Venezuela: socialism failed the people

Gosh, back 30 years ago I thought that too. But that was 30 years ago. Then I learned that there is no such thing as a conservative Democrat. There are only degrees of liberalism. And as you just did, they misrepresent what Republicans stand for.

Name one Democrat who supports a fair tax system. You can't because they all support a progressive tax system, where many pay little if any (some get "refunds" that they never paid to begin with) while a small percentage are forced to pay the bulk of the federal tax burden.

Then name one Republican who doesn't support a safety net.

Visit these pages.

http://www.ontheissues.org/House/Dan_Boren.htm

This guy has been good in the past and is a probable gubernatorial candidate: http://www.ontheissues.org/Joe_Dorman.htm

And I don’t like this guy as well but he still would have been more moderate than the dragon lady we now have: http://www.ontheissues.org/Brad_Henry.htm

And this doesn’t even show the likes of Kenneth Corn or Neil Brannon who were very fine, upstanding individuals who take a more moderate stance on things. But for whatever reasons only the candidates who align on the far ends of the political spectrum can get elected...in Oklahoma our political leaders are as far right as the coastal candidates are (normally) left. Neither is good.
 
Visit these pages.

http://www.ontheissues.org/House/Dan_Boren.htm

This guy has been good in the past and is a probable gubernatorial candidate: http://www.ontheissues.org/Joe_Dorman.htm

And I don’t like this guy as well but he still would have been more moderate than the dragon lady we now have: http://www.ontheissues.org/Brad_Henry.htm

And this doesn’t even show the likes of Kenneth Corn or Neil Brannon who were very fine, upstanding individuals who take a more moderate stance on things. But for whatever reasons only the candidates who align on the far ends of the political spectrum can get elected...in Oklahoma our political leaders are as far right as the coastal candidates are (normally) left. Neither is good.

Until the dems get off the amnesty/DACA/pro-illegal alien platform, they are no better than fucking hamas as a political entity. No one sane should ever vote for them, ever.
 
Because Venezuela was true socialism. European countries are typically a blend. Also, because many on the left pointed to Venezuela back in 2006-2008 as proof that socialism worked?

Why is Saudi Arabia committed to pumping as much oil as possible as long as it is at least $9 a barrel?
Why did thet stab their OPEC brethren in the dick?

So you stupidly think that oil prices are what dragged Venezuela into the sewer; you really are dumber than a rock. Moron.

Price of a barrel of oil: $63.82 Where did you get $9.00 you incompetent moron?

https://ycharts.com/indicators/crude_oil_spot_price
 
The US was in full blown recession in 1982.

Dear idiot, the 1982 recession was caused by the Iranian revolution and lasted a mere year and four months with GDP dropping a mere 2.7%

The '90s recession was not minor, it cost an otherwise half decent POTUS his 2nd term.

This one lasted eight months with a mere drop of -1.4%. You really are too fucking ignorant for words dumbass.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_recessions_in_the_United_States
 
I'd ask were they get this nonsense about us praising Venezuela, but I'm pretty sure I already know what feeding trough they get these biased, and brain compromising ideas from.

You didn't hear it because you're a lying liberal hyper partisan moron on steroids.

Obama Admin Praise Venezuelans After Hugo Chavez Wins Reelection - Cavuto
 
Chavez called Bush ... the devil.

"Chavez to Obama: 'I want to be your friend' - World news - Americas ...
www.nbcnews.com/id/30271562/ns/world.../chavez-obama-i-want-be-your-friend/
Apr 18, 2009 - PORT-OF-SPAIN, Trinidad — Presidents Barack Obama and Hugo Chavez, Venezuela's socialist leader, met Friday and shook hands on the sidelines of a summit of their hemisphere's democracies. Obama walked across a hotel meeting room to meet Chavez for the first time, said a senior U.S. ..."

...and supported Obamunism.

 
And what came before that but a Capitalist dictatorship that was even worse and more brutal.

It was only brutal to the Marxists trying to overthrow the Government....you know, kind of like the Marxists now locking up dissenters? Funny how you morons on the left pretend that Marxists are not as brutal as Dictators....except for the fact that people seem to be better off before.


You’re not asking the hard question of why the people of Venezuela walked away from your supply side laissez faire paradise for socializim?

Another moronic statement that suffers from a lack of facts. They didn't walk away from Laissez fair capitalism you dunce. But, you're claims are consistent with the lies and distortions we seem to get all the time from the Liberal left.

The reality is they do so because Capitalism failed their country and created an old world dictatorship where a handful of oligarchs own everything which is what conservatives want to turn our nation into. The fact that they chose another failed socioeconomic system just adds to the tragedy that is Venezuela.

I am amused that you think Capitalism equates to dictatorships. How stupid is that?

Capitalism didn't fail the Venezuelans, their politicians have you willful idiot.
 
Capitalism failed in Venezuela for the same reasons Socialism failed in Venezuela. The Nations who succeed economically have several things in common. Strong central governments with checks and balances to power a citizenry with strong respect for civil institutions.

