What Thomas Jefferson learned from the Muslim book of jihad

uscitizen said:
Umm I did not write the data I posted from the link. talk to the authors.
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I'm not questioning the authors or the accuracy of the entry; I agree with it. The use of the word "or" means that a "deist" can believe in Christ. And, since many of the Founders believed in Christ, as evidenced by their writings, then they coud have been both deists as well as Christians who did not follow a particular church.

Either way the Old Testament God and the teachings of Jesus influenced their lives, and this is reflected in the Declaration of Independence and to a lesser extent, the Constitution.
 
Southern Man said:
I'm not questioning the authors or the accuracy of the entry; I agree with it. The use of the word "or" means that a "deist" can believe in Christ. And, since many of the Founders believed in Christ, as evidenced by their writings, then they coud have been both deists as well as Christians who did not follow a particular church.

Either way the Old Testament God and the teachings of Jesus influenced their lives, and this is reflected in the Declaration of Independence and to a lesser extent, the Constitution.
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yep it influenced the constitution to the effect that the only real reference is for the govt to stay out of the god business.
 
uscitizen said:
yep it influenced the constitution to the effect that the only real reference is for the govt to stay out of the god business.
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The main influence is that they recognized that God created all men equal, and that He did not create government. Therefore government should be created by men to serve men. And that government shall not establish a religion. This is all consistent with Christ's teachings, and in direct opposition to the English belief that God gave power to the King.
 
Southern Man said:
I'm quite sure that there are Christians that think that.
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That would be impossible to believe both. The very idea of Christ coming to Earth to forgive your sins would be very untenable to support from a God that is not actively participating.
 
Southern Man said:
The main influence is that they recognized that God created all men equal, and that He did not create government. Therefore government should be created by men to serve men. And that government shall not establish a religion. This is all consistent with Christ's teachings, and in direct opposition to the English belief that God gave power to the King.
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But most christian churches now teach that god has consecrated all governments. And they refer to romans 13, to support this conclusion. What do you think of that?
 
Damocles said:
That would be impossible to believe both. The very idea of Christ coming to Earth to forgive your sins would be very untenable to support from a God that is not actively participating.
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Not really. Active participation to most would mean day by day, and on an individual basis. Many believe that God is less active to a wide variation in degree.


This is consistent with the Wiki article which states that deists "tend to assert that God does not interfere with human life and the laws of the universe."
 
Southern Man said:
Not really. Active participation to most would mean day by day, and on an individual basis. Many believe that God is less active to a wide variation in degree.


This is consistent with the Wiki article which states that deists "tend to assert that God does not interfere with human life and the laws of the universe."
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That's because deists want to assume the powers of the allegedly distant god, and work as his proxy with his authority.
 
AssHatZombie said:
But most christian churches now teach that god has consecrated all governments. And they refer to romans 13, to support this conclusion. What do you think of that?
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Most? Not mine and I'm Catholic. Maybe you can give a specific example, but I don't think that you can use the term "most".

With regards to Romans 13, I’ll quote from Mary Ann Getty in the Catholic Study Bible (Oxford Press, 1990).
 
Southern Man said:
Most? Not mine and I'm Catholic. Maybe you can give a specific example, but I don't think that you can use the term "most".

With regards to Romans 13, I’ll quote from Mary Ann Getty in the Catholic Study Bible (Oxford Press, 1990).
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Ask your priest if god sometimes sanctions revolutions against the government. See what he says.
 
AssHatZombie said:
Ask your priest if god sometimes sanctions revolutions against the government. See what he says.
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My priest does not represent my entire set of beliefs. Nor does my church. They provide guidance when I am otherwise lost.

Did you understand the passage from Getty?
 
Southern Man said:
Not really. Active participation to most would mean day by day, and on an individual basis. Many believe that God is less active to a wide variation in degree.


This is consistent with the Wiki article which states that deists "tend to assert that God does not interfere with human life and the laws of the universe."
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Thomas Jefferson wrote his own version of the New Testament removing all mention that Christ was a Deity at all, his belief system could not reasonably be described as Christian in the fact he did not believe that Christ was God or the fulfillment of a prophesy.
 
Southern Man said:
My priest does not represent my entire set of beliefs. Nor does my church. They provide guidance when I am otherwise lost.

Did you understand the passage from Getty?
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Didn't read it. Romans 13 is being used rightfull or wrongfully used as a tool of manipulation. It will be recited to christians as they are led into the New World Order globalist totalitarianism.
 
Damocles said:
Thomas Jefferson wrote his own version of the New Testament removing all mention that Christ was a Deity at all, his belief system could not reasonably be described as Christian in the fact he did not believe that Christ was God or the fulfillment of a prophesy.
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right so no way he could be a christian.
 
Damocles said:
Thomas Jefferson wrote his own version of the New Testament removing all mention that Christ was a Deity at all, his belief system could not reasonably be described as Christian in the fact he did not believe that Christ was God or the fulfillment of a prophesy.
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That was after he lost his faith, and well after he wrote the DOI.
 
AssHatZombie said:
Didn't read it. Romans 13 is being used rightfull or wrongfully used as a tool of manipulation. It will be recited to christians as they are led into the New World Order globalist totalitarianism.
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You asked my opinion and I gave you it, then ignored it. This is noted for future reference.
 
Southern Man said:
I looked to my study Bible for guidance; I reviewed it and agree with Getty's opinion, then offered it for your consideration.
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And what is that opinion? Can you just say it real quick instead of making me read other crap. Can't you simply state your own beliefs?
 
Southern Man said:
That was after he lost his faith, and well after he wrote the DOI.
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It was a culmination of a lifetime of belief. It was part of what made Jefferson. There was a constant argument among those who knew him and in the papers of the time that talked about whether or not he was a Christian. It is ridiculous to ignore history and say that "that was after he lost his faith". It was part of what he was and is a large portion of what he used to define himself.
 
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