Collapse of the American Empire

America has become the land in which 20% of the eligible voters, mostly the nuts, elect other crackpots in the hope their position or absurd idea, has voice and nothing is done that interferes with their selfishness and cold-hearted politics of greed.


http://www.ted.com/talks/jared_diamond_on_why_societies_collapse.html

Stages of civilizations

From bondage to spiritual faith
* From spiritual faith to great courage
* From great courage to liberty
* From liberty to abundance
* From abundance to selfishness < we are here
* From selfishness to complacency
* From complacency to apathy
* From apathy to dependence
* From dependence back to bondage

Source: In the early 1700s, Professor Alexander Tyler wrote this about the fall of the Athenian republic over a thousand years ago.



"To suggest social action for the public good to the City of London is like discussing the Origin of Species with a bishop sixty years ago. The first reaction is not intellectual, but moral. An orthodoxy is in question, and the more persuasive the arguments the graver the offence." John Maynard Keynes
 
Sorry about derailing the derail but with regard to the op,

Imperial falls are almost nearly always associated with fiscal crisis, dramatic imbalances between revenues and expenditures.most often due to the mounting cost of servicing a spiraling public debt.


Spain: 16th century - 1540's 2/3 of Spain's ordinary revenues were used for servicing the loans made to the crown, I think it was the Hapsburg monarchy but don't quote me, I'd have to look it up to be certain. By the late 1550's interest payments exceeded ordinary revenue. Silver mines kept the empire afloat for awhile but spain was fading fast. Debt service costs fluxuated between 80 - 100% until the end of the century, they were essentially done as a viable empire. From then on it was in a state of collapse. Worse in some periods than others but collapse never the less.

France: roughly 1750's to the late 1780's (incidentally the French revolution began in 1789, surely just coincidence) During this period debt service went from around 25% of revenues to above 60% How long was France an emipire after that?

Ottoman Empire: 1868 17% to 50$ in 1877 at which time they defaulted and began to collapse.

British Empire: After the end of the war in 1945 debt equal to about a third of Britain's GDP was held in foreign hands. At which point the U.S. ended lend-lease and demanded that the debts be made good. (at this point the phrase "what goes around comes around" comes creeping into my mind) By 1956 the British Empire, upon which the sun truly never set, broke apart with amazing speed spawning the likes of Bangladesh, Burma, Egypt Ghana, India, Israel Jordan, Newfoundland Sri Lanka, Pakistan, Sudan and others that I forget. 12 years from Yalta where Churchill, Roosevelt and Stalin sat astride the world, Britain was virtually stripped back to her island roots. She is still a player, but more for what she was than what she is.

I hope my British friends forgive me, I mean no disrespect what so ever. I think that the British empire at her height was the wonder of the world. Today we have nuclear power, jet engines, computers etc... But Britain did it primarily with wind, iron, black powder and balls the size of Gibraltar. Truly, in my mind, the worlds most amazing achievement.

Soviet Empire. Again, they just could not keep up with the west economically. Cold war expenditures military adventurism were destroying them and once one of their former victims smelled blood they collapsed in record time. If The Soviet Union had the wherewithal to enforce their will militarily on the breakaway states does anyone for one second think that they would not have done so? By that point their military was in shambles. The only thing that could have saved them from an invasion by the west were their nukes. Yes, it was capitalism that beat soviet version of communism, but it was still a fiscal crisis that brought that empire to an end whatever the cause of that crisis was, which is my overall point here.

Which brings us to the U.S. Will we quietly back out? I hope so. Is there a current and/or impending fiscal crisis?

Duh.

Is this the beginning of the end? I say yes. Nobody here has the balls to take the kind of austerity measures that a country like britain is taking. Everyone here wants the other guy to make the sacrifice. Everyone screams and whines and bitches about the deficit and so what do they do? Increase the deficit some more. Why? Because they are pussies afraid of losing their job. Do we need to cut military and other defense related spending? Yes. Cut entitlements - yes, raise taxes on the top 2 or 3 or 5 percent yes, yes and yes to all of that because that is what it's going to take. I think we might, and I emphasize might, have had a chance if the stimulus were handled differently but that's done now.

