Obamacare would outlaw individual private coverage.

People who file income-tax returns and opt not to get any insurance would pay a 2.5 % penalty on the difference between their adjusted gross income and the tax filing threshold.

so this covers all wage earners, not just those over 250k?


So far, there hasn't been a consensus between the House and Senate plans....what I find interesting is how anti-Obama pundits are trying to concrete doom and gloom over something that hasn't been finalized for review yet.

the simple fact that it's even being considered should allow for us all to give pause and criticize, if for nothing else than to let congress know that it's not to be tolerated.
 
so this covers all wage earners, not just those over 250k?




the simple fact that it's even being considered should allow for us all to give pause and criticize, if for nothing else than to let congress know that it's not to be tolerated.

So Obama lied again, and broke another campaign promise? No big deal to his supporters who live to increase the size of government and control as many aspects of our lives as possible
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
Well, here's where it stands now as far as I know that's being kicked around in the House:

People who file income-tax returns and opt not to get any insurance would pay a 2.5 % penalty on the difference between their adjusted gross income and the tax filing threshold. Businesses that don't have/offer a health plan but meet minimum standards would pay a penalty in the form of a payroll tax that would range from 2-8 % (adjusted per individual payroll)l.

People who make $280,000 or more ($350,000 for couples) would pay a progressive surtax ranging from 1% to 5.4%.

So far, there hasn't been a consensus between the House and Senate plans....what I find interesting is how anti-Obama pundits are trying to concrete doom and gloom over something that hasn't been finalized for review yet.


and I thought libs were syaing Obamacare would be optional Obviously, you haven't been paying attention, because the information I and others have provided PROVES that the individual choice between the gov't single payer and current private health insurance programs remains intact. This is why the term "willfully ignorant neocon parrots" is used so frequently...because neocons just ignore what they don't like and repeat themselves ad nauseum, throwing logic out the window.

Once again, libs are ignoring a basic economi principal - businesses do NOT pay taxes - WE PAY THEM. This is a tax on all of us 0 not just the so called rich

Once again, you make an erroneous statement...if you think that business owners don't pay taxes, then you haven't a clue as to how things work in this country. READ THE PREVIOUS CAREFULLY AND COMPREHENSIVELY...as it explains who pays what and when. Your generalized statement distorts the reality of the proposal.


If any business gets hit with this huge tax, they will either 1) cut workers, 2) raise prices, 3) close up. 4) Reduce investment and stop growing

If you had bothered to read the information CAREFULLY AND COMPREHENSIVELY, you would have noted that this tax affects business that DO NOT carry any type of health insurance for their employees, but meet a specific standard/requirement. So it's not ALL businesses, as you allude to. Since folk like you are always trumpeting the blessings and benefits of HMO's, then these companies would be keen to sign on, thus avoiding your dire predictions....or they could look to the gov't option.

Either way, it will have an adverse effect and continue the "hope and change" the US economy has enjoyed since Obama took office

As I pointed out, you haven't properly read or do not comprehend what is proposed, which is why your conclusion is wrong.
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
People who file income-tax returns and opt not to get any insurance would pay a 2.5 % penalty on the difference between their adjusted gross income and the tax filing threshold.

so this covers all wage earners, not just those over 250k?


No, go back and read what applies to the over 250K crowd. http://www.justplainpolitics.com/showpost.php?p=470680&postcount=77

Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
So far, there hasn't been a consensus between the House and Senate plans....what I find interesting is how anti-Obama pundits are trying to concrete doom and gloom over something that hasn't been finalized for review yet.

the simple fact that it's even being considered should allow for us all to give pause and criticize, if for nothing else than to let congress know that it's not to be tolerated.

That's your story....others have no problem with the changes. Hell, the final drafts with all the editing done by both parties hasn't even been done. Like I said, the alternative is a GOP plan that is essentially more of the same stuff that got us into this mess in the first place. THAT is just not acceptable.
 
