Does altruism exist?

Tinkerpeach said:
You are missing the point.

Regardless of the time period any decision a human makes is because that is the decision they want to make.

They are doing it because that is what THEY want.

That is pure selfishness
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But doing what one wants is not the same as selfishness, correct?
 
Tinkerpeach said:
You are missing the point.

Regardless of the time period any decision a human makes is because that is the decision they want to make.

They are doing it because that is what THEY want.

That is pure selfishness
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yes, you keep stating your opinion - but it is not convincing
 
Tinkerpeach said:
You are missing the point.

Regardless of the time period any decision a human makes is because that is the decision they want to make.

They are doing it because that is what THEY want.

That is pure selfishness
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LOL So a Marine who does throw himself on a grenade, in your world, is being selfish. Got it. Thanks. :)
 
Tinkerpeach said:
You seem obsessed with sharing that information in every thread and It’s kind of creepy
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Another reason to believe you lied about your age...much less retiring at age 42. :)

Does 42 seem old to you? I can see how a 20something would consider anyone in their 40s to be old.
 
Doc Dutch said:
A survival instinct is common among mammals and most critters. That's not to say they wouldn't risk their lives for their young, their mate or tribal mates.

While I agree there's a lot of culture/nurture there, there's also a genetic component to bravery, violent instinct, etc. which would result in altruism, no matter how slight.
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Yes but ultimately the organism works to it's own best interest and that being survival in extreme situations. Each member of the tribe sacrifices for the tribe because its good for each member not the tribe as a whole. The tribes survival is a result not the cause of the action.
 
Tinkerpeach said:
Actually that would be the definition of selfishness
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So if i want chicken for dinner, I'm being selfish???? Did you just take some psychology class and this was the topic? Good lord i hope this isnt what they are teaching in schools.

BTW yuh didn't answer my initial question, even if what you say is true, so what?
 
Yakuda said:
Yes but ultimately the organism works to it's own best interest and that being survival in extreme situations. Each member of the tribe sacrifices for the tribe because its good for each member not the tribe as a whole. The tribes survival is a result not the cause of the action.
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Disagreed in that some people react without thought of self. Sometimes they do it simply because they are really, really pissed off. LOL

Do you think the actions of most Medal of Honor recipients is simple operant conditioning? That they are just meat robots?
 
Tinkerpeach said:
Yes because he is making the choice he wants to make.

The actual result of that choice is irrelevant
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How much time is there to think about in that situation? Time to consider his choices? Again, this is another reason why I think you are young; you lack life experience. That's not something that can be taught in a class or learned on Youtube.

Marines aren't taught to jump on grenades. They are taught to protect each other. Reactions in such a situation would vary by individual. Some might jump on the grenade. Others might yell "Grenade!" and dive for cover. If available, some might throw a prisoner or dead body on it.

People react differently under stress. Something else that can't be learned on Youtube or TikTok. LOL
 
Doc Dutch said:
How much time is there to think about in that situation? Time to consider his choices? Again, this is another reason why I think you are young; you lack life experience. That's not something that can be taught in a class or learned on Youtube.
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Time is irrelevant.

If you have time to make a decision you are still making it based on what you want.
 
Tinkerpeach said:
It does not.

Every action taken by a human is done out of selfishness.

If a soldier jumps on a grenade to save his platoon he is not doing it for them but for himself.

In the soldiers mind the thing he desires most in that moment is to save his platoon so his action is driven by that desire to get what HE wants.

Every human being on the planet who is capable of rational thought makes every decision based on selfishness.
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Everything that occurs in this universe is merely the random confluence of sub-atomic particles.
As free will does not exist, neither altruism nor selfishness can exist.

We believe that we have free will, and have no choice but to act accordingly,
but for free will to actually exist,
it would take a supernatural event--
we would have to supersede the laws of science where every effect has a demonstrable cause.
 
Doc Dutch said:
Disagreed in that some people react without thought of self. Sometimes they do it simply because they are really, really pissed off. LOL

Do you think the actions of most Medal of Honor recipients is simple operant conditioning? That they are just meat robots?
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I agree. In my very first post on this thread I said that in very large measure humans act selfishly but it's not absolute as the OP seems to suggest. Also self-interest isnt by itself selfish. There can be great benefits that can be realized through self interest.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
Everything that occurs in this universe is merely the random confluence of sub-atomic particles.
As free will does not exist, neither altruism nor selfishness can exist.

We believe that we have free will, and have no choice but to act accordingly,
but for free will to actually exist,
it would take a supernatural event--
we would have to supersede the laws of science where every effect has a demonstrable cause.
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And how did those subatomic particles come into existence without a supernatural force so by your very own definition selfishness has to exist.

Unless you can show us how your particles just randomly appeared out of nothing
 
Yakuda said:
No you didn't. You may think you have but you would be incorrect. So what if people act selfishly?
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It is an observation I made, I never claimed there was a point to it.

I made the thread to discuss this observation for those interested in the topic and this does happen to be a discussion forum so conclusions are not necessarily required.

Hopefully that answers your question
 
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