The American Empire is done, it's just a matter of time, and I don't mind that, it's pretty how empires do historically. Maybe it's just our time to step aside. I just hope we can get our fiscal crisis solved before China sends us the bill. But if we don't, you can come and work with me on my farm. It's off the grid and at least you'll be able to get three hots and a cot for a days work.
 
No. Our financial crisis will be cured when we reject the globalization stupidity thats putting our population out of work.

Any pretentions to empire the US ever had are finished. By the time the US gets its act together it will be as nothing against the combined forces of China, India, Russia and many more besides. You'd better start getting used to the fact that the US 'Empire' will go down in history as the briefest ever.
People who do not or cannot believe that are the reason for the nations future abject failure.
Sorry buddy but your day has passed.
You missed it!
 
Any pretentions to empire the US ever had are finished. By the time the US gets its act together it will be as nothing against the combined forces of China, India, Russia and many more besides. You'd better start getting used to the fact that the US 'Empire' will go down in history as the briefest ever.
People who do not or cannot believe that are the reason for the nations future abject failure.
Sorry buddy but your day has passed.
You missed it!

You wish!

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
 
Any pretentions to empire the US ever had are finished. By the time the US gets its act together it will be as nothing against the combined forces of China, India, Russia and many more besides. You'd better start getting used to the fact that the US 'Empire' will go down in history as the briefest ever.
People who do not or cannot believe that are the reason for the nations future abject failure.
Sorry buddy but your day has passed.
You missed it!

You stupid chinese dumbfuck. All that "owning our debt" nonsense is bullshit. I can't believe you fell for it. That's just numbers in a computer that mean nothing.

the power is ours.
 
All that "owning our debt" nonsense is bullshit. I can't believe you fell for it. That's just numbers in a computer that mean nothing.

the power is ours.

When the USSR went under, all their debt just went away. Those that were owed $ lost it, and that was that.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
 
All Empires decline and dissolve. It is the nature of things. ANYONE that thinks their empire will last forever is delusional. As technology advances the speed with which empires rise and fall increases. America will someday no longer be a superpower. It is unavoidable.
 
All Empires decline and dissolve. It is the nature of things. ANYONE that thinks their empire will last forever is delusional. As technology advances the speed with which empires rise and fall increases. America will someday no longer be a superpower. It is unavoidable.

It is fully avoidable. We will reject the globalization stupidity which is provably destroying our nation.

Your brainwashed belief in the 'inevitability' of things indicates your stupidity level as being in the "high" range.
 
I get an "ERROR 404".

Still works on my side (pesky CIAs are at it again)

Here you go.

Russia pays off USSR’s entire debt, sets to become crediting country
22.08.2006

Russia pays off USSR’s entire debt, sets to become crediting country
Russia pays off USSR’s entire debt, sets to become crediting country
Russia does not owe a cent to the countries of the Paris Club of Creditors. According to an official statement released by the Finance Ministry yesterday, Russia is no longer a debtor of the Paris Club. In addition, Russia may become a crediting country within the framework of the Club.

The debt of 45 billion dollars, the burden of which Russia had to carry after the collapse of the Soviet Union, has been paid off completely. Moreover, Russia cleared the debt ahead of schedule. Vnesheconombank, the agent of the Russian government to serve the foreign debt of the former USSR and Russia, transferred the remaining part of the arrears - $23.7 billion – during the recent four days. The payments have been done in nine different curries, the press service of the bank said.

Officials of the Finance Ministry are certain that the early payment of the debt to the Paris Club of Creditors will only improve Russia's international image as a financially stable debt. The final payment to the Club, which Russia made yesterday, may earn the country a reputation of an honest borrower which tries to ameliorate its investment climate.

The Soviet Union left a huge debt after its collapse. Russia became the only country to inherit not only the foreign property of the former USSR, but all of its foreign debts as well. It was extremely hard for Russia to serve the debt because the economy was declining steadily in the beginning of the 1990s. The Soviet debt had been restructured four times before the default of 1998. By 1999 Russia managed to either write off or delay the payments to private creditors (the London Club, for instance). However, such a compromise proved to be impossible with the Paris Club of Creditors.

World prices on oil literally saved Russia from another financial catastrophe. Oil prices have been rising very fast since the beginning of the new century, which gave Russia an opportunity to complete major payments ($17 billion) to the Paris Club in 2003. As a result, Russia has become one of the most solvent countries of the world.