My point being is that for every failed socialist State there’s quite a few failed Capitalist States like Ghana, Zimbabwe, Nigeria, Ecuador, Peru, etc and they fail for the same reasons.

Wrong on ALL points; but at least you are consistent in your ignorance and stupidity.
 
For the same reasons you see it failing in other places around the world. Particularly Africa. I’m no fan of socialism or command economies but I am a student of history. SF Post was a clueless post cause it’s an ideological one that doesn’t consider that people turn to alternatives to Capitalism when Capitalism fails and examples abound through history of Capitalism failing.

Let’s use the example of Capitalism failing in oil rich Venezuela. A situation that has played out in oil rich Capitalist failed States all over Africa, Asia and the ME.

An abundant resource is discovered and developed in a nation but all the wealth, revenue, and profits are funneled into the hands of a few extremely wealthy families who do no invest that wealth internally in infrastructure, education, public services, etc,. Instead that vast amount of wealth, as you sited Venezuela had, was invested abroad by the handful of kleptocrats who controlled the wealth, for their own personal profits. Coinciding with a corruption of civil institutions that prop these kleptocracies. The end result, as happened in Venezuela, and a large number of failed Capitalist States, is an unsupportable income inequality where a handful of rich and powerful own everything and the masses of people are stuck in poverty. That’s why people turn away from Capitalism in these failed and turn to alternatives like Socialism and to ignore these historical facts is just silly.

Capitalism when well regulated and supported and balanced by strong civil institutions is extraordinarily successful but when not it often fails.

Capitalist failed states all over Africa?? You are one massive clueless dunce. Meanwhile, you are making these moronic and false assertions in defense of the failed Marxism that liberals love and wish to implement here.
 
Visit these pages.

http://www.ontheissues.org/House/Dan_Boren.htm

This guy has been good in the past and is a probable gubernatorial candidate: http://www.ontheissues.org/Joe_Dorman.htm

And I don’t like this guy as well but he still would have been more moderate than the dragon lady we now have: http://www.ontheissues.org/Brad_Henry.htm

And this doesn’t even show the likes of Kenneth Corn or Neil Brannon who were very fine, upstanding individuals who take a more moderate stance on things. But for whatever reasons only the candidates who align on the far ends of the political spectrum can get elected...in Oklahoma our political leaders are as far right as the coastal candidates are (normally) left. Neither is good.

Those are state level politicians. I don't care what any state other than mine does. CA can go full commie for all I care.
 
There are so many idealistic fools in the US. China, India, Laos, Cambodia and Vietnam have found out the hard way that socialism only ever results in misery and poverty.

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Really? What about China? Their nation has seen amazing economic growth in the last 30 years far exceeding that of the Western Capitalist nations. Granted they have adopted some principles of the market economy but there is not mistaking that China is still a socialist dictatorship with a command economy.

Which is my point. This ideological non-sense on Capitalism vs Socialism is beyond stupid. There's zillions of expamples where Capitalism has failed. The Great Depression of 1929, The Bush Recession of 2008. Laissez-Faire Capitalism is every bit as much a failed economic system as Communism. Not only that we in the western capitalist nations use socialism all the time when it is to our benefit. Our national military is the second largest socialist institution in the US. Are the ideologues going to insist that we adopt a free market military (aka mercenaries)? Our education system is a socialist system because the free market has failed utterly to provide mass education for everyone that is affordable. Same with our public utilities, health and sanitation services, roads....all brought to use by that favorite of all conservative bugaboos socialism. Are you free market fundamentalist willing to walk the talk and give those up and replace them with affordable free market alternative? Y'all will probably talk a good game but probably not.

So spare me this Capitalism always works and Socialism always fails nonsense cause anyone who utters that simply doesn't know the facts are are just plain wrong. Sometimes Capitalism works and sometimes it fail. Same with Socialism. There is a time and a place for both.
 
I suspect you're not talking about the same article I like which is this one:

https://extranewsfeed.com/socialism...ialist-propaganda-w-actual-logic-de587c1a299a

And I liked it because of the way the author broke down socialism into logic premises.
Well this is from that article:

In 1992, Zimbabwe — a capitalist country — watched as its manufacturing output dropped by half, dragging real wages with it. After cutting social spending, privatizing public infrastructure, & opening their markets to foreign capital, Zimbabwe’s inflation skyrocketed while growth stagnated. By ’98, their economy went into free fall & their*currency devalued by over 80%.By 2002,*60–70% were under the poverty line, life expectancy dropped to 37 years, interest rates ran at 70%, & millions could no longer afford to eat.

According to the reactionaries’ own argument, capitalism must also be considered a bad economic idea since the logic also applies to Zimbabwe’s economic crisis, as you can see below.



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Really? What about China? Their nation has seen amazing economic growth in the last 30 years far exceeding that of the Western Capitalist nations. Granted they have adopted some principles of the market economy but there is not mistaking that China is still a socialist dictatorship with a command economy.