Last edited:
That's your story....others have no problem with the changes. Hell, the final drafts with all the editing done by both parties hasn't even been done. Like I said, the alternative is a GOP plan that is essentially more of the same stuff that got us into this mess in the first place. THAT is just not acceptable.

The GOB has had ZERO input with the Hope and Change Express. Pelosi has shut them out in the House - and the R's are shut out in the Senate due to the Dems 60 vote margin

Dems now own the economy, so do not try and tag anything on the Republicans

It was Dem ideas that got us in the current mess we are in - and the Dems ideas will make things worse
 
The GOB has had ZERO input with the Hope and Change Express. Pelosi has shut them out in the House - and the R's are shut out in the Senate due to the Dems 60 vote margin

Pay attention mastermind.....in the post you are commenting on I was specifically referring to the economic mess left to us by the Shrub & company from the last 8 years. The record job losses and such tie directly to his reaganomics on steriods policies. And for the record, the Dem's didn't have a bullet proof voting margin until the Franken was confirmed, which was LAST WEEK. If you check the Congressional record, Repubs were at the table for the Obama Stimulus proposal and passage. Get informed before you type....makes you look less foolish.

Dems now own the economy, so do not try and tag anything on the Republicans Sorry genius, but only a complete asshole would try to divorce 8 years of economic policies from what's happening the first 7 months of 2009. The Dems now have the ball to try and fix the mess and will be held accountable for all failures and successes, but the mess they are trying to fix is the Shrub & companies....that is a matter of fact and history you can't change despite all the neocon repeated mantras and rhetoric.

It was Dem ideas that got us in the current mess we are in - and the Dems ideas will make things worse

See above responses, you willfully ignorant neocon parrot.
 
See above responses, you willfully ignorant neocon parrot.

Not this will matter to you - but the NY Times shows it was Eems who are responsible


Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending
By STEVEN A. HOLMES
Published: Thursday, September 30, 1999


In a move that could help increase home ownership rates among minorities and low-income consumers, the Fannie Mae Corporation is easing the credit requirements on loans that it will purchase from banks and other lenders.

The action, which will begin as a pilot program involving 24 banks in 15 markets -- including the New York metropolitan region -- will encourage those banks to extend home mortgages to individuals whose credit is generally not good enough to qualify for conventional loans. Fannie Mae officials say they hope to make it a nationwide program by next spring.

Fannie Mae, the nation's biggest underwriter of home mortgages, has been under increasing pressure from the Clinton Administration to expand mortgage loans among low and moderate income people and felt pressure from stock holders to maintain its phenomenal growth in profits.

In addition, banks, thrift institutions and mortgage companies have been pressing Fannie Mae to help them make more loans to so-called subprime borrowers. These borrowers whose incomes, credit ratings and savings are not good enough to qualify for conventional loans, can only get loans from finance companies that charge much higher interest rates -- anywhere from three to four percentage points higher than conventional loans.

''Fannie Mae has expanded home ownership for millions of families in the 1990's by reducing down payment requirements,'' said Franklin D. Raines, Fannie Mae's chairman and chief executive officer. ''Yet there remain too many borrowers whose credit is just a notch below what our underwriting has required who have been relegated to paying significantly higher mortgage rates in the so-called subprime market.''

Demographic information on these borrowers is sketchy. But at least one study indicates that 18 percent of the loans in the subprime market went to black borrowers, compared to 5 per cent of loans in the conventional loan market.

In moving, even tentatively, into this new area of lending, Fannie Mae is taking on significantly more risk, which may not pose any difficulties during flush economic times. But the government-subsidized corporation may run into trouble in an economic downturn, prompting a government rescue similar to that of the savings and loan industry in the 1980's.

''From the perspective of many people, including me, this is another thrift industry growing up around us,'' said Peter Wallison a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. ''If they fail, the government will have to step up and bail them out the way it stepped up and bailed out the thrift industry.''

