Eastern philosophy says the self is an illusion

IlaceWords said:
Weird. You are so bent you aren't even trying to find "funny pictures" to go with your memes. Now you just type in GIANT FONT.

Cypress is NOT going to like how his special friend has changed!
Click to expand...
Thanks for meme request, Spaz. I’ll make it up to you but am currently out of pocket.

IlaceWords said:
Are you pissed that you weren't able to get me banned? Is that it? You seem really upset today.
Click to expand...
I’m against permbans so, no, I’m not pissed. You keep assuming people are upset, Spaz. Is that what you are trying to accomplish?
 
Doc Dutch said:
Thanks for meme request, Spaz. I’ll make it up to you but am currently out of pocket.


I’m against permbans so, no, I’m not pissed. You keep assuming people are upset, Spaz. Is that what you are trying to accomplish?
Click to expand...

Just curious why you have devolved down from bad memes to just rants in giant font. You know...the thing you and your buddy Cypress took me to task for doing. You are such a hypocrite.
 
Cypress said:
I simply asked where are the mathmatical equations or scientific law someone could use in real life to define when or if it's okay to lie, what's the boundary between righteous anger and fury, how does one choose a friend, what's the drawing line between complete loyalty and remonstrance, is it okay to hate, what is fairness?.

That's the kind of knowledge people need on a day to day basis in real life. They don't really need to know Einstein's field equations or the Schrodinger equation.
Click to expand...

Cypress said:
I picked up a book by Patrick Grimm that goes down this tangent. As he frames it:

The really fundamental questions of our lives are not questions of fact or finance, but questions of value.

What is it that gives something genuine value? What is worth striving for and what makes life worth living? Are there values that transcend cultural differences? If the universe is deterministic, can there be genuine choice? Is ethics possible without religion? Is all value subjective? What is the difference between fact and value? How should life be lived? Is there a possibility of ethical knowledge, subjective or objective?
Click to expand...

Patrick Grimm:
The realm of objective fact is discovered through scientific exploration. The realm of value is explored or developed through a different kind of thinking and a different kind of experience. One could have a compete factual picture of the universe yet not know the first thing of value. One could know all the facts and history and methods of execution, yet not know whether the death penalty is justified.
 
Cypress said:
Patrick Grimm:
The realm of objective fact is discovered through scientific exploration. The realm of value is explored or developed through a different kind of thinking and a different kind of experience. One could have a compete factual picture of the universe yet not know the first thing of value. One could know all the facts and history and methods of execution, yet not know whether the death penalty is justified.
Click to expand...

This is Hume's argument. Values cannot be derived from facts.
 
Cypress said:
You're right. Patrick Grimm even pays homage to Hume in the chapter I am reading
Click to expand...

“In every system of morality, which I have hitherto met with, I have always remark’d, that the author proceeds for some time in the ordinary way of reasoning, and establishes the being of a God, or makes observations concerning human affairs; when of a sudden I am surpriz’d to find, that instead of the usual copulations of propositions, is, and is not, I meet with no proposition that is not connected with an ought, or an ought not.
https://philosophynow.org/issues/83/Hume_on_Is_and_Ought
 
BidenPresident said:
“In every system of morality, which I have hitherto met with, I have always remark’d, that the author proceeds for some time in the ordinary way of reasoning, and establishes the being of a God, or makes observations concerning human affairs; when of a sudden I am surpriz’d to find, that instead of the usual copulations of propositions, is, and is not, I meet with no proposition that is not connected with an ought, or an ought not.
https://philosophynow.org/issues/83/Hume_on_Is_and_Ought
Click to expand...

I would say this thread has dismantled the claim that all knowledge only comes from science.
 
Cypress said:
I would say this thread has dismantled the claim that all knowledge only comes from science.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Science is good, but like machines, it serves a purpose that does not cover all human endeavors. Science can teach parents how best to care for their child, but it can't teach them how to love their child, how to have empathy for their growing pains.
 
Doc Dutch said:
Agreed. Science is good, but like machines, it serves a purpose that does not cover all human endeavors. Science can teach parents how best to care for their child, but it can't teach them how to love their child, how to have empathy for their growing pains.
Click to expand...

I believe science gets put on a pedestal as the fountainhead of all knowledge because of it's remarkable success at establishing factual knowledge (as opposed to value knowledge), and science is expressed all around us in technology. It's impact is inescapable.
 
Cypress said:
I believe science gets put on a pedestal as the fountainhead of all knowledge because of it's remarkable success at establishing factual knowledge (as opposed to value knowledge), and science is expressed all around us in technology. It's impact is inescapable.
Click to expand...

I completely agree about the results of science and technology. I'm not so sure it's put on a pedestal by Americans except in academic and research circles. Usually those already in it or those seeking to become members (students).
 
Doc Dutch said:
I completely agree about the results of science and technology. I'm not so sure it's put on a pedestal by Americans except in academic and research circles. Usually those already in it or those seeking to become members (students).
Click to expand...

Maybe you're right.

I just have a sense that because of science's extraordinary success in establishing fact based knowledge and useful technology, there is a widespread expectation that science can answer everything about the world and humanity. Maybe my perspective is flawed, but there seems to be a faith that science knows more than it actually does.

Science is the best method we have for factual knowledge. But it plays almost no role in normative knowledge and it has almost nothing to say about values. That's the most important knowledge people need in their day to day lives
 
Cypress said:
Maybe you're right.

I just have a sense that because of science's extraordinary success in establishing fact based knowledge and useful technology, there is a widespread expectation that science can answer everything about the world and humanity. Maybe my perspective is flawed, but there seems to be a faith that science knows more than it actually does.

Science is the best method we have for factual knowledge. But it plays almost no role in normative knowledge and it has almost nothing to say about values. That's the most important knowledge people need in their day to day lives
Click to expand...

The COVID pandemic is evidence that only the educated, sane and intelligent Americans respect science. The dumbasses snorted HCQ and shoved Ivermectin suppositories up their asses.

BTW, has ExpressLane checked in lately? https://abcnews.go.com/US/man-allegedly-sold-fake-covid-cure-arrested-after/story?id=102282675
Man who allegedly sold fake COVID cure arrested after 3-year manhunt
Gordon Pedersen, 63, sold a silver product that he claimed cured COVID.
After a three-year manhunt, a Utah man has been arrested on charges of allegedly selling a fake COVID-19 cure, the U.S. Attorney's Office for the District of Utah announced Monday.

Gordon Hunter Pedersen, 63, of Cedar Hills -- 30 miles south of Salt Lake City -- allegedly appeared in multiple YouTube videos before COVID-19 vaccines were approved, selling "structural alkaline silver."

He allegedly claimed the product was a cure for the virus because it "resonates, or vibrates, at a frequency that destroys the membrane of the virus, making the virus incapable of attaching to any healthy cell, or to infect you in any way," the release states.
Click to expand...
 
Doc Dutch said:
The COVID pandemic is evidence that only the educated, sane and intelligent Americans respect science. The dumbasses snorted HCQ and shoved Ivermectin suppositories up their asses.

BTW, has ExpressLane checked in lately? https://abcnews.go.com/US/man-allegedly-sold-fake-covid-cure-arrested-after/story?id=102282675
Man who allegedly sold fake COVID cure arrested after 3-year manhunt
Gordon Pedersen, 63, sold a silver product that he claimed cured COVID.
Click to expand...

That's good point.
That and climate science denial
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top