An argument about the ineffectiveness of legal gun control

Solitary said:
So you want this under the premise that I must prove my innocence on an annual basis?

No, that is not an acceptable idea. That is based on assumption that I am only remaining as a law-abiding citizen so long as there are regular checks to prove it.
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No, this is based on the premise that we don't want crazy fuckers with guns, a premise I thought you said you agreed with.
 
Dungheap said:
No, this is based on the premise that we don't want crazy fuckers with guns, a premise I thought you said you agreed with.
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I do agree with that premise. But there are only three ways we will know if they are crazy fuckers.

#1 - They do something crazy and kill people. The registration was a moot point.

#2 - They get professional help. The therapist is obligated to notify law enforcement if they feel their patient is a threat. Again, the registration is a moot point.

#3 - Their family gets involved. And I would think the first thing the family would do is remove any firearms.





If someone does start slipping over the edge and going crazy. What exactly do you think the registration would do? Will there be a "Sanity Test" administered by some bureacrat upon annual renewal?
 
Dungheap said:
No, this is based on the premise that we don't want crazy fuckers with guns, a premise I thought you said you agreed with.
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I am curious, lets say that we do institute a registration that we renew annually.

How would you see that as a way to prevent someone who owned guns and then later went crazy from using them?
 
Onceler said:
I wouldn't say that they are ineffective due to that one example.

I think reasonable Americans can agree that people who have, say, convictions for violent felony should not be allowed to purchase a gun, and that a background check is warranted & not excessive.
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And I would say that someone with a violent felony is not going to purchase a gun through WalMart or any other authorized fire arms dealer. My bet is he will buy one of the tens of thousands that can be legally purchased on the street in every state in the US. If I was so inclined I could within the next hour find a gun for sale and never deal with anyone that had anything to do with a FFL. Further, waiting periods are unneccesary. THe technology exists now to make the checks instantaneous.
 
Socrtease said:
And I would say that someone with a violent felony is not going to purchase a gun through WalMart or any other authorized fire arms dealer. My bet is he will buy one of the tens of thousands that can be legally purchased on the street in every state in the US. If I was so inclined I could within the next hour find a gun for sale and never deal with anyone that had anything to do with a FFL. Further, waiting periods are unneccesary. THe technology exists now to make the checks instantaneous.
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While I agree the tech exists for quick background checks, I would still maintain at least a 3 day waiting period. The reason is more psychological than anything. It may deter those that buy guns on impulse while under emotional distress. ie... just found out spouse cheating on you, lost job, realized that Dems do indeed suck etc....
 
Superfreak said:
While I agree the tech exists for quick background checks, I would still maintain at least a 3 day waiting period. The reason is more psychological than anything. It may deter those that buy guns on impulse while under emotional distress. ie... just found out spouse cheating on you, lost job, realized that Dems do indeed suck etc....
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3 day waiting period because somebody MIGHT lose their temper over a cheating spouse.

remember the L.A. Riots? People scrambled to gun shops to protect their families and homes and were shocked, SHOCKED I tell you, to find out they had to wait 15 days to purchase the weapon due to state law. Guess how quickly that changed?
 
Solitary said:
I don't disagree with waiting periods, but I don't think they have much effect.

Background checks are not a bad idea, but are also ineffective. The guy who killed all those people at VaTech bought guns legally and went thru the background check and waiting period.
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there are always exceptions and new members moving up into the world of insanity.
Background checks are not for those who have not yet misused guns, but for those that have in the past.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
3 day waiting period because somebody MIGHT lose their temper over a cheating spouse.

remember the L.A. Riots? People scrambled to gun shops to protect their families and homes and were shocked, SHOCKED I tell you, to find out they had to wait 15 days to purchase the weapon due to state law. Guess how quickly that changed?
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stupit people that do not plan ahead.
 
Superfreak said:
While I agree the tech exists for quick background checks, I would still maintain at least a 3 day waiting period. The reason is more psychological than anything. It may deter those that buy guns on impulse while under emotional distress. ie... just found out spouse cheating on you, lost job, realized that Dems do indeed suck etc....
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No waiting period.....period. There shouldn't be one at all.
 
Its always a good idea to have a gun and the ammo for it at your house. Its a lot like a fire extinguisher. You don't plan to need it, but if you do need it there is no time to go buy one.
 
I think that the only thing you could hope to gain out of a gun control policy is a reduction in murders of passion. If the kid at VAtech hadn't been able to easily get hold of a gun, and had to resort to underground channels which I doubt he knew even existed, there probably wouldn't have been a VAtech. Also, police would be able to arrest gang members on possession of a gun before they've even committed a crime.

But the only effective gun control policies which would bring about that level of control would be Orwellian. It would have to be a national policy, the sentences would have to be tough, and police power would have to be greatly expanded. I don't even think the most hard core gun control advocate is willing to take those sorts of steps, and without them you probably won't get any good out of gun control at all.
 
SmarterThanYou said:
3 day waiting period because somebody MIGHT lose their temper over a cheating spouse.

remember the L.A. Riots? People scrambled to gun shops to protect their families and homes and were shocked, SHOCKED I tell you, to find out they had to wait 15 days to purchase the weapon due to state law. Guess how quickly that changed?
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Was it people scrambling to "protect their family", or the rioters on the street trying to buy the guns?
 
uscitizen said:
VA has plenty of gun shows and flea markets where you can buy guns.
No background check required.
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The guy at VAtech was severely mentally ill. He should've never been able to get a gun.

They say that gun shows couldn't survive if they put background checks in place. I say, so be it. Life is more important than your little hobby.
 
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