Under Fannie Mae's pilot program, consumers who qualify can secure a mortgage with an interest rate one percentage point above that of a conventional, 30-year fixed rate mortgage of less than $240,000 -- a rate that currently averages about 7.76 per cent. If the borrower makes his or her monthly payments on time for two years, the one percentage point premium is dropped.

Fannie Mae, the nation's biggest underwriter of home mortgages, does not lend money directly to consumers. Instead, it purchases loans that banks make on what is called the secondary market. By expanding the type of loans that it will buy, Fannie Mae is hoping to spur banks to make more loans to people with less-than-stellar credit ratings.

Fannie Mae officials stress that the new mortgages will be extended to all potential borrowers who can qualify for a mortgage. But they add that the move is intended in part to increase the number of minority and low income home owners who tend to have worse credit ratings than non-Hispanic whites.

Home ownership has, in fact, exploded among minorities during the economic boom of the 1990's. The number of mortgages extended to Hispanic applicants jumped by 87.2 per cent from 1993 to 1998, according to Harvard University's Joint Center for Housing Studies. During that same period the number of African Americans who got mortgages to buy a home increased by 71.9 per cent and the number of Asian Americans by 46.3 per cent.

In contrast, the number of non-Hispanic whites who received loans for homes increased by 31.2 per cent.

Despite these gains, home ownership rates for minorities continue to lag behind non-Hispanic whites, in part because blacks and Hispanics in particular tend to have on average worse credit ratings.

In July, the Department of Housing and Urban Development proposed that by the year 2001, 50 percent of Fannie Mae's and Freddie Mac's portfolio be made up of loans to low and moderate-income borrowers. Last year, 44 percent of the loans Fannie Mae purchased were from these groups.

The change in policy also comes at the same time that HUD is investigating allegations of racial discrimination in the automated underwriting systems used by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to determine the credit-worthiness of credit applicants.

http://www.nytimes.com/1999/09/30/business/fannie-mae-eases-credit-to-aid-mortgage-lending.html
 
and Pres Bush tried to tighten the requirements back - Dems opposed


New Agency Proposed to Oversee Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae
By STEPHEN LABATON
The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago.

Under the plan, disclosed at a Congressional hearing today, a new agency would be created within the Treasury Department to assume supervision of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the government-sponsored companies that are the two largest players in the mortgage lending industry.

The new agency would have the authority, which now rests with Congress, to set one of the two capital-reserve requirements for the companies. It would exercise authority over any new lines of business. And it would determine whether the two are adequately managing the risks of their ballooning portfolios.

The plan is an acknowledgment by the administration that oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- which together have issued more than $1.5 trillion in outstanding debt -- is broken. A report by outside investigators in July concluded that Freddie Mac manipulated its accounting to mislead investors, and critics have said Fannie Mae does not adequately hedge against rising interest rates.

''There is a general recognition that the supervisory system for housing-related government-sponsored enterprises neither has the tools, nor the stature, to deal effectively with the current size, complexity and importance of these enterprises,'' Treasury Secretary John W. Snow told the House Financial Services Committee in an appearance with Housing Secretary Mel Martinez, who also backed the plan.

Mr. Snow said that Congress should eliminate the power of the president to appoint directors to the companies, a sign that the administration is less concerned about the perks of patronage than it is about the potential political problems associated with any new difficulties arising at the companies.

The administration's proposal, which was endorsed in large part today by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, would not repeal the significant government subsidies granted to the two companies. And it does not alter the implicit guarantee that Washington will bail the companies out if they run into financial difficulty; that perception enables them to issue debt at significantly lower rates than their competitors. Nor would it remove the companies' exemptions from taxes and antifraud provisions of federal securities laws.

The proposal is the opening act in one of the biggest and most significant lobbying battles of the Congressional session.

After the hearing, Representative Michael G. Oxley, chairman of the Financial Services Committee, and Senator Richard Shelby, chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, announced their intention to draft legislation based on the administration's proposal. Industry executives said Congress could complete action on legislation before leaving for recess in the fall.

