There is no black & white

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Like I said, this was a waste of time to start with.

Whether Rush is the biggest jerk of all and Franken is a saint is really beside the point.

But the point seems lost on all those who seem desperate to prove my initial point.
 
KingCondanomation said:
Except in this case they were not sucking from the corporate teet but nursing it. Money was not at the root of that but rather an inability to allow something to fail in a free market - ironically enough the same free market that is accused of greed.

The root problem is that leftist thought is oriented to taxing the successful and subsidizing the failures.
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Neither does absurd mischaracterizations of "the other side" help to arrive at sane solutions. I'm a proud leftist, was against the bailout from the very beginning, said Wall Street was going to be paid back before the bailout happened, and don't believe any of ther things you think I do. Supporting the interests of money IS NOT a leftist position and it never has been .. but it is a bedrock position of the side of the political fence you sit on brother.

First, there is no such thing as a "free market." It does not exist outside of a libertarian wet dream .. and I defy you brother to demonstrate a market free of government regulation anywhere in the world. Free market = robber barons and there is history to prove that.

And my brother, it doesn't make a lot of sense to be arguing against government oversight in the face of all that's happening today. One the one hand you're angry about the bonuses and angry about "the government" all at the same time.

Additionally, quid-pro-quo in politics should surprise no one. How upset where you when republicans were the ones getting all the money from Wall Street? Did it ever occur to you then that people you were voting for were being manipulated by money? Surely you weren't unaware of the influence of money on the Republican Party.

Part of the problem of rancor is that we rarely have honest discussions .. and then there's the mirror.

There is a new awakening that is blossoming all over the world. Pure capitalism is a failure waiting to happen, and it uses a warped form of "democracy" that is defined and determined by money .. the giant gaping hole in the concept of democracy that has always existed.
 
Solitary said:
I keep reading and hoping, but the forum goers seem to insists that whatever party they back is innocent and the other side is the bastion of evil.


Come on folks, as long as we keep fighting like this we will not accomplish a damned thing. I am not talking about compromising principles. But I AM talking about arguing those principles and getting rid of the "You liberals want a nanny state" or "Bush has destroyed the country thanks to you conservative".


Increasingly, the facts of the issues are ignored in favor of bashing or blaming the other side.

Is this what it has become?
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I'll be the first to admit that the main thing I like about the Democrats is that they aren't Republicans. Whenever I say stuff like that, it's mostly just because a right-winger has annoyed me to death.
 
Solitary said:
Like I said, this was a waste of time to start with.

Whether Rush is the biggest jerk of all and Franken is a saint is really beside the point.

But the point seems lost on all those who seem desperate to prove my initial point.
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Where I differ with you is there is such a thing as black and white. There are issues that don't lend themselves to ambiguity or nebulous solutions. It takes fighters, not wimps or centrists to resolve those issues.

Additionally, what you see is the reality of Americans politics and mindthink. We aren't open free-thinking people. We live in a box. I call that box the Matrix. The rancor you see in our politics should be expected .. just as one would expect all manner of chaos and dysfuntion if you put a bunch of children in a box.

Frustration and the inability to see a way out of the box leads to dysfunction, anger, frustration, and stupidity .. which I agree with you, should be painful.
 
blackascoal said:
Where I differ with you is there is such a thing as black and white. There are issues that don't lend themselves to ambiguity or nebulous solutions. It takes fighters, not wimps or centrists to resolve those issues.

Additionally, what you see is the reality of Americans politics and mindthink. We aren't open free-thinking people. We live in a box. I call that box the Matrix. The rancor you see in our politics should be expected .. just as one would expect all manner of chaos and dysfuntion if you put a bunch of children in a box.

Frustration and the inability to see a way out of the box leads to dysfunction, anger, frustration, and stupidity .. which I agree with you, should be painful.
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Certainly there are issues that are clearer. And when it needs it, fight like hell.

But the constant bickering like children is ridiculous.
 
evince said:
THEY WORSHIP RAVING LUNATICS
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evince said:
Limbaugh
Coulter
Palin
Beck
Savage
Cheney
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Solitary said:
Come on, Desh. Yes, these are lunatics. But the left has them too.

Franken
Moore
Rhodes


Are you contending that no one from the right side ever does anything good? Are you saying that one party, unopposed, running this country is what is best for the people?

Maybe a forum aimed at political debate is not the place for this discussion. But it seems to be a pervasive phenomenon throughout our society.
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evince said:
I dont know rodes so I catn say but Franken in not insane and neither is Moore.

Now go look at the people I mentioned.

They all spout lies and have really creepy background and family histories.
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ib1yysguy said:
Franken is not the equivalent of Rush or Coulter. There's no comparison.
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This is one for the books...what an exchange....Limbaugh, Palin, Cheney and Coulter are lunatics. They lie and have creepy backgrounds and family histories.....:clap:

Al Frankin and M.Moore are the good guys....she don't even know Randy Rhodes..... Frankin the tax evader and Moore the propaganda queen (and a pig in personal hygiene area)

What entertainment....and for free too....:cof1:
 
ib1yysguy said:
Franken was a poor writer and became a senator. Rush had his dad's radio station handed ot him. That's hardly "nothing" you twat.
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LOL... I'll fly up to Seattle and meet you face to face junior if you think I have a twat. Nice try kid.
 
Epicurus said:
This thread is an amazing display of partisanship from desh. I cannot begin to fathom how someone could end up that blindly loyal to a political party.
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So sad but so true huh? We joke about it but the DNC ought to pay her for her loyalty.
 
ib1yysguy said:
Franken was a poor writer and became a senator. Rush had his dad's radio station handed ot him. That's hardly "nothing" you twat.
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Rush Limbaugh's dad had a radio station ???? Really....???

Link me up Skippy, I'd like to read all about that....if its valid that is....

Unless you're just a typical meathead talking out of his ass....
 
ib1yysguy said:
Franken was a poor writer and became a senator. Rush had his dad's radio station handed ot him. That's hardly "nothing" you twat.
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After doing a modicum a research I realize your technique. When you lie call the other person a 'twat' to try and take away from your lie.

Rush's dad had once owned the station where he started, he did not own it at the time. And to try and claim that was how he become the number one talk radio host is really a sad attempt on your part.
 
blackascoal said:
It's not just what it has become, it's what it has always been and will always be.

Conflict is the nature of politics. It is the non-viloent method of resolving critical issues, although it is not always without fierce incivility.

It's not supposed to be easy. The more difficult the issue, the harder and more contentious the politics behind it.

The right has always accepted this reality, and in fact, they thrive on it. The good news is the left is starting to figure it out, thanks to Bush, Rove, Cheney.

In politics, one argument wins, the other loses .. just as it should be.
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don't you think the chaos and disunity is manufactured through polarized misinformation channels, ie fox news, CNN,...etc?
 
tinfoil said:
don't you think the chaos and disunity is manufactured through polarized misinformation channels, ie fox news, CNN,...etc?
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No I don't.

I think they are a symptom of the chaos, not manufactuers of it.

They all play into it because yellow journalism is what people want.
 
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