Russia’s current economic development speed reaches six or seven percent a year. The country enjoys a favourable balance of trade and deficit-free state budget. Russia takes the third place in the world on the level of gold and forex reserves with over $265 billion. The early debt payment to the Paris Club of Creditors became possible only because of the ongoing growth of the economic and financial power of the Russian Federation.

According to experts’ estimates, the debt to the Paris Club was the largest, politically relevant and most complicated category of the country’s foreign debt. Financial analysts say that non-market debts similar to the Paris Club debt is more typical of third world countries, whereas Russia positions itself as a member of the Group of Eight. In other words, Russia is supposed to act as a creditor for poor countries.

Russia made its first prescheduled payment to the Paris Club one year ago, when the country paid 15 billion dollars. It is worthy of note that Russia cleared the debt to the International Monetary Fund in 2005 too - $3.3 billion. The agreement on the second tranche was achieved on June 16 in Paris. The conditions were different, though. The creditors insisted on a one-billion-dollar bonus, which was also meant to partially compensate financial losses of the ineffective interest payments.

The extra payment of one billion dollars pales in comparison with the amount which Russia saves as it pays off the debt ahead of schedule. “The federal budget will save over $12 billion on interest payments to the Paris Club of Creditors till 2020,” an official statement from the Finance Ministry of Russia said.

Finance Ministry officials hope that Russia will be able to become a creditor within the scope of the Paris Club of Creditors in the future. However, the completion of payments to the Paris Club does not dot all i’s in the debt history of the former USSR. Russia still has to serve the debt of several countries not listed as Paris Club members. The debt is evaluated at three or four billion dollars.
 
The American Empire Is Collapsing, And Americans Will Be The Last to Know

The American Empire Is Collapsing, And Americans Will Be The Last to Know

By Gilbert Mercier, News Junkie Post
Posted on December 15, 2010, Printed on December 21, 2010

50 years from now historians will probably be writing about the fall of the American empire. But history is writing itself furiously in the present, accelerated by the revolution of global freedom of information. What would have taken years to gather is accessible to anyone with a few strokes on a computer keyboard. So never mind the historians of the future, and lets see how reality is shaping up today.

The crumbling period of the United States empire started on September 11th. Since then, a chain of events so dire occurred that it would seem the empire defeated itself by a series of catastrophic mistakes. After 9/11, Americans wanted revenge, and the war in Afghanistan became a very easy sale for the Bush administration. But then the neo-cons seized the opportunity to push their agenda of the New American Century project, and it was precisely the Achilles heel of the empire.
3567424229_ec72fae05e-336x336.jpg

Attacking Iraq: The Biggest Geopolitical Blunder In History

When the Bush administration attacked Iraq in 2003, a critical element escaped their understanding of the regional and demographic parameters: By toppling the Sunni regime of Saddam Hussein, they would give the upper hand to the oppressed Shia Iraqi majority allied with Iran.

In a word, the US troops who fought and died in the conflict did it ultimately for the regional benefit of the Iranian Islamic Republic. The blunders did not stop with geopolitics, but were compounded by a catastrophic financial burden.
4541863252_2ff8771d7c_z-328x336.jpg

The Cost Of Wars in Iraq And Afghanistan Is Bankrupting The US Economy

If the Pentagon was a corporation, it would be the largest in the world. The curiously called Department Of Defense has cost the American taxpayers, since the ill advised attacks on Afghanistan and Iraq, around $700 billion a year. Of course, if you add up health care for wounded veterans, and layers of new security administration such as the Department of Homeland Security, the numbers keep adding up to top $1 trillion a year. Overall more than 25 percent of the federal budget gets swallowed in the financial black hole that is the Pentagon.

If Americans could do the math, they would quickly understand that the bill for the two wars is now creeping up to $10 trillion. In order to achieve the chimeric goals of the neocons of an ever lasting global American empire money had to be borrowed. Currently, for every dollar spent by the federal government 40 cents is borrowed. America used to borrow mainly from Japan and Europe, but now does its main borrowing from China. In a striking reversal of fortune, the poor man of Asia has now become the country in the world with the most liquid assets.

