stop using sources that are trying to apply Koch's postulates to viruses.

. You’re right!
https://journals.asm.org/doi/pdf/10.1128/cmr.9.1.18

https://www.auckland.ac.nz/en/news/...es-covid-and-misinformation-rabbit-holes.html

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5182102/

https://www.reuters.com/article/fac...-prove-the-existence-of-a-virus-idUSL2N2L23F1

 

[Scott]

I extend an olive branch and you hit me with more insults -.-. I'm used to this type of thing, but it's still pretty sad. It certainly doesn't help that JPP staff member Phantasmal is cheering you on, such as when he liked your insult laden post #408. Again, it's something I'm used to, but it certainly makes me less inclined to read your full posts when you do this stuff, let alone respond to all your actual points, which I think is sad as it slows down productive discussion.

You have no argument.

Yet another unsubstantiated assertion on your part.

Saying you have no argument is not hitting you with insults.

Agreed. Hitting me with insults is hitting me with insults.

 

[Scott]

Forget about sequencing, there's no solid evidence that the Cov 2 virus has even been -isolated-, as journalist Iain Davis points out in his article, COVID19 -Evidence of Global Fraud. Quoting from it:

**
The WUHAN researchers stated that they had effectively pieced the SARS-CoV-2 genetic sequence together by matching fragments found in samples with other, previously discovered, genetic sequences. From the gathered material they found an 87.1% match with SARS coronavirus (SARS-Cov). They used de novo assembly and targeted PCR and found 29,891-base-pair which shared a 79.6% sequence match to SARS-CoV.

They had to use de novo assembly because they had no priori knowledge of the correct sequence or order of those fragments. Quite simply, the WHO’s statement that Chinese researchers isolated the virus on the 7th January is false.
**

Not isolating this alleged virus has secondary effects, something which Iain gets into in the introduction to his article:

**
COVID 19, and the subsequent governmental responses, appear to be part of an international conspiracy to commit fraud. It seems there is no evidence that a virus called SARS-CoV-2 causes a disease called COVID 19.

Sometimes you have to go with your gut. I am not an expert in genetics and, as ever, stand to be corrected. However my attention was drawn to some research published by the Spanish medical journal D-Salud-Discovery. Their advisory board of eminently qualified physicians and scientists lends further credibility to their research. Their claim is astounding.

The genetic primers and probes used in RT-PCR tests to identify SARS-CoV-2 do not target anything specific. I followed the search techniques outlined in this English translation of their report and can corroborate the accuracy of their claims about the nucleotide sequences listed in the World Health Organisations protocols. You can do the same.

D-Salud-Discovery state there are no tests capable of identifying SARS-CoV-2. Consequently, all claims about the alleged impact of COVID 19 on population health are groundless.

The entire official COVID 19 narrative is a deception. Ostensibly, there is no scientific foundation for any part of it.

If these claims are accurate we can state that there is no evidence of a pandemic, merely the illusion of one. We have suffered incalculable loss for no evident reason, other than the ambitions of unscrupulous despots who wish to transform the global economy and our society to suit their purposes.

In doing so this “parasite class” have potentially committed countless crimes. These crimes can and should be investigated and prosecuted in a court of law.
**

You are now repeating the same ridiculous arguments over and over.

What exactly do you find "ridiculous" about them?

Are you arguing that we have to follow Koch's postulates or not?

Koch's postulates are simply a means to an end, in this case the end being providing solid evidence that viruses actually exist. The statement referenced in the opening post essentially improves on Koch's postultes, as well as providing a first step for those who would like to try to provide solid evidence that biological viruses do in fact exist.

Isolation is the requirement in Koch's postulates.

Isolation and re-isolation, to be precise. Quoting from Wikipedia:

**
Koch's four postulates are:

1. The microorganism must be found in abundance in all organisms suffering from the disease but should not be found in healthy organisms.

2. The microorganism must be isolated from a diseased organism and grown in pure culture.

3. The cultured microorganism should cause disease when introduced into a healthy organism.

4. The microorganism must be re-isolated from the inoculated, diseased experimental host and identified as being identical to the original specific causative agent.​

**

Source:
Koch's postulates | Wikipedia

Humans, worms, wombats can't be isolated.

Sure they can, and with a lot more ease as well. No petri dish and microscope required.

The argument that viruses don't exist because they haven't been isolated has been shown to be false.

I never argued that not being able to isolate viruses meant there was proof that they don't exist, but it certainly strongly -suggests- that they don't exist. Similarly, a failure to isolate (or even find) unicorns strongly suggests that they don't exist, but it isn't -proof- that they don't exist.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

Yet another unsubstantiated assertion on your part.



