How OBL bankrupted the US

OBL's STATED GOAL is to bankrupt the West. It's the only viable option for terrorists, because they don't have the kind of army or conventional military to challenge the U.S.

I don't think OBL knew exactly what would happen after 9/11, but I can guarantee you that our decision to invade Iraq probably exceeded his expectations. A protracted war, that is enflaming the Middle East & benefitting AQ recruitment, that is costing the U.S. trillions. Add to that the cost of all of the anti-terror measures we now have to take, the money going into border security, the extra checks at airports...this is the goal of terrorism.

I'm not making a judgment on it, or saying what is right & what isn't - though I think my feelings on Iraq are well known- but it's naive & fairly stupid to say that OBL & 9/11 haven't caused the U.S. to make decisions and act in ways that have depleted our finances & affected our economy. Are we "bankrupt"? No, but we are more in debt than ever, and our financial standing in the world has rarely been worse.

If I'm OBL, I'm pretty pleased with how things turned out.

so obl is NOT responsible for bush invading iraq...yet he gets teh credit for iraq causing us financial woes....bizarro logic

face it, the real reasons we are in the spot we are is because of our lousy spending habits. too much credit and pooof! it has nothing to do with obl, if real estate would have continued its sky high soar, if mtg companies weren't forced to make bad loans, etc...we would better off...

further, i am willing to bet that you have blamed bush's or republican economic policies for this mess...wait, you have, i know it
 
so obl is NOT responsible for bush invading iraq...yet he gets teh credit for iraq causing us financial woes....bizarro logic

face it, the real reasons we are in the spot we are is because of our lousy spending habits. too much credit and pooof! it has nothing to do with obl, if real estate would have continued its sky high soar, if mtg companies weren't forced to make bad loans, etc...we would better off...

further, i am willing to bet that you have blamed bush's or republican economic policies for this mess...wait, you have, i know it

My bad. I didn't realize I was trying to discuss this with someone who is unable to put 2 & 2 together.

I know, I know - "ad hominem." You listen to too much Hannity.
 
My bad. I didn't realize I was trying to discuss this with someone who is unable to put 2 & 2 together.

I know, I know - "ad hominem." You listen to too much Hannity.

i absolutely do not listen to hannity, liar...

i see you have to give up on your arguments rather than try to explain them...ad hominem...you sure love to use them quite frequently. you should really focus your efforts on making your points instead of insulting.

is obl also responsible for the rest of the world's economic crisis?

obl didn't cause bush to invade iraq, but he gets the credit for iraq's financial woes....no wonder you gave up
 
You have a huge denial problem.

blah, blah, blah

ad hominem

did obl cause the rest of the world's economic crisis as well? and why can't you provide one single thing obl did to actually cause this economic crisis? and why, instead trying to show one thing, do you spend all your time insulting me? do you honestly think that makes you look good or proves your point?
 
"i see you have to give up on your arguments rather than try to explain them"

I explained them thoroughly. You just didn't hear them, or didn't choose to, or aren't smart enough to understand them.

I'm not the type to keep beating my head against the wall. If you choose not to listen, I can't do anything for you.
 
"i see you have to give up on your arguments rather than try to explain them"

I explained them thoroughly. You just didn't hear them, or didn't choose to, or aren't smart enough to understand them.

I'm not the type to keep beating my head against the wall. If you choose not to listen, I can't do anything for you.

how can you rationally state that obl did not cause bush to invade iraq and yet give obl the credit for iraq's financial woes...

did obl cause the entire world's financial woes?

face it, you're giving up in the face of someone questioning yoru explanations. i understand, its ok.
 
Do you not really know why the rest of the world is in economic trouble?

osama bin laden? for if you say as goes the us economy, so goes the world (usually true) then obl gets credit for the entire world's economic mess...

and you still have not provide just ONE thing obl did...
 
further, i am willing to bet that you have blamed bush's or republican economic policies for this mess...wait, you have, i know it

i am willing to bet that both of you have laid the blame at bush's feet (for his economic policies) prior to this thread.

are you now willing to concede that it is not bush's fault, rather obl's fault? obl makes dr. evil look like an intern of evil
 
The massive debt made this even worse.

The spending of our tax dollars on war instead of infrastructure is adding to this problem.

On top of that they gave the keys to the store to their corporate cronies.

Read the link, OBL gauged this cabal of neocons just right.
 
The massive debt made this even worse.

The spending of our tax dollars on war instead of infrastructure is adding to this problem.

On top of that they gave the keys to the store to their corporate cronies.

Read the link, OBL gauged this cabal of neocons just right.

so it is obl's fault bush invaded iraq? yes or no.

still can't give one example can you....i am sure that both you and onceler have blamed republican or bush economic policies for this mess....now, you are blaming obl...what next, mork from ork

why don't you quote from the link that which proves your point...
 
the economy is more complex than you think desh, you can't simply blame obl...well, in fact, in the past you have said it was republicans or bush...


