Who can explain the logic of God?

[Cypress]

Could be

Or we can’t detect the life out there yet


It’s why being compassionate is so important to man kinds development


So we don’t end our selves


Be very wary of those who trash compassion

I would like us to recreate life in laboratory conditions on Earth, before I declare that life must certainly be abundant in the galaxy.

We have spent 70 years in the lab trying to recreate the conditions where inert organic chemicals self-organize themselves into infinitely complex, reproducing cellular life.

While there are some good educated guesses and indirect clues floating around out there, abiogenesis is still largely a mystery.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

I would like us to recreate life in laboratory conditions on Earth, before I declare that life must certainly be abundant in the galaxy.

We have spent 70 years in the lab trying to recreate the conditions where inert organic chemicals self-organize themselves into infinitely complex, reproducing cellular life.

While there are some good educated guesses and indirect clues floating around out there, abiogenesis is still largely a mystery.

Creating life in a laboratory with experiments conducted in a 100 cubic feet over 70 years will take a long time to match just the earth alone with 8E+22 cubic feet over a billion years let alone the entire universe. I don't suspect we will have a scientific breakthrough in creating life any time soon.

The problem is even if we manage to create life in a lab we will never be able to know if that is the way life originated on this planet or any other planet.

 

[saltydancin]

Creating life in a laboratory with experiments conducted in a 100 cubic feet over 70 years will take a long time to match just the earth alone with 8E+22 cubic feet over a billion years let alone the entire universe. I don't suspect we will have a scientific breakthrough in creating life any time soon.

The problem is even if we manage to create life in a lab we will never be able to know if that is the way life originated on this planet or any other planet.

Statistical probability of an abiogenesis creation applied to that Islam fabricated medical human reproduction pseudoscience virgin Mary misnomer resulting in an immaculate son of Allah Jesus the Christ conception after 600 + years as survival of the fittest fascists Peter Principle pyramid scheme for suicidal super egos in sociopsychopathilogical homicidal human farming seems to be the current ongoing inorganic life scientific experiment standard.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Creating life in a laboratory with experiments conducted in a 100 cubic feet over 70 years will take a long time to match just the earth alone with 8E+22 cubic feet over a billion years let alone the entire universe. I don't suspect we will have a scientific breakthrough in creating life any time soon.

The problem is even if we manage to create life in a lab we will never be able to know if that is the way life originated on this planet or any other planet.

If life is found on other plants with James Webb**, the answer largely answered. If nothing is found, it's a great curiosity. https://www.jwst.nasa.gov/

https://www.nasa.gov/feature/ames/webb-exoplanet-research/
How NASA in Silicon Valley Will Use Webb to Study Distant Worlds
NASA's James Webb Space Telescope is getting ready to give us the best view yet of worlds beyond our own solar system, commonly known as exoplanets. Scientists at NASA's Ames Research Center in California's Silicon Valley will be among the first to observe the cosmos with Webb, and they’re looking for clues about how exoplanets form, what they're made of, and whether any could be potentially habitable.



**The Telescope That Could Likely Detect a Bumblebee on the Moon Is Almost Complete

 

[Ross Dolan]

My take on the question, "Is there at least one god...or are there no gods?"

I do not know if any GOD (or gods) exist or not;
I see no reason to suspect that gods cannot exist…that the existence of a GOD or gods is impossible;
I see no reason to suspect that at least one GOD must exist...that the existence of at least one GOD is needed to explain existence;
I do not see enough unambiguous evidence upon which to base a meaningful guess in either direction on whether any gods exist or not...so I don't.

(When I use the word "GOD or gods" here, I mean "The entity (or entities) responsible for the creation of what we humans call 'the physical universe'...IF SUCH AN ENTITY OR ENTITIES ACTUALLY EXIST.)

 

[Cypress]

Creating life in a laboratory with experiments conducted in a 100 cubic feet over 70 years will take a long time to match just the earth alone with 8E+22 cubic feet over a billion years let alone the entire universe. I don't suspect we will have a scientific breakthrough in creating life any time soon.

The problem is even if we manage to create life in a lab we will never be able to know if that is the way life originated on this planet or any other planet.

We have fossil evidence of complex cellular life, specifically prokaryotes and archae, from almost as soon as the Earth became habitable, after the heavy bombardment phase.

It didn't take a billion years.

What is remarkable to me is how rapidly cellular life did establish here, geologically speaking.

What we don't have is any evidence of the initial and intermediate steps for how life self-organized itself out of the inert organic chemical soup.

This isn't a bible thumper question I am highlighting. This is a great scientific question; it is what makes science fun.


