Michigan, Florida, and The Hypocrites

I do want every vote to count. I want every person in Mi and FLs vote to count.

The thing is I want everyone who did not go vote that day because they were told that it would not be considered a vote to be able to have their vote now count too.

The only way to do this is to revote both states.

If we can not revote both states then we have to give wieght to the people who did not vote because they were told it was not really a vote.

How do you do this?

You give some of the votes to the guy who is still also in the race besides Hillary and that is Obama.

Its either that for do what the party said it would do and what Clinton and Obama signed and agreed to and not count any of these votes.

They are voting for who might take the position and not who WILL take the position so it does not matter as much as FL 2000 election. These people in FL and MI still have a chance to vote for president in the end dont they?

You are making such a fuss about what is not your business Dixie. Go fix your own damn party and let us fix ours. Your morals are the kind we DONT want applied to our party in the first place.
 
I'm just interested in seeing the hypocricy of Democrats revealed. My post sparks comments from Demo's like you, who say things like....
They are voting for who might take the position and not who WILL take the position so it does not matter as much as FL 2000 election. These people in FL and MI still have a chance to vote for president in the end dont they?

According to Onceler, they were voting for nothing, because they already knew it didn't count. I'm not sure I understand the purpose of voting for nothing, maybe like a "poll" or something? Anyway, he contends they all came out and voted, knowing they were going to be disenfranchised. You are reaffirming his point, that... yeah, they were disenfranchised, but it's not like it was important, they'll get a change to vote for R or D at least. I can't believe how easy it was to illustrate Democrat hypocrisy on this, I just posted the truth, and you guys made my point better than anything I could have ever said.

By the way... a re-vote is not fair! What about people who have died since the first vote? Their vote should count, right? I know if this was in Illinois, you could figure out a way to count these votes, they have some special law there, but what about the poor Democrat who's dying wish was to have her vote for Hillary be counted? She's just shit outta luck in your scenario, huh? And what is this stupidity about "giving weight" to one candidate? How the hell you go about that, other than to assume the disenfranchised would have voted for Obama? ...I think your idea of Democracy has some serious flaws.
 
You are making such a fuss about what is not your business Dixie.
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Democracy is EVERYONE'S business, dear.

...plus, having you pinheads illustrate my point about democrat hypocrisy is... well, pretty priceless to me. I didn't realize how much I missed this! :)
 
Or maybe, just maybe the people that did vote were as yet uninformted about the details of the election system. Maybe they were the uninformd voters of the primary. What would have happened in those states if the informed voters had also voted?
 
Desh said:
Or maybe, just maybe the people that did vote were as yet uninformted about the details of the election system. Maybe they were the uninformd voters of the primary. What would have happened in those states if the informed voters had also voted?
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I don't even know what you are talking about here. You mean the voters who were informed their vote wouldn't be counted, what if they had voted? You have a good point for why the original vote is not legitimate, but this means you must disenfranchise those who legitimately exercised their right to vote. No one votes with the presumption it doesn't mean anything or will not count, that is absurd. Yet that is the spin Onceler wants us to swallow, and you want us to adopt some form of "telepathic democracy" by which we determine how voters would have voted if they were as smart as you.

I suppose you do make a valid point, if the Democrat voters were more educated on how the Democratic party selects it's nominee, they would clearly understand their vote doesn't matter anyway, it is all up to who the Liberal Elites want nominated, and they should just shut up and wait until November so they can defeat Republicans with whatever the Liberal Elites pick for them. That's how Democracy works with Liberals, and the sooner they are all educated about this process, the better, right?
 
I dunno what Dixie is smoking here. As a Republican, I don't have a bone in this fight, so why should he??? I mean, the Dems could straighten this mess out with a Great Purge and I'd just shrug and roll my eyes (and grab the TV remote). Sure, I'd rather run against Hillary, which is why I gave her money (and now am on her e-mailing list as a result), but my world doesn't revolve around what morons in Michigan and Florida do. I think Floridans have already proven to the world that they are dumbasses, so why all the shock and awe?

In the meanwhile, I am speculating on whether Hillary can derail the convention by conspiring to get Edwards nominated with the promise that he runs with her. Not only would that piss everyone and their mother off, but it would make for more good TV (ala 1968).
 
Desh said:
I do want every vote to count. I want every person in Mi and FLs vote to count.

The thing is I want everyone who did not go vote that day because they were told that it would not be considered a vote to be able to have their vote now count too.

The only way to do this is to revote both states.

If we can not revote both states then we have to give wieght to the people who did not vote because they were told it was not really a vote.

