He'll probably die in prison

NiftyNiblick said:
I never suggested letting the rich and powerful do what they like.

I suggested not sending former presidents to prison.

I'm not big on prisons at all, as you know.

What we need are mental hospitals and euthanasia clinics.

But if we have criminal ex-presidents, house arrest is sufficient to keep them from causing further damage.

That's what a civilized nation would do, but few Americans seem to care about being civilized.
That's why we don't have a National Health Service, accessible education, good public transportation, and strong labor unions.

To European Union members, we must look like cavemen.
A "true believer" won't see that, however.
As you're fond of saying, ignorance may in fact be bliss.
Click to expand...

House arrest? That is essentially what Trump has now. He is not debating, nor holding rallies, but he still moves the politics of the right according to his whims. Trump should be treated as any other criminal. Gitmo would be a perfect place for him.
 
Nordberg said:
House arrest? That is essentially what Trump has now. He is not debating, nor holding rallies, but he still moves the politics of the right according to his whims. Trump should be treated as any other criminal. Gitmo would be a perfect place for him.
Click to expand...

You're not looking to get him out of the way.
You're looking for revenge.

Revenge is a personal responsibility, not the state's.
If you want revenge, take care of him yourself.

You must be one of those egalitarian populists who actually believes that all people are equal.
I applaud your imagination.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
You're not looking to get him out of the way.
You're looking for revenge.

Revenge is a personal responsibility, not the state's.
If you want revenge, take care of him yourself.

You must be one of those egalitarian populists who actually believes that all people are equal.
I applaud your imagination.
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Why is holding a person accountable for their crimes equal to revenge?

Why do you believe some people are above the law?
 
Doc Dutch said:
Why is holding a person accountable for their crimes equal to revenge?

Why do you believe some people are above the law?
Click to expand...

Have you forgotten?
I don't believe in free will, so I don't believe that anybody IS accountable for his/her crimes.

I believe in rehabilitation hospitals to fix the possibly fixable broken people,
and humane euthanasia, not punitive execution, to let the unfixable ones rest in peace while not causing us problems.

I don't believe in prisons because absent guilt, they make no sense.

On a personal [not a state] level, we will seek revenge because that's how we're made,
but we form governments to make life easier, not to exact revenge.
You may have a different belief as to why we form governments.

None of this is anything that I haven't opined many, many times on this forum.
You're asking questions to which you've already heard answers,
but maybe it's just because you don't believe me when I'm being dead serious.

Accept that all people aren't the same and don't have compatible values.
By your age, you should have seen enough to understand that.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
Have you forgotten?
I don't believe in free will, so I don't believe that anybody IS accountable for his/her crimes.

I believe in rehabilitation hospitals to fix the possibly fixable broken people,
and humane euthanasia, not punitive execution, to let the unfixable ones rest in peace while not causing us problems.

I don't believe in prisons because absent guilt, they make no sense.

On a personal [not a state] level, we will seek revenge because that's how we're made,
but we form governments to make life easier, not to exact revenge.
You may have a different belief as to why we form governments.

None of this is anything that I haven't opined many, many times on this forum.
You're asking questions to which you've already heard answers,
but maybe it's just because you don't believe me when I'm being dead serious.

Accept that all people aren't the same and don't have compatible values.
By your age, you should have seen enough to understand that.
Click to expand...

No doubt the Jacksonville shooter would have appreciated your sentiments, neef.
 
Pardon me for not reading the entire thread, but a couple of points are in order.

1. Nifty is correct about his banana republic remark.

2. Imagine if Trump had refused to post bond. Fulton County would have a place to lock him and his 24/7 Secret Service detail.
 
Doc Dutch said:
Not when it came to his bigotry and hatefulness of Americans, neef. I thought you could relate to him on that count.
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I don't believe that you choose to recognize the difference between bigotry and discrimination, Oom.

I've never been a bigot, but I've always been highly discriminant.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
I don't believe that you choose to recognize the difference between bigotry and discrimination, Oom.

I've never been a bigot, but I've always been highly discriminant.
Click to expand...

Given your delusions about partitioning the United States, I can see why you'd truly believe that viewpoint, neef.
 
Doc Dutch said:
Given your delusions about partitioning the United States, I can see why you'd truly believe that viewpoint, neef.
Click to expand...

I'm not delusional enough to believe that the partitioning of the United States is imminent, Oom.

I factually know that it's necessary,
and if it doesn't happen in the future,
America will be an insufferable dystopia,

but it's not likely to happen in the few years at most that I have left.

Where I would need a little more insight as to how your mind works,
however,
in in trying to understand the perceived relationship
between being discriminate and favoring partition.

The former is a character trait.
The latter is a socio-political opinion.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
I'm not delusional enough to believe that the partitioning of the United States is imminent, Oom.

I factually know that it's necessary,
and if it doesn't happen in the future,
America will be an insufferable dystopia,

but it's not likely to happen in the few years at most that I have left.

Where I would need a little more insight as to how your mind works,
however,
in in trying to understand the perceived relationship
between being discriminate and favoring partition.

The former is a character trait.
The latter is a socio-political opinion.
Click to expand...

The delusional part, neef, isn't the timeline but that you think it would work. Unity brings peace, division brings war. It's a fact of human nature and history.
 
Doc Dutch said:
The delusional part, neef, isn't the timeline but that you think it would work. Unity brings peace, division brings war. It's a fact of human nature and history.
Click to expand...

Unity brings peace
because it's only attainable
by compatible people
who aren't inclined to constantly fight with one another.

If you think that describes current America,
"delusional" isn't the topic that you in particular need to be discussing, Oom.

Partition will in fact bring peace when both sides are amenable to it and negotiate it together.

Obviously, if it's forced by one side, it will bring war.

Right now, either peaceful partition or war

is preferable to the ignominy

of our present state of affairs in this dying republic.

We just don't seem to be ready for either yet,

so a few more more years of ennui and malaise will ensue.
 
NiftyNiblick said:
And you just deftly eliminated context.
Not the worst move you could make speaking from your side of the discussion.
Click to expand...
Disagreed, neef. You're a dreamer, I'm a realist. You post about pie-in-the-sky and I post about human nature. You think of a lofty world divided by walls with homoginous groups of people within those walls. I'm a student of history who understands tribalism inevitably turns into an "Us vs Them" mentality.
 
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