Why Do Churches Not Have to Pay Taxes?

Actually, I did not say that they could choose who to give money to...rather, I said that the fact that they are paying taxes would make them a powerful force in politics. The Catholic Church (again as an example) is one of the wealthiest organisations in the world, and taxing them in America would certainly increase government revenue.

However, that would influence politicians to keep in mind Catholic viewpoints, the same way that a politician from Detroit would have the auto industry in mind as he voted on particular issues...the taxes pay the politicians bills, and if Christianity ended up paying taxes it would give them a certain level of financial control. True, it wouldn't be overt control, but it would exist.
 
gonzojournals said:
Actually, I did not say that they could choose who to give money to...rather, I said that the fact that they are paying taxes would make them a powerful force in politics. The Catholic Church (again as an example) is one of the wealthiest organisations in the world, and taxing them in America would certainly increase government revenue.

However, that would influence politicians to keep in mind Catholic viewpoints, the same way that a politician from Detroit would have the auto industry in mind as he voted on particular issues...the taxes pay the politicians bills, and if Christianity ended up paying taxes it would give them a certain level of financial control. True, it wouldn't be overt control, but it would exist.
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Gonzojournals please stop trying to backtrack. You said that if churches were not tax exempt then they would be paying money to specific politicians to influence their votes...

Tax Money is NOT lobbyist money. Tax money cannot be redistributed to a certain person. Your lame explanation would mean that any individual that pays taxes would have undo influence on every politician as we all "pay a part of their salaries"

No your explanation is just bullshit.

CK
 
CanadianKid said:
Gonzojournals please stop trying to backtrack. You said that if churches were not tax exempt then they would be paying money to specific politicians to influence their votes...

Tax Money is NOT lobbyist money. Tax money cannot be redistributed to a certain person. Your lame explanation would mean that any individual that pays taxes would have undo influence on every politician as we all "pay a part of their salaries"

No your explanation is just bullshit.

CK
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*Sigh* If you say so....say, can you tell me why tobacco is still legal even though much less carcinogenic things have been banned in the US?

Couldn't be the fact that the government makes massive amounts of money from cigarette taxes, could it?
 
uscitizen said:
I think in my county there are more churches than convenience stores...
Not sure what that has to do with this but thought I would throw in that there is no shortage of churches.
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Ever been to an inner-city? As Chuck D said 'liquor store and church on every corner'.
 
gonzojournals said:
*Sigh* If you say so....say, can you tell me why tobacco is still legal even though much less carcinogenic things have been banned in the US?

Couldn't be the fact that the government makes massive amounts of money from cigarette taxes, could it?
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Don't trip gonzo, dude is just flaming. Rational arguments do not work with those whose aspire to flame.
 
gonzojournals said:
*Sigh* If you say so....say, can you tell me why tobacco is still legal even though much less carcinogenic things have been banned in the US?

Couldn't be the fact that the government makes massive amounts of money from cigarette taxes, could it?
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"Rational Argument by Gonzo" = Churches give money to politicians who give them back political favours and tax exemptions....


"Rational Argument by CK" = Church tax money cannot be redistributed to certain people, it is in a giant pool and therefore politicians who are paid their salaries are not getting it directly from churches.... So therefore the absurd notion that churches can buy off politicians if they do pay taxes is a red herring....

CK
 
CanadianKid said:
"Rational Argument by Gonzo" = Churches give money to politicians who give them back political favours and tax exemptions....


"Rational Argument by CK" = Church tax money cannot be redistributed to certain people, it is in a giant pool and therefore politicians who are paid their salaries are not getting it directly from churches.... So therefore the absurd notion that churches can buy off politicians if they do pay taxes is a red herring....

CK
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Of course, becuase no one here said they could buy off politicians. What I said was that the amount of money coming from churches would give the churches some indirect political weight.
 
CanadianKid said:
"Rational Argument by CK" = Church tax money cannot be redistributed to certain people, it is in a giant pool and therefore politicians who are paid their salaries are not getting it directly from churches.... So therefore the absurd notion that churches can buy off politicians if they do pay taxes is a red herring....

CK
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They make laws for special groups all the time. Collecting tax from churches is a dangerous slouch toward theocracy.
 
gonzojournals said:
Of course, becuase no one here said they could buy off politicians. What I said was that the amount of money coming from churches would give the churches some indirect political weight.
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Thats a false argument .... or as Topspin likes to call it a straw man....