3233388847_532f795ed8-430x336.jpg

Empires Always Have An Expiration Date

Americans have a delusional sense of historic exceptionalism which they share with most previous empires. After all Americas ascension to a leading role on the world scene is very recent. The deal was sealed in Yalta in 1945 between Stalin and Roosevelt, with Churchill present but already taking the back seat. In a matter of 5 years, and about 60 million deaths, two new empires had emerged from the ruin of three: the United States and the Soviet Union. On the losing side of history was, of course, Japan, the empire of the sun, but also Britain and France.

The old imperial powers of Britain and France were slow to fully understand the nature of the new game. It took the loss of India for the United Kingdom, in 1948, and the one of Indochina for France in 1951 to make them understand that they would have from now on an ever shrinking role on the world stage. However, it took 9 years for Britain and France to fully digest the consequences of Yalta. In 1956, France and Britain took their very last joint imperialist venture by attacking Egypt over the ownership of the Suez Canal. The decaying empires were told to back off by the United States and the USSR.

4026955103_ce3f522004_b-304x336.jpg

A Repressive Capitalist Globalization Or The Revolution Of Global Freedom Of Information ?

The Cold War was a fairly predictable era. Beside a few flashpoints such as the Cuba missile crisis, the two superpowers fought to augment their respective turfs through proxy wars. But Afghanistan came along for the Soviets, and the long war made the USSR collapsed. Naturally the United States started acting as the only super-power left, and for this reason as the master of the universe.

The narrative of Ronald Reagan is peppered by such elements, and so is the one of all of his successors including Barack Obama. But all empires had the same distorted visions of themselves, the Romans imposed the Pax Romana on their vassals for a long time , so did Charlemagne, and Napoleon for a much shorter time. In any sense, power is cyclical and never lasts.

Thanks to WikiLeaks and the courage of his founder Julian Assange and the one of Pentagons whistleblower Bradley Manning, it has become rather obvious that while President Obama has changed the official tone of Washington from the Bush administration, the overall goals of US foreign policies have remained the same: Ensure and expend US power and authority on vassal states. This push to establish a new world order under exclusive US authority has been prevalent in all of the US administrations since Ronald Reagan and the end of the cold war.

President Obama, despite what could be his personal convictions is a prisoner of this imperial system. Obama is trapped by a complex nexus of inter-locking institutions such as the Pentagon, the CIA, the State Department etc, and by powerful interest groups profiting from endless wars. The very same institutions and interest groups have been at the core of every post-1945 imperial presidency. As early as 1946, president Harry Truman said: From Darius Persia, Alexanders Greece, Hadrians Rome, Victorias Britain; no nation or group of nations has had our responsibilities.

However, most analysts and foreign policy experts currently assume that the present century will not be American. In this tectonic power shift, under the push of China and India, the emerging new world order will be plural and decentralized. But the main question is: How Americans will adapt to this new paradigm where the United States loses its status of uncontested leadership?

(C) 2010 News Junkie Post All rights reserved.

signalman comment: America's best days are behind us, we are well on our way of becoming a third world toilet with abject poverty! We will never again, be that economic powerhouse of the pass!
 
signalman comment: America's best days are behind us, we are well on our way of becoming a third world toilet with abject poverty! We will never again, be that economic powerhouse of the pass![/QUOTE]



Nothing gets past you, does it Ken?
 
Personally, I'd prefer not to be an empire, seeing as how it is contrary to republican principles. As long as we can remain a military superpower, and a major economic power, I'm perfectly happy to stop policing the world, and telling stupid countries what to do all the time.

-A Patriot
 
Personally, I'd prefer not to be an empire, seeing as how it is contrary to republican principles. As long as we can remain a military superpower, and a major economic power, I'm perfectly happy to stop policing the world, and telling stupid countries what to do all the time.

-A Patriot

Would you accept one out of three?

Check out what is happening between China, India and Russia. Your native Americans said
'How. How'
Modern Americans must learn
'Kow Tow.'
Sorry to break it to you like this but methinks its gone too far to be changed.
 
Protectionism is a simple minded solution which doesn't work except in the short term. People who advocate it ignore both the lessons of history the fact that others can do the same thing.

No. Protectionism is a tried and true tool of statehood and economic relations.

We became a great nation with protectionism in place.

Let others protect their markets. Self reliance is good for everyone.

Only works in the short term? We live in the short term.

People in the future are not more important than people living now.

Your globalist zealotry is merely a myopic and destructive worldview which refuses to place trade policy in a healthy sensible context of other reasonable considerations.
 
Back
Top