Alexis de Tocqueville: Democracy and Christianity

Good. You admit I never used the word "Nazism."

Was Hitler a Nazi?
Did you claim in this thread that Hitler and Christianity were bedfellows?
Have you not, with every fiber of your being, tried to link Christianity with Hitler, Fascism and Nazis in this thread?


This thread was about Tocqueville and his detached historical analysis.

I am not going to indulge your desire to link Christian thought to Hitler, Nazis, and fascism.
 
Was Hitler a Nazi?
Did you claim in this thread that Hitler and Christianity were bedfellows?
Have you not, with every fiber of your being, tried to link Christianity with Hitler, Fascism and Nazis?


This thread was about Tocqueville and his detached historical analysis.

I am not going to indulge your desire to link Christian thought to Hitler, Nazis, and fascism.

More childish lying. I said "fascism," not "nazism."

Are you here to proselytize? That seems to be your intention. Don't post on a public forum if you do not want a critical discussion.
 
My point is that religion is arbitrary. You stated you have no interest in discussing Christian beliefs. So there is no reason for the state to allow people to violate law based on belief.

There is a good reason for the state to allow people to violate law based on belief--it is the 1st Amendment.

The Supreme Court guidelines on those cases say a person/group can only be exempted from that law if it will cause no harm. It causes no harm to exempt students from saying the pledge, for example, but it will cause harm to allow a person to exceed the speed limit. A religious group drinking hallucinogenic tea (hoasca) causes no harm but exempting students from getting a vaccination to attend school could cause harm. Covering up the slogan "Live Free or Die" on the NH license plate causes no harm because the identifying numbers are still available.
 
More childish lying. I said "fascism," not "nazism."

Are you here to proselytize? That seems to be your intention. Don't post on a public forum if you do not want a critical discussion.
Lot of backpedaling going on there.

So now you are denying you explicitly tried to link Christianity to Hitler and the Nazis, even though you wrote posts about it in this thread less than 24 hours ago.
 
Then makes my point that religion is lawless and subjective.

Then don't practice it. But others should be free to do so under our constitutional rights. Many of our other freedoms are arbitrary and subjective--your political beliefs, your free speech, press, and assembly.

Religion is subjective but not lawless since people cannot violate any laws harmful to others.

Do you think government should be able to require students to pledge allegiance if it violates their religious beliefs? What if it violates their political beliefs? Same principle but two different rights.
 
Being a Catholic on paper doesn't count. Hitler used Catholicism opportunistically for political purposes.

Hitler, Goebbels, Himmler do not strike me as church-going pious men.

Many dictators made the church and military allies as a way to maintain support (Latin America).
 
Many dictators made the church and military allies as a way to maintain support (Latin America).

Any institution has people who can be corrupted or are willing to aid and abett crimes. Franco was able to find Catholic priests to support his dictatorship. The Soviet Kremlin was able to find Orthox bishops they could bend to their will.

The principled priests who would not collaborate were generally sent to the Gulag.
 
You don't know what I believe and the thread is about what Alexis de Tocqueville believes.

One cannot discuss the history of western civilization without taking into account Christianity.

Can you explain exactly why you get upset when I post anything having to do with Christianity,
but you never get upset when I post anything about Buddhism, Hinduism, Atheism, Animism, B'ahia, Sikhism, Daoism, or Confucianism?

What exactly is the reason?


You seem to think Christianity is a positive influence. The opposite of dogmatic religions is Logic & Reason, something I feel is a positive influence.
'Christians' had the reins for a thousand years, usually referred to as the Dark Ages, until the Age of Enlightenment finally came along.
The dogmatic religions insist whatever their Holy Books say is Absolute Truth and NOT to be questioned. OPPOSITE from Logic & Reason.
You seem to be a intelligent person, I'm baffled by your love affair with everything 'Christian'. I'm guessing you were brainwashed as a child and have never gotten over it.

"The Age of Enlightenment (also known as the Age of Reason or simply the Enlightenment)[note 2] was an intellectual and philosophical movement that dominated the world of ideas in Europe during the 17th and 18th centuries.[2] The Enlightenment included a range of ideas centered on the pursuit of happiness, sovereignty of reason, and the evidence of the senses as the primary sources of knowledge and advanced ideals such as liberty, progress, toleration, fraternity, constitutional government, and separation of church and state.[3][4]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment

The Church was the original Book Burners. Like ISIS of today, they would kill you if you held a different view than that which was 'God's View'. Meaning 'Thinking was frowned upon'.
 
You seem to think Christianity is a positive influence. The opposite of dogmatic religions is Logic & Reason, something I feel is a positive influence.
'Christians' had the reins for a thousand years, usually referred to as the Dark Ages, until the Age of Enlightenment finally came along.
The dogmatic religions insist whatever their Holy Books say is Absolute Truth and NOT to be questioned. OPPOSITE from Logic & Reason.
You seem to be a intelligent person, I'm baffled by your love affair with everything 'Christian'. I'm guessing you were brainwashed as a child and have never gotten over it.

"The Age of Enlightenment (also known as the Age of Reason or simply the Enlightenment)[note 2] was an intellectual and philosophical movement that dominated the world of ideas in Europe during the 17th and 18th centuries.[2] The Enlightenment included a range of ideas centered on the pursuit of happiness, sovereignty of reason, and the evidence of the senses as the primary sources of knowledge and advanced ideals such as liberty, progress, toleration, fraternity, constitutional government, and separation of church and state.[3][4]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment

The Church was the original Book Burners. Like ISIS of today, they would kill you if you held a different view than that which was 'God's View'. Meaning 'Thinking was frowned upon'.
millions of people have been killed in the name of atheism, religion, capitalism, imperialism, nationalism, etc.

