Hi -- New here.

Oneuli said:
If there's a specific claim you have an issue with, I'm happy to provide supporting documentation from other sources. Just specify which of the facts I present you don't believe. As for the Kaiser Family Foundation, it's not an insurance company. It's a public charity focused on healthcare issues. It is generally regarded as non-partisan. Its board of trustees includes Republicans like Olympia Snowe and Bill Frist, as well as non-partisan academics.



I've noticed a tendency on political forums. If a liberal sticks to short statements, she is attacked for not providing specifics and supporting evidence. If she provides specifics and supporting evidence, she's accused of "War and Peace" length posts, to give the conservatives an excuse for not responding to those. There's no middle ground, because the point for conservatives is simply to avoid acknowledging inconvenient facts.



I'll make it very short for you. If you want the detailed support, you can find it above:

* The number you quoted come from a right-wing propaganda source.
* The number assumes Medicare for All would cost over twice as much, in the US, as similar systems cost in other leading countries.
* Even if it did cost that much, that would still be a reduction in total healthcare spending, relative to what we'll spend without the change.
* We can cover that cost with a tax hike that will leave US taxes below the average taxes in developed nations generally.
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I asked you a simple question. You claim we can afford universal health insurance. All I ask is give me proof using nonbiased experts in economics. The data should include projected cost over a 10 year period and future projected costs. Also data on how we will pay the bill. Raising taxes is not an answer. Raising taxes by X% on tax payers and corporations would be a answer. Cutting other programs by X%, etc. If you can come up with realistic data I will admit you are correct. But I doubt you can because if it were that easy we would have done it.
 
Grumpy said:
I asked you a simple question. You claim we can afford universal health insurance. All I ask is give me proof using nonbiased experts in economics. The data should include projected cost over a 10 year period and future projected costs. Also data on how we will pay the bill. Raising taxes is not an answer. Raising taxes by X% on tax payers and corporations would be a answer. Cutting other programs by X%, etc. If you can come up with realistic data I will admit you are correct. But I doubt you can because if it were that easy we would have done it.
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it's not about easy. it's about greedy.
 
Oneuli said:
I missed that. Do you have a link to it? I'm still learning my way around here.... plus, as a noob, I thought it might be a bit presumptuous to start my own thread (other than by way of introduction) right off the bat.

I'm really interested in the science and numbers around climate change. Maybe I'll start something around that. If my focus were more on the science and less on the politics of it, which sub-forum would that go into? It's not quite "politics" or "current events." "Off Topic Forum"?
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the problem is that you're too smart for some of the dummies here, eg, legion.
 
Checkered Demon said:
you bias is showing.
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That's his bias?! Oh dear. I thought it was his di.. um pen.... er.... some other very short thing.

It's hilarious to me that a thoughtful, well-resourced, and well-trimmed-down response about how to fund a national care health system is seen as a "novel with a bunch of liberal bullshit" by our stalwart RWNJ Angry Bird. Then there's the whole "you're a sock" thing when Oneuli first posted.

It would seem that our conservative male friends here are threatened, fearful, dismayed, angered, chagrined, and emasculated that a brand new person could show up and quickly expose them for the insecure "males" they pretend to be. No wonder Legion keeps doubting her gender. No mere woman could EVER be smarter, more educated, more eloquent than he is (said every RW JPP contard ever).
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
That's his bias?! Oh dear. I thought it was his di.. um pen.... er.... some other very short thing.

It's hilarious to me that a thoughtful, well-resourced, and well-trimmed-down response about how to fund a national care health system is seen as a "novel with a bunch of liberal bullshit" by our stalwart RWNJ Angry Bird. Then there's the whole "you're a sock" thing when Oneuli first posted.