How do you do this?

You give some of the votes to the guy who is still also in the race besides Hillary and that is Obama.

Its either that for do what the party said it would do and what Clinton and Obama signed and agreed to and not count any of these votes.

They are voting for who might take the position and not who WILL take the position so it does not matter as much as FL 2000 election. These people in FL and MI still have a chance to vote for president in the end dont they?

You are making such a fuss about what is not your business Dixie. Go fix your own damn party and let us fix ours. Your morals are the kind we DONT want applied to our party in the first place.
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Sorry Desh, but that is utter CRAP....The democratic party in both Michigan and in florida spent boocoos of money sending out booklets explaining it all and grass roots efforts telling ALL OF THEIR VOTERS to come out and vote, how important it was to vote, that their voices would be heard, even that their delegates would be seated....

The public was told, period.

THEY KNEW HOW IMPORTANT IT WAS to come out and vote.

AND THEY DID.

those that did come out and vote should NOT be punished by those that CHOSE not to, even when they were TOLD how IMPORTANT it was to do such...by the media, by the Party, by their representatives, by their governor...

It is simply a lie started by the Obama camp, to give reason to diminish the private, individual's vote, that did cast it....

period...

Desh, you have turned in to a Bushite, only in disguise with an Obama flag pin.

Becareful my friend....there are no gods on earth...your guy is extremely flawed, with dirty dealings from here to kingdom come...yes desh, dirty, dirty dirty and a huge huge Liar....hE IS NO CHANGE, COMING TO WASHINGTON, he personifies Washington DC....

Pretend for a second he is Bush, and do the leg work for yourself this time, you will see what I am talking about if you do...

if you don't do the leg work desh, and open your eyes, then you have brought yourself to the level of a Bushite, a blind one.

And I am sorry I am being so harsh, but my RESEARCH ON OBAMA has brought me to cast a vote against him, as the weaker candidate that he is, and yes, even less trustworthy than the Clintons...

I would rather have someone stab me in the back that I know will stab me in the back, than someone who says HE WILL NOT Stab me in the back while his knife is being twisted in me as stabbing me in the back....

Unless Obama is able to make it thru some serious vetting on things and truthfully comes out smelling better than he does at this point, he will not get my vote, I will pass all together, or write in someone....THIS IS HOW SERIOUS this is Desh...this is not about me supporting Hillary more than it really is about me not trusting or supporting him from all of my research.

So, for now we will have to agree to disagree on candidate choices.


care
 
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Desh said:
http://blogs.wsj.com/numbersguy/how-many-florida-and-michigan-voters-were-silenced-294/

heres some numbers on who did and didnt show up that day.
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it's a blog desh....

regardless, they CHOSE NOT TO VOTE....

THOSE that CHOSE to vote, should NOT be penalized for voters that chose not to vote, for WHATEVER reason they chose to personally not vote....

for centuries, more than 50% of our eligible voters DO NOT VOTE for whatever their reason, they do not go to the polls on election day...could be they are disgusted with the candidates, could be they are disgusted with their party, it could be they got stuck at work, it could be their child is sick...

But for whatever reason they do not show up to vote....NEVER EVER ARE THE PEOPLE THAT DO SHOW UP TO VOTE PENALIZED FOR DOING THEIR CIVIC DUTY.

You are going MAD, absolutely MAD... :clink:just :D to support your candidate when YOUR CANDIDATE is on the wrong side of the fence with this issue....

Our Individual vote, is our voice in our own sovereignty....one of the MOST important thing in a Democratic Republic....the DNC tried to F- with that and they broke their own DNC Charter by stripping Florida and Michigan according to the lawyers that testified....they did this OUT OF ARROGANCE and their power hungriness and out of their lack of leadership in diplomacy and FAIRNESS for all of the states that do not get to pick who they want as a candidate when they get to vote, because the ELITISTLY CHOSEN early states ALWAYS make the decision.

OBAMA, as the good ole boys insider, CHOSE TO GO AGAINST THE CITIZEN and with the INSIDERS....the DNC and the elitist early state system....

he did not take the proper stand on this issue and ONLY for partisan reasons, plus he cheated by breaking his pledge and broke the DNC 2008 Primary rules by runnung 2 weeks worth of campaign advertising in Florida on TV, before the Florida Primary....

And his pledge nor the rules said that the candidates should pull their names off the ballot...he KNEW he was loosing bigtime in Michigan SO HE CHOSE FOR POLITICAL PURPOSES to take his name off the ballot, so he could PANDER TO IOWA and other early states, showing them how much he is WITH THEM BEING THE ELITIST STATES that get to determine the candidate...yahdeedah...