But you failed to explain why you only get upset when I post anything with Christianity in it,

but go quiet as a church mouse when I post threads about Hinduism, Animism, Sikhism, Atheism, Buddhism, B'haii, etcm
 
millions of people have been killed in the name of atheism, religion, capitalism, imperialism, nationalism, etc.

But you failed to explain why you only get upset when I post anything with Christianity in it,

but go quiet as a church mouse when I post threads about Hinduism, Animism, Sikhism, Atheism, Buddhism, B'haii, etcm

Cypress: "millions of people have been killed in the name of atheism, religion, capitalism, imperialism, nationalism, etc."
Jack: Yep. Not really an endorsement of 'Religion' is it.

Cypress: "But you failed to explain why you only get upset when I post anything with Christianity in it"
Jack: 'Upset' is a bit harsh. 'Disagree' is more like it.

Cypress: "but go quiet as a church mouse when I post threads about Hinduism, Animism, Sikhism, Atheism, Buddhism, B'haii, etcm"
Jack: I'm not that familiar with other religions. I would assume they are like Christianity, what was 'True' then is 'true' now. 'Knowledge', 'Learning', 'Understanding', ... STOPPED thousands of years ago.

I disagree with your support, promotion, and constant adoration of a Religion that is laced with Magic and the Occult ... and promotes a Slave Mentality. The philosophical teachings of Christianity is false.
Did you 'turn the other cheek' when bin Laden took down the Twin Towers? With 3,000 Americans killed did you 'forgive your trespassers'?
 
You seem to think Christianity is a positive influence. The opposite of dogmatic religions is Logic & Reason, something I feel is a positive influence.
'Christians' had the reins for a thousand years, usually referred to as the Dark Ages, until the Age of Enlightenment finally came along.
The dogmatic religions insist whatever their Holy Books say is Absolute Truth and NOT to be questioned. OPPOSITE from Logic & Reason.
You seem to be a intelligent person, I'm baffled by your love affair with everything 'Christian'. I'm guessing you were brainwashed as a child and have never gotten over it.

"The Age of Enlightenment (also known as the Age of Reason or simply the Enlightenment)[note 2] was an intellectual and philosophical movement that dominated the world of ideas in Europe during the 17th and 18th centuries.[2] The Enlightenment included a range of ideas centered on the pursuit of happiness, sovereignty of reason, and the evidence of the senses as the primary sources of knowledge and advanced ideals such as liberty, progress, toleration, fraternity, constitutional government, and separation of church and state.[3][4]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment

The Church was the original Book Burners. Like ISIS of today, they would kill you if you held a different view than that which was 'God's View'. Meaning 'Thinking was frowned upon'.

I think Cypress has some intelligence. But he is also incredibly naive.
 
I disagree with your support, promotion, and constant adoration of a Religion that is laced with Magic and the Occult ... and promotes a Slave Mentality. The philosophical teachings of Christianity is false.
Did you 'turn the other cheek' when bin Laden took down the Twin Towers? With 3,000 Americans killed did you 'forgive your trespassers'?

Agree with everything you said.

I suspect Cypress would be happier on a religion website so he can talk with other believers.
 
I think Cypress has some intelligence. But he is also incredibly naive.

I think he was brainwashed as a child and is unable to view the Reality all around him. Also, some people love them some Magic.
(he probably really gets into 'drinking the Blood of Christ')
 
I think he was brainwashed as a child and is unable to view the Reality all around him. Also, some people love them some Magic.
(he probably really gets into 'drinking the Blood of Christ')

He seems to be in shock when people do not agree with 100% of what he writes.
 
Cypress: "millions of people have been killed in the name of atheism, religion, capitalism, imperialism, nationalism, etc."
Jack: Yep. Not really an endorsement of 'Religion' is it.

Cypress: "But you failed to explain why you only get upset when I post anything with Christianity in it"
Jack: 'Upset' is a bit harsh. 'Disagree' is more like it.

Cypress: "but go quiet as a church mouse when I post threads about Hinduism, Animism, Sikhism, Atheism, Buddhism, B'haii, etcm"
Jack: I'm not that familiar with other religions. I would assume they are like Christianity, what was 'True' then is 'true' now. 'Knowledge', 'Learning', 'Understanding', ... STOPPED thousands of years ago.

I disagree with your support, promotion, and constant adoration of a Religion that is laced with Magic and the Occult ... and promotes a Slave Mentality. The philosophical teachings of Christianity is false.
Did you 'turn the other cheek' when bin Laden took down the Twin Towers? With 3,000 Americans killed did you 'forgive your trespassers'?
You can use google to find all the downside and crimes commmitted in the name of other world religions too, but you studiously avoid doing so.

Why do we not just acknowledge what we both know is true, but which you are studiously avoiding acknowledging?

You present yourself as a detached and rational-thinking, anti-religious person,

When in fact you are really just an anti-Christian zealot with a deeply emotional grudge against Christianity.

I am not responsible for the bible thumper church you were dragged to as a kid, or whatever the psychological reason is for your anti-Christian zealotry.


I am just interested in the history of western civilization which neccessarily requires thinking about politics, culture, religion, and economics -- and I generally touch on all these topics, when historical topics come up.
 
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