What I am saying is that before I convince myself that it must be easy for complex life to develop anywhere there is a habitable planet, I would like to have better confidence in the conditions and processes for how life self-organized and formed here from simple inert chemicals.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

We have fossil evidence of complex cellular life, specifically prokaryotes and archae, from almost as soon as the Earth became habitable, after the heavy bombardment phase.

It didn't take a billion years.

What is remarkable to me is how rapidly cellular life did establish here, geologically speaking.

What we don't have is any evidence of the initial and intermediate steps for how life self-organized itself out of the inert organic chemical soup.

This isn't a bible thumper question I am highlighting. This is a great scientific question; it is what makes science fun.


What I am saying is that before I convince myself that it must be easy for complex life to develop anywhere there is a habitable planet, I would like to have better confidence in the conditions and processes for how life self-organized and formed here from simple inert chemicals.

Little green men paid a visit and dumped their waste before leaving?

 

[Cypress]

Little green men paid a visit and dumped their waste before leaving?

Even the world's best scientists say there are two possibilities

1) The chemical and physical processes that kick start life are inevitable and life should be ubiquitous in the galaxy.

2) Or the origin of complex cellular life on earth was due to random chance, and it took a series of highly improbable chemical and physical events to go from inert chemicals to self replicating cellular life.


If we can remotely detect evidence of life by analyzing the atmospheric chemistry of exoplanets, that might be good enough for me.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Even the world's best scientists say there are two possibilities

1) The chemical and physical processes that kick start life are inevitable and life should be ubiquitous in the galaxy.

2) Or the origin of complex cellular life on earth was due to random chance, and it took a series of highly improbable chemical and physical events to go from inert chemicals to self replicating cellular life.


If we can remotely detect evidence of life by analyzing the atmospheric chemistry of exoplanets, that might be good enough for me.

Those are two good theories. Theory #1 is proving Fermi's Paradox.

Theory #2 could still be applied to the little green man theory since their origin would be questioned. As Carl Sagan famously said, "we're made of star stuff", remnants of Population II stars that became Population I stars like the Sun: https://www.astronomynotes.com/ismnotes/s9.htm

Any little green men would have to originate from a Population I star just like the Sun. The Sun is about 4.6B years old and the oldest Pop I stars are 10B years old leaving plenty of time for other civilizations to evolve and develop interstellar flight capability to visit a primitive Earth and take a dump.


Galaxy facts: https://www.space.com/19915-milky-way-galaxy.html

Sun facts: https://www.space.com/58-the-sun-formation-facts-and-characteristics.html

 

[Cypress]

Those are two good theories. Theory #1 is proving Fermi's Paradox.

Theory #2 could still be applied to the little green man theory since their origin would be questioned. As Carl Sagan famously said, "we're made of star stuff", remnants of Population II stars that became Population I stars like the Sun: https://www.astronomynotes.com/ismnotes/s9.htm

Any little green men would have to originate from a Population I star just like the Sun. The Sun is about 4.6B years old and the oldest Pop I stars are 10B years old leaving plenty of time for other civilizations to evolve and develop interstellar flight capability to visit a primitive Earth and take a dump.


Galaxy facts: https://www.space.com/19915-milky-way-galaxy.html

Sun facts: https://www.space.com/58-the-sun-formation-facts-and-characteristics.html

I've never liked the theory that Earth's cellular life came from some other planet. That doesn't really explain how cellular life got kick started in the first place, it just transfers the question to another planet.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

I've never liked the theory that Earth's cellular life came from some other planet. That doesn't really explain how cellular life got kick started in the first place, it just transfers the question to another planet.

Correct. All an extraterrestrial origin of life would solve is the timeline you mentioned. The relatively "sudden" appearance of life on Earth. If Option#1 was correct, then it would be found elsewhere such as on Mars or signs of intelligence in radioastronomy. Nada.

An extraterrestrial origin of life not only answers the timeline question but conforms to Option#2; life is still rare but the Earth lucked out in an encounter with a civilization from an older Population I star.

On the side, have you heard the theory that life in our solar system originated on Mars? https://www.space.com/22577-earth-life-from-mars-theory.html

Earth Life Likely Came from Mars, Study Suggests
We may all be Martians.

Evidence is building that Earth life originated on Mars and was brought to this planet aboard a meteorite, said biochemist Steven Benner of The Westheimer Institute for Science and Technology in Florida.

An oxidized form of the element molybdenum, which may have been crucial to the origin of life, was likely available on the Red Planet's surface long ago, but unavailable on Earth, said Benner, who presented his findings today (Aug. 28; Aug. 29 local time) at the annual Goldschmidt geochemistry conference in Florence, Italy. [The Search for Life on Mars (Photo Timeline)]

 

[Cypress]

Correct. All an extraterrestrial origin of life would solve is the timeline you mentioned. The relatively "sudden" appearance of life on Earth. If Option#1 was correct, then it would be found elsewhere such as on Mars or signs of intelligence in radioastronomy. Nada.