You are the worst partisan hack who ever took a breath.


To blame an economy that took years of ignorance and greed on the part of your favorite party and their constituients (the corporate class) on the fact that a new president is elected is the epitome of absolute hackery.

The real causes of this mess were the concerted efforts of the Bush admin to deregulate what they could and allow "self policing " whereever they couldnt get deregulation.

next
 
Russia was going to fail. It was just a matter of time. OBL knew this and knew that a few years of money bleeding in Afganistan would tip the balance. The Russian system was unworkable in the long term.


We added to the pain but it was the system itself that died its inevitable death with OBL urging it to a quicker death.


Then we the neocons were so stupid they didnt learn the lesson. Thank the powers that be we have a system that can work if allowed to do so. Socialism is not the answer. Capitolism tempered with good regulations and fair mangement is workable in the long term.

For a guy who lives in a cave we sure heap a lot of genius on Bin Laden.

Most respectfully my sister, you do not know the story of how the CIA helped to create the muhajadeen and Bin Laden. It was the US, via Carter, Zbigniew Brezinski, and former CIA Director Robert Gates who plotted to push the Russians into a response in Afghanistan .. and their response was to invade. Both Brezinski and Gates have already declared this truth. Carter signed the first directive to aid and forment the muhajadeen on July 3, 1979, BEFORE the Russian invasion.

The idea to bleed the Russians dry and "give them their Vietnam" was Brezinski and CIA Director Standsfield Turner's idea, not Bin Laden. The CIA began to recruit and train muhajadeen fighters in Pakistan, with the help of Pakistan's ISI.

The CIA purchased and arranged for the manufacture of Soviet-style weapons from Egypt, China, Poland, Israel and elsewhere, or supplying their own; arranging for military training by Americans, Egyptians, Chinese and Iranians; hitting up Middle-Eastern countries for donations, notably Saudi Arabia which gave many hundreds of millions of dollars in aid each year, totaling probably more than a billion; pressuring and bribing Pakistan to rent out its country as a military staging area and sanctuary and put the Pakistani Director of Military Operations, General Afzal, onto the CIA payroll to ensure Pakistani cooperation.

When Reagan inherited Brezinki's program he increased it and in March 1985 he issued National Security Decision Directive 166.29 a secret plan to escalate covert action in Afghanistan dramatically. Beginning in 1985, the CIA supplied mujahideen rebels with extensive satellite reconnaissance data of Soviet targets on the Afghan battlefield, plans for military operations based on the satellite intelligence, intercepts of Soviet communications, secret communications networks for the rebels, delayed timing devices for tons of C-4 plastic explosives for urban sabotage, and sophisticated guerrilla attacks, long-range sniper rifles, a targeting device for mortars that was linked to a U.S. Navy satellite, wire-guided anti-tank missiles, and other equipment. including more than 1,000 state-of-the-art, shoulder-fired Stinger anti-aircraft missiles.

AND .. don't miss this part .. the US-backed muhajadeen carried out numerous car bombings, suicide bombings, and hijackings. They attacked airports, railroads, fuel depots, religious shrines, bridges, roads, etc..

AND they recruited radical muslims from around the world .. and Bin Laden was one of them. By 1984, he was running the Maktab al-Khidamar, an organization set up by the CIA/ISI to funnel money, arms, and fighters from the outside world in the Afghan war. In 1988, Bin Laden created Al-Queda with CIA knowledge and assistance. After the Soviet withdrawal, Bin Laden and others returned to their own countries.

In 1994, the muhajadeen morphed into the Taliban and they were funded and trained by the US, Britian, and Saudia Arabia. Afghanistan had sunk in chaos, but our geopolitical needs were being met. Almost a quarter of the population lived in refugee camps and the country was in ruins. With the aid of the ISI, the Taliban swept across the ruined country and captured Kabul in 1996. They imposed an ultra-sectarian version of Saudia Arabia style Wahhabism on the population.

When Clinton inherited the program he decided to take a more cautious approach, but he still backed the Taliban .. until 1998 when Bin Laden was accussed of bombing US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania. This upset plans by UNOCOL to build a duel pipeline through Afghanistan that would carry both natural gas and oil. At this point UNOCOL exec, John J. Marenga, went before the US Congress to beg them to overthrow the Taliban (in so many words) so the pipelines could be built.

When you know the real story, not the bullshit PR Americans are fedd, you'll recognize that Bin Laden has always been a pawn and dependent on the CIA.

EVERYTHING I've said is verifiable .. Americans would just rather be told fairy-tales so they can sleep better.

By the way .. socialism has absolutely nothing, as in ZERO, to do with any of this. However, capitalism does as it was capitalists who formented the destruction of Afghanistan for profit .. which was the same reason we invaded Iraq .. for profit.
 
Last edited:
The man is right.

Actually, this strategy would have worked perfectly if we had not funneled the money through the Pakistanis. They were the one's who disproportionately equipped the Taliban, leaving them holding all the weapons when the Russians left Afghanistan.
 
