a monopoly on force

WinterBorn said:
200 guys with 5000 bullets each and excellent cover against 50,000 guys trying to run across and open lawn?

50,000 guys with 20 bullets each charging en masse across an open lawn against trained markmen with good cover? 200 men with 5000 rounds each comes to 1 million rounds available. Its called suicide.
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I agree, but for the 200.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
the smart ones, and there will be plenty, will already have brought their own weapons. It then becomes a damn huge firefight except, unlike Waco, we'll have them surrounded this time.



there is a simple word for what those actions would be......catalyst.
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It would indeed be a catalyst. It would mobilize both sides.

The problem with the scenario here is that the revolutionaries must surprise the gov't. Doing that with 3 million people will be impossible.

Even if the attack started well, since there was no warning the standing military would be unaware of the reasons behind the revolt. So when the White House called in air strikes on the armed attack the military would do it.





I ma not happy with our current gov't. I have not been happy with the federal gov't for many years.

But a suicide attack on DC would only result in dead patriots and military law until the rest of the freedom loving armed population was rounded up.
 
Southern Man said:
We can't expect a limey to understand our blood-lust for freedom.
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Ah, yes.

The world has always admired the freedom inherent in America since it broke away from the tyranny of the British Empire.

Remind me again when America abolished slavery?
 
WinterBorn said:
It would indeed be a catalyst. It would mobilize both sides.

The problem with the scenario here is that the revolutionaries must surprise the gov't. Doing that with 3 million people will be impossible.

Even if the attack started well, since there was no warning the standing military would be unaware of the reasons behind the revolt. So when the White House called in air strikes on the armed attack the military would do it.





I ma not happy with our current gov't. I have not been happy with the federal gov't for many years.

But a suicide attack on DC would only result in dead patriots and military law until the rest of the freedom loving armed population was rounded up.
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All the revolutionaries will not arrive from outside the city. The people of the city itself will all come to consciousness at the same moment, and simply all converge on the capitol. It's highly possible, and will most likely happen.
 
Southern Man said:
I agree, but for the 200.
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Have you ever tried to fire a gun at a full run? Have you ever faced fire from automatic weapons? Bravado is great but it fades out pretty quickly.

50,000 men charging the White House. Blistering fire comes at them. If 1% hesitate then you have 500 men clogging the way. If each man who hesitates slows down two men behind him you now have 1,500 slow moving targets for trained marksmen at known distances.

And if by some miracle they get across the lawn they are now faced with bullet proof windows and reenforced walls.
 
charver said:
Ah, yes.

The world has always admired the freedom inherent in America since it broke away from the tyranny of the British Empire.

Remind me again when America abolished slavery?
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The Republican Party abolished the Democrat Party's institution of Slavery on December 6, 1865, after an eight decade long debate which finally came to an all out war.:pke:
 
AssHatZombie said:
All the revolutionaries will not arrive from outside the city. The people of the city itself will all come to consciousness at the same moment, and simply all converge on the capitol. It's highly possible, and will most likely happen.
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Huh? In DC? Half the city if part of the gov't and the other half lives off tourism and taxes.

If you are waiting for the to start it you are gonna be waiting a while.
 
WinterBorn said:
Have you ever tried to fire a gun at a full run? Have you ever faced fire from automatic weapons? Bravado is great but it fades out pretty quickly.

50,000 men charging the White House. Blistering fire comes at them. If 1% hesitate then you have 500 men clogging the way. If each man who hesitates slows down two men behind him you now have 1,500 slow moving targets for trained marksmen at known distances.

And if by some miracle they get across the lawn they are now faced with bullet proof windows and reenforced walls.
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You're a Torry; I don't expect you to understand or have any desire to divulge my tactics. :)
 
So once the revolution occurs, and that is obviously now a given, how long before the counter-revolution gets under way in earnest?

That part will be most entertaining, i'll wager.
 
WinterBorn said:
200 guys with 5000 bullets each and excellent cover against 50,000 guys trying to run across and open lawn?

50,000 guys with 20 bullets each charging en masse across an open lawn against trained markmen with good cover? 200 men with 5000 rounds each comes to 1 million rounds available. Its called suicide.
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I can see you've never served in the military, therefore your ignorance surrounding military and combat strategy is to be expected. FYI, there might be alot of stupid people who think that charging across the yard is the best course of action and we who are more tactically inclined call these people 'fodder'. Those of us with more experience will use these to mark our targets and provide better cover fire. It's a pretty simple concept, really.
 