Agreed. Hitting me with insults is hitting me with insults.

If you have an argument then present it. I look forward to seeing one that is not based solely on denial.

Quoting others is not presenting an argument of your own. It is simply throwing shit at the wall in the hope that people won't see that you have not argument.
Calling your argument bullshit isn't hitting you with insults. It is telling the truth about your lack of a valid basis for any of your claims.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

What exactly do you find "ridiculous" about them?

What is ridiculous is that they can't explain reality better than virus theory.
What is ridiculous about them is they rely on fallacies.
What is ridiculous about them is you can't defend them with any facts or logic.

Koch's postulates are simply a means to an end, in this case the end being providing solid evidence that viruses actually exist. The statement referenced in the opening post essentially improves on Koch's postultes, as well as providing a first step for those who would like to try to provide solid evidence that biological viruses do in fact exist.

Koch's postulates apply to bacteria. Viruses are not bacteria. Humans are not bacteria. Applying Koch's postulates to anything that isn't bacteria doesn't prove that thing doesn't exist. You are using what is called a false dichotomy fallacy when you claim something doesn't exist if Koch's postulates can't be used.

Isolation and re-isolation, to be precise. Quoting from Wikipedia:

**
Koch's four postulates are:

1. The microorganism must be found in abundance in all organisms suffering from the disease but should not be found in healthy organisms.

2. The microorganism must be isolated from a diseased organism and grown in pure culture.

3. The cultured microorganism should cause disease when introduced into a healthy organism.

4. The microorganism must be re-isolated from the inoculated, diseased experimental host and identified as being identical to the original specific causative agent.​

**

Source:
Koch's postulates | Wikipedia

LOL.... Now you are back to trying to use Koch's postulates after you wanted to get away from them just a few posts ago. Using the word isolate to mean one thing and then another is the equivocation fallacy. Humans can not be isolated from a diseased organism and grown in pure culture. Viruses can not be grown in pure culture.
This is an example of you using the equivocation fallacy.

Not true. The difference is that we have no problem "isolating" humans.

Sure they can, and with a lot more ease as well. No petri dish and microscope required.

That right there violates the isolation you demand to prove viruses exist. Changing the meaning of the word isolate back and forth is ridiculous and the equivocation fallacy. Viruses have been isolated and pictures taken of them with an electron microscope. You don't get to claim humans have been isolated in violation of Koch's postulates and then argue that viruses haven't been isolated because their isolation doesn't follow Koch's postulates. Once again we see you making ridiculous arguments that are fallacies.

I never argued that not being able to isolate viruses meant there was proof that they don't exist, but it certainly strongly -suggests- that they don't exist. Similarly, a failure to isolate (or even find) unicorns strongly suggests that they don't exist, but it isn't -proof- that they don't exist.

Prove that viruses haven't been isolated. Your only response is denial. If I show a picture of a virus, you simply deny that it is one. If I show the RNA sequence of a virus, you simply deny it. You are simply being a conspiracy nut that refuses to look at facts. Posting the same shit over and over from other conspiracy nuts.

 

[Nordberg]

This is what we had before the polio vaccine was discovered. https://www.npr.org/2021/10/25/1047...-the-last-to-still-rely-on-an-iron-lung-to-br There were money drives that school kids participated in. They gave us folders with slots for dimes and quarters that we would fill and return to school. Salk saved millions from this fate with a VACCINE.

 

[Into the Night]

Repeating a claim without evidence doesn't make it more persuasive to anyone who believes that evidence for a claim is important.

I don't need evidence. A virus exists by definition.

 

[Into the Night]

You apparently haven't considered the possibility that a cold or flu might be caused by something other than a virus. Some definitely have. I personally found Arthur Firstenberg's book The Invisible Rainbow to offer a compelling alternative to this belief.

The influenza series is known.
The rhinovirus series is known.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