The man is right.

Actually, this strategy would have worked perfectly if we had not funneled the money through the Pakistanis. They were the one's who disproportionately equipped the Taliban, leaving them holding all the weapons when the Russians left Afghanistan.

That is absolutely correct.
 
For a guy who lives in a cave we sure heap a lot of genius on Bin Laden.

Most respectfully my sister, you do not know the story of how the CIA helped to create the muhajadeen and Bin Laden. It was the US, via Carter, Zbigniew Brezinski, and former CIA Director Robert Gates who plotted to push the Russians into a response in Afghanistan .. and their response was to invade. Both Brezinski and Gates have already declared this truth. Carter signed the first directive to aid and forment the muhajadeen on July 3, 1979, BEFORE the Russian invasion.

The idea to bleed the Russians dry and "give them their Vietnam" was Brezinski and CIA Director Standsfield Turner's idea, not Bin Laden. The CIA began to recruit and train muhajadeen fighters in Pakistan, with the help of Pakistan's ISI.

The CIA purchased and arranged for the manufacture of Soviet-style weapons from Egypt, China, Poland, Israel and elsewhere, or supplying their own; arranging for military training by Americans, Egyptians, Chinese and Iranians; hitting up Middle-Eastern countries for donations, notably Saudi Arabia which gave many hundreds of millions of dollars in aid each year, totaling probably more than a billion; pressuring and bribing Pakistan to rent out its country as a military staging area and sanctuary and put the Pakistani Director of Military Operations, General Afzal, onto the CIA payroll to ensure Pakistani cooperation.

When Reagan inherited Brezinki's program he increased it and in March 1985 he issued National Security Decision Directive 166.29 a secret plan to escalate covert action in Afghanistan dramatically. Beginning in 1985, the CIA supplied mujahideen rebels with extensive satellite reconnaissance data of Soviet targets on the Afghan battlefield, plans for military operations based on the satellite intelligence, intercepts of Soviet communications, secret communications networks for the rebels, delayed timing devices for tons of C-4 plastic explosives for urban sabotage, and sophisticated guerrilla attacks, long-range sniper rifles, a targeting device for mortars that was linked to a U.S. Navy satellite, wire-guided anti-tank missiles, and other equipment. including more than 1,000 state-of-the-art, shoulder-fired Stinger anti-aircraft missiles.

AND .. don't miss this part .. the US-backed muhajadeen carried out numerous car bombings, suicide bombings, and hijackings. They attacked airports, railroads, fuel depots, religious shrines, bridges, roads, etc..

AND they recruited radical muslims from around the world .. and Bin Laden was one of them. By 1984, he was running the Maktab al-Khidamar, an organization set up by the CIA/ISI to funnel money, arms, and fighters from the outside world in the Afghan war. In 1988, Bin Laden created Al-Queda with CIA knowledge and assistance. After the Soviet withdrawal, Bin Laden and others returned to their own countries.

In 1994, the muhajadeen morphed into the Taliban and they were funded and trained by the US, Britian, and Saudia Arabia. Afghanistan had sunk in chaos, but our geopolitical needs were being met. Almost a quarter of the population lived in refugee camps and the country was in ruins. With the aid of the ISI, the Taliban swept across the ruined country and captured Kabul in 1996. They imposed an ultra-sectarian version of Saudia Arabia style Wahhabism on the population.

When Clinton inherited the program he decided to take a more cautious approach, but he still backed the Taliban .. until 1998 when Bin Laden was accussed of bombing US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania. This upset plans by UNOCOL to build a duel pipeline through Afghanistan that would carry both natural gas and oil. At this point UNOCOL exec, John J. Marenga, went before the US Congress to beg them to overthrow the Taliban (in so many words) so the pipelines could be built.

When you know the real story, not the bullshit PR Americans are fedd, you'll recognize that Bin Laden has always been a pawn and dependent on the CIA.

EVERYTHING I've said is verifiable .. Americans would just rather be told fairy-tales so they can sleep better.

By the way .. socialism has absolutely nothing, as in ZERO, to do with any of this. However, capitalism does as it was capitalists who formented the destruction of Afghanistan for profit .. which was the same reason we invaded Iraq .. for profit.

Yep we are a terrorist supporting nation.
 
:clink:

I bought Charlie Wilson's War, and towards the end, I was yelling at the box for the way the Pakistanis screwed us over and stabbed us in the back. Looks like their leaders have been experiencing Karma ever since.

Everybody who touched Afghanistan is dealing with their own blowback, including the Pakistanis as you say. They don't know how to get rid of the terrorists they, along with the CIA, helped to create.

I got his name wrong, but here is the testimony of UNOCAL Vice President, John J. Maresca, in Feb. 1998.
http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/linkscopy/Maresca2USG.html

He was later made US Ambassador to Pakistan by the Bush Administration .. along with a real shady character named Hamid Karzai who was made the Afghan President.
 
Back
Top