Which is my point. This ideological non-sense on Capitalism vs Socialism is beyond stupid. There's zillions of expamples where Capitalism has failed. The Great Depression of 1929, The Bush Recession of 2008. Laissez-Faire Capitalism is every bit as much a failed economic system as Communism. Not only that we in the western capitalist nations use socialism all the time when it is to our benefit. Our national military is the second largest socialist institution in the US. Are the ideologues going to insist that we adopt a free market military (aka mercenaries)? Our education system is a socialist system because the free market has failed utterly to provide mass education for everyone that is affordable. Same with our public utilities, health and sanitation services, roads....all brought to use by that favorite of all conservative bugaboos socialism. Are you free market fundamentalist willing to walk the talk and give those up and replace them with affordable free market alternative? Y'all will probably talk a good game but probably not.

So spare me this Capitalism always works and Socialism always fails nonsense cause anyone who utters that simply doesn't know the facts are are just plain wrong. Sometimes Capitalism works and sometimes it fail. Same with Socialism. There is a time and a place for both.
The government is authoritarian and Communist in name only, the economy itself is red in tooth and claw capitalism. Socialism works until they run out of money which always happens without fail.

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Really? What about China? Their nation has seen amazing economic growth in the last 30 years far exceeding that of the Western Capitalist nations. Granted they have adopted some principles of the market economy but there is not mistaking that China is still a socialist dictatorship with a command economy.

Which is my point. This ideological non-sense on Capitalism vs Socialism is beyond stupid. There's zillions of expamples where Capitalism has failed. The Great Depression of 1929, The Bush Recession of 2008. Laissez-Faire Capitalism is every bit as much a failed economic system as Communism. Not only that we in the western capitalist nations use socialism all the time when it is to our benefit. Our national military is the second largest socialist institution in the US. Are the ideologues going to insist that we adopt a free market military (aka mercenaries)? Our education system is a socialist system because the free market has failed utterly to provide mass education for everyone that is affordable. Same with our public utilities, health and sanitation services, roads....all brought to use by that favorite of all conservative bugaboos socialism. Are you free market fundamentalist willing to walk the talk and give those up and replace them with affordable free market alternative? Y'all will probably talk a good game but probably not.

So spare me this Capitalism always works and Socialism always fails nonsense cause anyone who utters that simply doesn't know the facts are are just plain wrong. Sometimes Capitalism works and sometimes it fail. Same with Socialism. There is a time and a place for both.

Dude, China a command economy? China opened up their markets in the '70's and it's been go time ever since. It's the fastest growing economy in the world. If it was caused by a command economy you can be damn sure socialists would be all over it. They have state sponsored capitalism.
 
Dude, China a command economy? China opened up their markets in the '70's and it's been go time ever since. It's the fastest growing economy in the world. If it was caused by a command economy you can be damn sure socialists would be all over it. They have state sponsored capitalism.

I mean holy shit , even the People's Liberation Army run companies, using prisoners as labour. Huawei, now the biggest telecoms equipment company in the world, was started by a former PLA engineer who used army resources to build the company.

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Really? What about China? Their nation has seen amazing economic growth in the last 30 years far exceeding that of the Western Capitalist nations. Granted they have adopted some principles of the market economy but there is not mistaking that China is still a socialist dictatorship with a command economy.

Which is my point. This ideological non-sense on Capitalism vs Socialism is beyond stupid. There's zillions of expamples where Capitalism has failed. The Great Depression of 1929, The Bush Recession of 2008. Laissez-Faire Capitalism is every bit as much a failed economic system as Communism. Not only that we in the western capitalist nations use socialism all the time when it is to our benefit. Our national military is the second largest socialist institution in the US. Are the ideologues going to insist that we adopt a free market military (aka mercenaries)? Our education system is a socialist system because the free market has failed utterly to provide mass education for everyone that is affordable. Same with our public utilities, health and sanitation services, roads....all brought to use by that favorite of all conservative bugaboos socialism. Are you free market fundamentalist willing to walk the talk and give those up and replace them with affordable free market alternative? Y'all will probably talk a good game but probably not.

So spare me this Capitalism always works and Socialism always fails nonsense cause anyone who utters that simply doesn't know the facts are are just plain wrong. Sometimes Capitalism works and sometimes it fail. Same with Socialism. There is a time and a place for both.
Surely you are not this dense.

:mott:
 
I suspect you're not talking about the same article I like which is this one:

https://extranewsfeed.com/socialism...ialist-propaganda-w-actual-logic-de587c1a299a

And I liked it because of the way the author broke down socialism into logic premises.

I think that most Americans confuse socialism with social democracy. One of first things Tony Blair did when he was elected in 1997 was to remove the notorious Clause 4. This is in essence the heart of true socialism, do you agree?

To secure for the workers by hand or by brain the full fruits of their industry and the most equitable distribution thereof that may be possible upon the basis of the common ownership of the means of production, distribution, and exchange, and the best obtainable system of popular administration and control of each industry or service.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ion-what-is-all-the-fuss-about-reinstating-it

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The government is authoritarian and Communist in name only, the economy itself is red in tooth and claw capitalism. Socialism works until they run out of money which always happens without fail.

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That’s just not true. China has adopted elements of market economies but there is no arguing that China’s economy is still a command economy driven by central planning of the Communist Party. The evidence to that affect is overwhelming.
 
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