It would seem that our conservative male friends here are threatened, fearful, dismayed, angered, chagrined, and emasculated that a brand new person could show up and quickly expose them for the insecure "males" they pretend to be. No wonder Legion keeps doubting her gender. No mere woman could EVER be smarter, more educated, more eloquent than he is (said every RW JPP contard ever).
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it's no wonder he's such a grumpy old fart.:rolleyes:
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
Excellent. Another benefit for U.S. corporations -- they would no longer need to offer health insurance to employees, saving billions per year. Or if they wanted they could offer supplemental plans as a hiring/retention incentive. Rather than taxing individuals more, raise corporate taxes to cover what is needed for a Medicare-for-all plan. I am not a numbers cruncher but I suspect that after being off the hook for health insurance premiums, corporations would still come out ahead even with slightly higher taxes.
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If people weren't afraid to go to the doctors when issues arise due to the cost of health care then overall society would be healthier and costing less in the long run. The fact that many deny themselves routine health checks and dental work etc means down the road they are going to possibly have health issues and costs that are far greater than they need be. Having said that, imagine how much money would be saved on health care if our actual health care costs weren't so goddamn high?
 
Yeah. Don't all answer at the same time. I'm sure this has crossed more than my mind. I mean, I know I'm not the sharpest tack in the box, but ... it's kinda' becoming CLEAR as to what this is ALL about. Mhmmm ...she's a North Korean Bot, sent here to gather intelligence and infect our computers with malware.
 
Just a precautionary note to the feeble minded here ... DON'T open up any 'attachments' in your email inbox.
 
Jack said:
Has anyone been able to get an emotional response from Hot Babe Chick?
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You should probably write another one of your patented porno posts involving an intelligent and way-above-your-pay-grade Asian heritage woman being spanked, tied up, thrust into one of those Cialis commercial tubs, pissed on, and crying out for more more more of Jack's denigrating descriptions of how he would humiliate her if only. I'm sure that will do it just like it worked when you wrote that stupid shit about other women far superior to your limp ass.

Or you could just respond to Oneuil's posts about economics, to start with. You know, like an actual adult male who knows adult females are people too.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
You should probably write another one of your patented porno posts involving an intelligent and way-above-your-pay-grade Asian heritage woman being spanked, tied up, thrust into one of those Cialis commercial tubs, pissed on, and crying out for more more more of Jack's denigrating descriptions of how he would humiliate her if only. I'm sure that will do it just like it worked when you wrote that stupid shit about other women far superior to your limp ass.

Or you could just respond to Oneuil's posts about economics, to start with. You know, like an actual adult male who knows adult females are people too.
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Oh sweet Jesus, Owl. You're just like all the rest ... you hate asian women because they have small vaginas and you know you CAN'T compete with THAT!
 
Grumpy said:
I asked you a simple question. You claim we can afford universal health insurance. All I ask is give me proof using nonbiased experts in economics. The data should include projected cost over a 10 year period and future projected costs. Also data on how we will pay the bill. Raising taxes is not an answer. Raising taxes by X% on tax payers and corporations would be a answer. Cutting other programs by X%, etc. If you can come up with realistic data I will admit you are correct. But I doubt you can because if it were that easy we would have done it.
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We been down this road endless times with you.
You're for status quo,keep the billions rolling in to the insurance companies!
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
That's his bias?! Oh dear. I thought it was his di.. um pen.... er.... some other very short thing.

It's hilarious to me that a thoughtful, well-resourced, and well-trimmed-down response about how to fund a national care health system is seen as a "novel with a bunch of liberal bullshit" by our stalwart RWNJ Angry Bird. Then there's the whole "you're a sock" thing when Oneuli first posted.

It would seem that our conservative male friends here are threatened, fearful, dismayed, angered, chagrined, and emasculated that a brand new person could show up and quickly expose them for the insecure "males" they pretend to be. No wonder Legion keeps doubting her gender. No mere woman could EVER be smarter, more educated, more eloquent than he is (said every RW JPP contard ever).
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Apparently everyone's someone else here. Oh wait, we're just a profile representing an online persona. So... nobodies that real to begin with anyway. It's not like people are acting as themselves on forums like this. I could be a 20 something heartthrob, or I could just be a grilled cheese fan, from the burbs. Who's to say? Let's just say it's somewhere in between.
 
Apple Lung-Li-Chiao said:
Apparently everyone's someone else here. Oh wait, we're just a profile representing an online persona. So... nobodies that real to begin with anyway. It's not like people are acting as themselves on forums like this. I could be a 20 something heartthrob, or I could just be a grilled cheese fan, from the burbs. Who's to say? Let's just say it's somewhere in between.
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Let's just say it clearly don't make a fuck.
 
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