Obama: We must have a civilian force as strong as the military...

Damocles said:
Thanks for talking for "nobody" as they are an underrepresented group on this site, but the reality remains that in no way could a "Security Force" be interpreted to mean the Peace Corps except by the most spectacular bathwater sippers ever brought to bear.

That "interpretation" is a desperate attempt to find some reason for this insanity.
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Well, that's all well and good, but what he said was a "national security force" and what is clear from the speech and his campaign generally is that he takes a much wider view of "national security" than your narrow, myopic use of the term.

In short, "national security" means a whole hell of a lot more than you want to pretend it does.
 
Dungheap said:
Well, that's all well and good, but what he said was a "national security force" and what is clear from the speech and his campaign generally is that he takes a much wider view of "national security" than your narrow, myopic use of the term.

In short, "national security" means a whole hell of a lot more than you want to pretend it does.
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One more time.

A Security Force is not the Peace Corps.

I understand what you are saying, but the reality is he listed it separately because it is a separate thing. He was not saying the Peace Corps are part of a National Security Force. It is stupid to pretend that it is what he meant.
 
Do you remember, Dungheap, telling me that he never said it at all?

Now you attempt to spin it away.
 
Damocles said:
One more time.

A Security Force is not the Peace Corps.

I understand what you are saying, but the reality is he listed it separately because it is a separate thing. He was not saying the Peace Corps are part of a National Security Force. It is stupid to pretend that it is what he meant.
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No, it's obtuse to pretend otherwise. And quit capitalizing "National Security Force" as if he were talking about some singular entity as opposed to the various proposals he was talking about in that speech. The national security force he was talking about was the national service programs collectively.

Taking your groceries list analogy, it's as if your wife gave you a list that said:

Groceries

Eggs
Milk
Butter
Bread
K-Y
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And then got pissed when you brought home eggs, milk, butter, bread and K-Y but you didn't buy an item called "groceries."
 
Damocles said:
Do you remember, Dungheap, telling me that he never said it at all?

Now you attempt to spin it away.
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Check that thread again. I don't think I ever said he didn't say it. I said that he did say it but that he didn't mean what you claimed he meant, much as we are discussing here.
 
Dungheap said:
No, it's obtuse to pretend otherwise. And quit capitalizing "National Security Force" as if he were talking about some singular entity as opposed to the various proposals he was talking about in that speech. The national security force he was talking about was the national service programs collectively.

Taking your groceries list analogy, it's as if your wife gave you a list that said:



And then got pissed when you brought home eggs, milk, butter, bread and K-Y but you didn't buy an item called "groceries."
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Total Garbage.

He created a list called "Service"

On it he had.

Peace Corps
Soup Kitchens
National Security force as strong as the military
and others.

It was one item on a list of things one could do for "Service".

While I agree such a National Security Force would be Service, it is not the Peace Corps no matter how many times you try to sling that poop and try to make it stick to the ocean.

It is also a bad idea.
 
Damocles said:
Total Garbage.

He created a list called "Service"

On it he had.

Peace Corps
Soup Kitchens
National Security force as strong as the military
and others.

It was one item on a list of things one could do for "Service".

While I agree such a National Security Force would be Service, it is not the Peace Corps no matter how many times you try to sling that poop and try to make it stick to the ocean.

It is also a bad idea.
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OK, it's bad idea. I'm glad Obama isn't proposing such an entity.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree as to what he meant. I'm comfortable with the company I keep in that regard. I trust you can say the same.
 
AssHatZombie said:
He's talking about giving lots more citizens the authority to use force to accomplish goals of the military industrial complex. More fascism! You libs will bend over backwards to not see the truth.
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Where and when did he make this statement? Read what you want to read.... but I think your are spewing absolute nonsense.
 
Damocles said:
It was in the middle of a speech about "service".

The statement stood alone. It was surreal.
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Ok I just read the speach and then listened to the tape.

It did not stand alone and it wasnt surreal.

He was talking about how citizen service will make up a stronger country and that was wath he meant about the "civilian force".

It is really beneath you Damo to claim their was something nefarious about that statement.

Use your many talents and good sense to help the direction of this coutnry Damo, please dont use these tactics to just smear the intent, Help us design what he is talking about not just to stand in the way and keep the solutions from coming at all.
 
wow, you obama idolotors really learned from bush and his acolytes about redefining solidly defined words in to totally ambiguous meanings, like cutting up national forests as the 'healthy tree initiative' among other pieces of crap terms.

I'm ready for your militant asses. bring it on.
 
OK read the whole speach from top to bottom and then go watch the tape and tell me EXACTLY what you think it portends?
 
Desh said:
OK read the whole speach from top to bottom and then go watch the tape and tell me EXACTLY what you think it portends?
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He speaks of seeking to put all kids to "service" in one way or another. Then he lists the different types of "service" they can get into.

One item on that list was a "National Security Force as well funded and as strong as the military" (word for word folks).

The reality is the military currently holds about 2 Million of our best. The several types of service mentioned will be much larger as most people do not currently choose to "serve" in such a fashion. A Civilian Security Force as strong and as well funded as the military would not be large enough to have all of these people who are "serving" in it. It is just one item on a list of things he gave as examples. In fact, it was one that they weren't going to mention in the speech, it wasn't included and was only mentioned when he went off script.

The attempt to take a Security Force and pretend that it wasn't really a Security Force is pretense based on ideology.
 
Well, if Obama DID mean an armed branch of civilian service, then I'm gonna join. Maybe I'll get a full-auto FAL to take home.

But I do honestly believe his rhetoric was to imply that civil and community service is as important to national security as is the military - and as a "force" (ie: measure to project American power) needs to be manned and financed on the same level as the military.
 
Good Luck said:
Well, if Obama DID mean an armed branch of civilian service, then I'm gonna join. Maybe I'll get a full-auto FAL to take home.

But I do honestly believe his rhetoric was to imply that civil and community service is as important to national security as is the military - and as a "force" (ie: measure to project American power) needs to be manned and financed on the same level as the military.
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but SECURITY FORCE has an actual meaning. It doesn't mean community groups who play checkers, it means SECURITY FORCE.
 
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