Everybody pays taxes... Therefore using your analogy politicians are beholden to all of us....

CK
 
CanadianKid said:
Thats a false argument .... or as Topspin likes to call it a straw man....

Everybody pays taxes... Therefore using your analogy politicians are beholden to all of us....

CK
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But the fact is they can pass laws that can and do favor regions, corprations, or individuals, in a myriad of ways.
 
CanadianKid said:
I think NOT forcing churches to pay taxes is a theocracy...

Why do churches get special exemptions? What makes them so special?

CK
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WHen the government is enriched from churches, they will pass pro-church policy. Just like their enrichment from corporations causes them to pass pro corporate laws, despite what's good for others. It is simple.
 
CanadianKid said:
Thats a false argument .... or as Topspin likes to call it a straw man....

Everybody pays taxes... Therefore using your analogy politicians are beholden to all of us....

CK
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Yeah, they are....dumbass.

Not only that, but churches paying taxes would give them the same sort of tax-paying power as corporations--- and I think we all know that the corporations' interests are looked after.
 
AssHatZombie said:
WHen the government is enriched from churches, they will pass pro-church policy. Just like their enrichment from corporations causes them to pass pro corporate laws, despite what's good for others. It is simple.
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The government already gives them the biggest exemption you can have.... NO TAXES!

I dunno what else you want?

CK
 
gonzojournals said:
Yeah, they are....dumbass.

Not only that, but churches paying taxes would give them the same sort of tax-paying power as corporations--- and I think we all know that the corporations' interests are looked after.
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You guys are mistaken the difference between taxes and lobbyist money...

Lobbyist money and fundraisers is what gives the corporations sway over politicians.

It is not the taxes....Like I constantly explain taxes go into a general pool....Therefore everybody pays into it. And there is no way to tell if Chevron tax money is going to a politician. Therefore that is a false argument.

CK
 
CanadianKid said:
You guys are mistaken the difference between taxes and lobbyist money...

Lobbyist money and fundraisers is what gives the corporations sway over politicians.

It is not the taxes....Like I constantly explain taxes go into a general pool....Therefore everybody pays into it. And there is no way to tell if Chevron tax money is going to a politician. Therefore that is a false argument.

CK
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No, you are still not getting it. The AMOUNT of money that the churches would pay would be the influence.
 
CanadianKid said:
The government already gives them the biggest exemption you can have.... NO TAXES!

I dunno what else you want?

CK
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But if the government profitted from churches, they would be incented to make the churches larger and stronger. Just think for one second, you imbecile. You've been needing to be put in your place for some time now. Your lucky day is here. Step back.
 
leaningright said:
There have been some very good reasons stated here in answer to the original post. I would only add that most "churches" are not the mega-ministries you see and hear about on TV. Most have moderate buildings and pay their preacher a meager salary. The average salary for most preachers around here is about $25 - 30 thousand per year. I make about $8000 per year myself. We have to pay taxes on that money. Also, most contribute a great portion back to the congregation. I give back $2000 per year. The rest of what is contributed goes to mission work and charity. Usually when a congregation seeks to do a building upgrade it asks for more contributions from its members and they ante up so as not to have to diminish the congregations missionary and charitable work.

The best reasons stated above were by gonzo and Threedee.
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Exactly. I feel like an idiot here, an atheist arguing for tax exemption. But most churches simply couldn't survive without tax exemption, and what you'd get in taxes from them anyway would be so meager it would be a joke. It'd be like robbing the poor.

Our society has a reasonable interest in giving tax exemption to religious, spiritual, or even just philosophical organization. Ever heard of Unitarian-Universalism? Anyone of any religion can join. 20% of the members of the church are atheists. Many Bhuddist temples practice philosophies which are practically Godless. Just because most atheists choose not to attend such centers doesn't mean they're being discriminated against.
 
CanadianKid said:
If you saw Larry King last night they started interviewing these mega pastors with their private jets...beachfront mansions....and $50,000 a weekend shopping sprees for the wives....

Must be a good life to be a pastor...

CK
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Just in a few of the churches....
As leaning said most make little. A fully ordained full time Methodist minister starts at 46K I think, that is within a few thousand. And their insurance and retirement comes out of that money. So they get less. that is what the chruch pays to the methodist Church and they pay the preacher.

and that is with a 4 years seminary degree at Asbury or somesuch. Part time student preachers who are legally ordained but not degreed get about 25K I think.
 
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