Hillary stated sucsinctly to the reporter sent to ask her why she did not take her name off the ballot she said BECAUSE I WANT THE VOICES OF THE PEOPLE IN MICHIGAN TO BE HEARD AND SHE FELT MICHIGAN WAS AN IMPORTANT STATE and all kinds of things of why she felt their vote should be counted BUT THE DNC had ruled recently that they would NOT COUNT, so when the girl was cornering she said what the DNC said...that they would not count.....but there ALSO WERE APPEALS desh on the table from the beginning with these states to get their delegates seated....Hillary knew this, Obama knew this...

the appeals, like todays hearings is NOT something the Hillary camp brought on as the Obama liars are saying, it is IN THE RULES....not changing the rules but in the rules???? I don't know what the heck has happened to ALL of you, but I feel like I am livving in some dejavue, only now with all of you Obmaites switched with the Bushites, LAP LICKING your candidate, at all costs and to tell ya the truth, it is SCAREY AS SHIT!

What ever happened to doing and saying what is RIGHT AND JUST AND TRUE, regardless of the candidate?

Obama ALSO CHOSE not to allow himself to get credit if he were a WRITE in...he CHOSE not to fill out the application that Michigan needed by law to add him as a write in...BUT HE REFUSED...HE DID NOT WANT Michigan to EVER COUNT, BECAUSE this is is AMMO on winning elections...he tries to disqualify his opponents on technicalities, on things like this....and if disenfranchising the voter is how to get there, THIS IS WHAT HE DOES AND HAS DONE in the past...he used republican tactics to do it, in Illinois....ran uncontested after he got the other guy pushed out through technicalities and lawyers, and the very people he got disenfranchised were the people he was a part of signing up in a voter drive he was a part of....scummy....

The people's vote does not matter to him and THIS CONFIRMS IT...

he personifies DC...and his lobbying tit for tats marvel the Clintons desh...

do a google on Obama Lies, Obama financial supporters, Obama 1996 Dirty Tricks, Obama Chicago style politics, Obama Daley, Obama rezko, Obama Lobbyists, Obama Wright, Obama Ayres, Obama Farakhan, 58 Obama Lies, top ten Obama lies....

Not all of the stuff is true I am certain, but NOT ALL OF THE STUFF IS WRONG EITHER Desh...and I followed up to see what was true or not true with looking for othersides of the story and other confirmations...

Btw do a google on the Michigan democratic rules for the 2008 primary...

They sent out an informative booklet to all of their voters and ran media ads, telling voters to vote and that if voting for obama or biden or edwards it was imprtant not to write their names in, but to check the undecided box because by their laws, since the candidates that withdrew their names by choice, also chose to not have their names available as write ins, and unless the undecided box was chosen they would not have the proper recognized delegates given....they spoke of their delegates being seated desh, after the supposed dnc ruling that was really illegal in the first place is the argument the State of Florida's Lawyers gave...and it all made sense...the DNC Charter/ constitution says that all 50 states delegates "shall" be seated at the convention...

the DNC was out of bounds to sanction all of the delegates...preventing candidates from campaigning there they could do...but they could NOT STRIP THE STATES of all of their delegates...they made an ilinformed, arrogant decision to do what they did...
 
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Moral of the Story: Non-Clintonistas are lazy, and won't do anything for themselves. Sounds to me like Obama better represents the party then...
 
Did you know that the Democratic Party DOES NOT allocate their Delegates by population, by how the people actually vote?

Another screwed up thing...where they control the vote, moreso than the people that vote....
 
"do a google on Obama Lies, Obama financial supporters, Obama 1996 Dirty Tricks, Obama Chicago style politics, Obama Daley, Obama rezko, Obama Lobbyists, Obama Wright, Obama Ayres, Obama Farakhan, 58 Obama Lies, top ten Obama lies.... "

Jesus, Care - you sound similar to someone like indisputable...
 
they are fricking favoring Obama on this deal, they want it done, even if they themselves are breaking their own rules....

:(
 
Onceler said:
"do a google on Obama Lies, Obama financial supporters, Obama 1996 Dirty Tricks, Obama Chicago style politics, Obama Daley, Obama rezko, Obama Lobbyists, Obama Wright, Obama Ayres, Obama Farakhan, 58 Obama Lies, top ten Obama lies.... "

Jesus, Care - you sound similar to someone like indisputable...
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do it onceler, before you prejudge...

is it too scarey to find out things you don't want to know?

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, like i have said....this is like dejavue... :eek:
 
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