An extraterrestrial origin of life not only answers the timeline question but conforms to Option#2; life is still rare but the Earth lucked out in an encounter with a civilization from an older Population I star.

On the side, have you heard the theory that life in our solar system originated on Mars? https://www.space.com/22577-earth-life-from-mars-theory.html

Earth Life Likely Came from Mars, Study Suggests
We may all be Martians.

Evidence is building that Earth life originated on Mars and was brought to this planet aboard a meteorite, said biochemist Steven Benner of The Westheimer Institute for Science and Technology in Florida.

An oxidized form of the element molybdenum, which may have been crucial to the origin of life, was likely available on the Red Planet's surface long ago, but unavailable on Earth, said Benner, who presented his findings today (Aug. 28; Aug. 29 local time) at the annual Goldschmidt geochemistry conference in Florence, Italy. [The Search for Life on Mars (Photo Timeline)]

Good point, your right, it would go a long way in explaining the rather strange "sudden" appearance of complex cellular life as soon as earth was inhabitable.

On the other hand, the theory of punctuated equilibrium suggests rapid bursts of evolution can occur between long periods of stability and equilibrium.

The Cambrian explosion suggests that after two billion years of single-celled life, complex multicellular animals exploded onto the scene in only about 20 million years around 560 million years ago.

 

[Lao Tse]

Who can explain the logic of an allegedly omniopotent and all-loving God creating a universe where,
looking at it from the human perspective alone,
such an incredibly tiny percentage of people live really well?

The very few who do live well must do so with the help of service industry people
obviously not living well because they work so hard for so little.

That's just humans. Forget about zebras and giraffes born to die in a lion's jaws.

I was raised as a lukewarm "wedding and funeral Catholic," and even that was long gone by puberty. Maturing minds learn to think, or they are supposed to, anyway.
And fundamentalist evangelicals make Catholics look almost sane (unless they're named Pat Buchanan or Rick Santorum).
I couldn't even imagine what that must be like.
How does one get through life totally devoid of logic?
And yet so many do. I can't imagine what it must be like to be inside their heads. Thank "God" for that.

we would get better results if we followed gods advice.

 

[Lao Tse]

That doesn't make sense, because this is what he actually wrote:



That sounds like he is talking about the tiny fraction of , upper economic elites.

Your mind has been confused by modernity and propaganda about what happiness actually is.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Good point, your right, it would go a long way in explaining the rather strange "sudden" appearance of complex cellular life as soon as earth was inhabitable.

On the other hand, the theory of punctuated equilibrium suggests rapid bursts of evolution can occur between long periods of stability and equilibrium.

The Cambrian explosion suggests that after two billion years of single-celled life, complex multicellular animals exploded onto the scene in only about 20 million years around 560 million years ago.

Once started, like throwing out seeds, either life takes or it doesn't. It took, for whatever reason.

Let's not forget that mankind is very egocentric. Galileo famously took a hit for declaring Earth is not the center of the Universe.

It's important that life started, otherwise we wouldn't be here, but it's not important where life started first...that's more of a matter of curiosity.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

we would get better results if we followed gods advice.

What is "gods advice"? Which gods and what advice?

 

[Lao Tse]

What is "gods advice"? Which gods and what advice?

don't lie.

don't steal.

don't murder.

temper your passions.
gluttony, lust, avarice, anger, sloth, sadness, vainglory and pride.

all of them.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

don't lie.

don't steal.

don't murder.

temper your passions.
gluttony, lust, avarice, anger, sloth, sadness, vainglory and pride.

all of them.

You lie all the time, Fredo. Shouldn't you be working on yourself in the eyes of God rather than showing your ass to God by flaunting the very rules you quoted?

 

[Cypress]

Once started, like throwing out seeds, either life takes or it doesn't. It took, for whatever reason.

Let's not forget that mankind is very egocentric. Galileo famously took a hit for declaring Earth is not the center of the Universe.

It's important that life started, otherwise we wouldn't be here, but it's not important where life started first...that's more of a matter of curiosity.

It is a matter of curiosity, but I think that characterization does a bit of a disservice.

I would rank the origin of life as one of the greatest scientific questions in human history.

 

[Lao Tse]

You lie all the time, Fredo. Shouldn't you be working on yourself in the eyes of God rather than showing your ass to God by flaunting the very rules you quoted?

What did i lie about?