Coronavirus: 5G and microchip conspiracies around the world
https://www.bbc.com › news › 53191523
5G to Bolivia and beyond There's absolutely no way 5G mobile phone signals either transmit the virus or reduce our defences to it - we've debunked these claims, which scientists say are...
Coronavirus: YouTube tightens rules after David Icke 5G interview
https://www.bbc.com › news › technology-52198946
Conspiracy theories linking 5G signals to the coronavirus pandemic continue to spread despite there being no evidence the mobile phone signals pose a health risk. Fact-checking charity Full Fact...
David Icke interview resurfaces with multiple false claims about Covid ...
https://factcheck.afp.com › david-icke-interview-resurfaces-multiple-false-claims-about-covid-19
Mar 8, 2021Microscope images of exosomes and of the virus that causes Covid-19 are "exactly the same"? FALSE Early on in the video, Icke again refers to the American psychiatrist Kaufman and claims he has...
The Coronavirus, Chemtrails and 5G Connection? - David Icke
https://davidicke.com › 2020 › 07 › 26 › the-coronavirus-chemtrails-and-5g-connection
5G electromagnetic radiation can induce symptoms in people which are then apparently being misdiagnosed as Covid 19. Specifically, 5G radiation can induce the presence of something called exosomes. This presence of exosomes is apparently causing doctors to diagnose patients with the dreaded Coronavirus.
Images for 5g exosomes david icke
THE EVIL OF 5G TECHNOLOGY - David Icke - Digital Freedom PlatformYouTube tightens rules after David Icke 5G interviewCoronavirus: YouTube tightens rules after David Icke 5G interview ...WATCH BANNED DAVID ICKE 5G INTERVIEW IN FULL - TAKE THE RED PILL PEOPLE!Révélations explosives de David Icke sur la pandémie bidon et le ...David Icke: CoVid-19, 5G, Conspiracy, FULLY EXPLODEDCapitalising on Corona - David Icke and 5G Conspiracies - #2 - YouTubeDavid Icke '5G ES UN ARMA!' - YouTube
More Images for 5g exosomes david icke
David Icke's claims that 5G poisons cells, and Bill Gates plans to ...
https://www.poynter.org › ?ifcn_misinformation=david-ickes-claims-that-5g-poisons-cells-and-bill-gates-plans-to-control-population-with-an-invisible-ink
FALSE: David Icke's claims that 5G poisons cells, and Bill Gates plans to control population with an invisible ink Explanation: Second part of analysis reflecting on David Ice's interview...
5g - David Icke
https://davidicke.com › tag › 5g
With colocation, Crown Castle sees double the per site activity at 10% the incremental cost. Based on commentary from Crown Castle EVP and CFO Dan Schlanger at the Citi 2023 Communications, Media and Entertainment Conference, 2023 will be a big year from small cell densification in the U.S. market. Schlanger said Citi's Mike Rollins the company expects to bring 10,000 small cells on air this ...
David Icke, Exosomes, 5g, Andrew Kaufman, cov is supposedly a scam - reddit
https://www.reddit.com › r › conspiracy › comments › fwk08z › david_icke_exosomes_5g_andrew_kaufman_cov_is
Exosomes may very closely resemble what is being called SARS-CoV-2, but are they contagious? That was my biggest problem with his argument. Exosomes alone aren't disease-causing agents. He is sort of implying that 5G is the cause of this disease, and our cells released exosomes (in response to the environmental stressor), which is normal.
COVID-19, 5G Technology & Exosomes - Dr Nauman Shad
https://drnaumanshad.com › 2020 › 04 › 11 › covid-19-5g-technology-exosomes
A scientist's explanation given by David Icke that Covid-19 virus is actually an exosome. Part of natural immune response in the body. Exosomes, if one checks out details, are part of the toxic response system of the body. They have some structural resemblance to viruses. And they renamed them as Covid-19
Coronavirus Conspiracies 4: David Icke, 5G, COVID is fake, Biolab ...
https://illuminatiwatcher.com › coronavirus-conspiracies-4-david-icke-5g-covid-is-fake-biolab-origins-exosomes
Coronavirus Conspiracies 4: David Icke, 5G, COVID is fake, Biolab Origins & Exosomes! April 21, 2020 Isaac Weishaupt 7 Comments On today's episode of the Conspiracy Theories and Unpopular Culture podcast we take yet another dive into Coronavirus conspiracy theories!
Fact Check: Completely Bogus Claim that 5G Tech Invites Coronavirus - VOA
https://www.voanews.com › a › science-health_coronavirus-outbreak_fact-check-completely-bogus-claim-5g-tech-invites-coronavirus › 6187548.html
British ex-footballer and well-known conspiracy theorist David Icke, who once claimed the world is secretly run by shape-shifting "reptoids," gave an interview to the online London Real TV show...


https://duckduckgo.com/?q=5g+exosomes+david+icke&ia=web

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

icke is at least partially right.

5g is bad jujew.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

exosomes is the key search term here.

 

[Scott]

Repeating a claim without evidence doesn't make it more persuasive to anyone who believes that evidence for a claim is important.

Where is your proof that something can't exist unless it has been isolated?

I've never claimed that something can't exist unless it has been isolated.

When have humans been isolated?

I'm beginning to wonder if you understand why Koch's postulates were for microorganisms only. There is no need to "isolate" humans, because we can literally see what humans do with our own eyes.