WinterBorn said:
Even if the attack started well, since there was no warning the standing military would be unaware of the reasons behind the revolt. So when the White House called in air strikes on the armed attack the military would do it.
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I'm sorry, are you suggesting that the 'white house' would call in an airstrike on the white house? :rolleyes:

WinterBorn said:
But a suicide attack on DC would only result in dead patriots and military law until the rest of the freedom loving armed population was rounded up.
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and you still fail to see the resulting consequences from this type of action?
 
Southern Man said:
You're a Torry; I don't expect you to understand or have any desire to divulge my tactics. :)
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No need to divulge tactics.

But two simple question can be answered without giving away the secrets of the revolution.

Have you ever tried to fire a weapon while running?

Have you ever faced fire from automatic weapons?
 
charver said:
Ah, yes.

The world has always admired the freedom inherent in America since it broke away from the tyranny of the British Empire.

Remind me again when America abolished slavery?
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1808 the African Slave Trade ended in America. That is 1 year after Wilburforce saw his hard work come to fruition in England. Sadly it was another 57 years before the practice of domestic slavery ended after a very long and bloody civil war.

The laws in England as late as 1828 however created a loophole that allowed the slave trade to continue see: Two Slaves (1828) 2 Hag Adm 273, 166 ER 244 (HC Admir), per Sir Christopher Robinson; The Adelaide (1829) 2 Hag Adm 230, 166 ER 228 (HC Admir), per Sir Christopher Robinson; The Slave, Fanny Ford (1829) 2 Hag Adm 271, 166 ER 243 (HC Admir), per Sir Christopher Robinson; Three Slaves (1832) 2 Hag Adm 412, 166 ER 294 (HC Admir), per Sir Christopher Robinson; The Slave, Duncan (1832) 2 Hag Adm 427, 166 ER 299 (HC Admir), per Sir Christopher Robinson.
 
charver said:
So once the revolution occurs, and that is obviously now a given, how long before the counter-revolution gets under way in earnest?

That part will be most entertaining, i'll wager.
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Didn't we just go through an entire discussion, including showing Winterborn as an example, of how the vast majority are unwilling to trade their lives for a political cause? What makes you think that those "sheep" who refused to rise up as Patriots would suddenly rise up against the Patriots?
 
WinterBorn said:
No need to divulge tactics.

But two simple question can be answered without giving away the secrets of the revolution.

Have you ever tried to fire a weapon while running?

Have you ever faced fire from automatic weapons?
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I've never driven an armored truck up the white house steps and through the door either, but if called to do so could so easily. :)
 
Ice Dancer said:
1808 the African Slave Trade ended in America. That is 1 year after Wilburforce saw his hard work come to fruition in England. Sadly it was another 57 years before the practice of domestic slavery ended after a very long and bloody civil war.

The laws in England as late as 1828 however created a loophole that allowed the slave trade to continue see:
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I can hear all those black fellows cheering "freedom" right now, can't you?
 
SmarterThanYou said:
I'm sorry, are you suggesting that the 'white house' would call in an airstrike on the white house? :rolleyes:


and you still fail to see the resulting consequences from this type of action?
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Yes I could see the White House calling in an air strike on the White House lawn. If they thought the president was threatened they would certainly use military force.



I see the consequences. The revolution would have 1% of the population. The opposition would have 50% of the population (49% would just be sheep).

But the media would be the key. How they report the events would make the difference.



Suppose the revolution does manage to overrun congress and even take over the White House. The Secret Service would have the president out of the building before it was taken, so Obama would still be in power.

Have you seen the way the media reports on Obama? Do you think the newscasters would be talking about a revolution for freedom or would they be talking about racists and militia nutballs?

Within hours Obama will be declaring martial law. Now all freedoms are gone. Now movement of people, supplies and weapons are extremely difficult. Now phone taps, email taps and covert surveillance is in full force.

Now the man you claim is dangerous has complete control. Anything congress says will be dismissed as words from hostages under duress.




Waco and Ruby Ridge became rallying points after the smoke cleared and time passed allowing the truth to come out.

While it was going on it was reported as dangerous cults and militant survivalists.
 
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