''The current regulator does not have the tools, or the mandate, to adequately regulate these enterprises,'' Mr. Oxley said at the hearing. ''We have seen in recent months that mismanagement and questionable accounting practices went largely unnoticed by the Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight,'' the independent agency that now regulates the companies.

''These irregularities, which have been going on for several years, should have been detected earlier by the regulator,'' he added.

The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight, which is part of the Department of Housing and Urban Development, was created by Congress in 1992 after the bailout of the savings and loan industry and concerns about regulation of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, which buy mortgages from lenders and repackage them as securities or hold them in their own portfolios.

At the time, the companies and their allies beat back efforts for tougher oversight by the Treasury Department, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation or the Federal Reserve. Supporters of the companies said efforts to regulate the lenders tightly under those agencies might diminish their ability to finance loans for lower-income families. This year, however, the chances of passing legislation to tighten the oversight are better than in the past.

Reflecting the changing political climate, both Fannie Mae and its leading rivals applauded the administration's package. The support from Fannie Mae came after a round of discussions between it and the administration and assurances from the Treasury that it would not seek to change the company's mission.

After those assurances, Franklin D. Raines, Fannie Mae's chief executive, endorsed the shift of regulatory oversight to the Treasury Department, as well as other elements of the plan.

''We welcome the administration's approach outlined today,'' Mr. Raines said. The company opposes some smaller elements of the package, like one that eliminates the authority of the president to appoint 5 of the company's 18 board members.

Company executives said that the company preferred having the president select some directors. The company is also likely to lobby against the efforts that give regulators too much authority to approve its products.

Freddie Mac, whose accounting is under investigation by the Securities and Exchange Commission and a United States attorney in Virginia, issued a statement calling the administration plan a ''responsible proposal.''

The stocks of Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae fell while the prices of their bonds generally rose. Shares of Freddie Mac fell $2.04, or 3.7 percent, to $53.40, while Fannie Mae was down $1.62, or 2.4 percent, to $66.74. The price of a Fannie Mae bond due in March 2013 rose to 97.337 from 96.525.Its yield fell to 4.726 percent from 4.835 percent on Tuesday.

Fannie Mae, which was previously known as the Federal National Mortgage Association, and Freddie Mac, which was the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation, have been criticized by rivals for exerting too much influence over their regulators.

''The regulator has not only been outmanned, it has been outlobbied,'' said Representative Richard H. Baker, the Louisiana Republican who has proposed legislation similar to the administration proposal and who leads a subcommittee that oversees the companies. ''Being underfunded does not explain how a glowing report of Freddie's operations was released only hours before the managerial upheaval that followed. This is not world-class regulatory work.''

Significant details must still be worked out before Congress can approve a bill. Among the groups denouncing the proposal today were the National Association of Home Builders and Congressional Democrats who fear that tighter regulation of the companies could sharply reduce their commitment to financing low-income and affordable housing.

''These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''

Representative Melvin L. Watt, Democrat of North Carolina, agreed.

''I don't see much other than a shell game going on here, moving something from one agency to another and in the process weakening the bargaining power of poorer families and their ability to get affordable housing,'' Mr. Watt said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/11/b...d-fannie-mae.html?sec=&spon=&pagewanted=print
 
Not this will matter to you - but the NY Times shows it was Eems who are responsible


Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending
By STEVEN A. HOLMES
Published: Thursday, September 30, 1999


In a move that could help increase home ownership rates among minorities and low-income consumers, the Fannie Mae Corporation is easing the credit requirements on loans that it will purchase from banks and other lenders.

The action, which will begin as a pilot program involving 24 banks in 15 markets -- including the New York metropolitan region -- will encourage those banks to extend home mortgages to individuals whose credit is generally not good enough to qualify for conventional loans. Fannie Mae officials say they hope to make it a nationwide program by next spring.

Fannie Mae, the nation's biggest underwriter of home mortgages, has been under increasing pressure from the Clinton Administration to expand mortgage loans among low and moderate income people and felt pressure from stock holders to maintain its phenomenal growth in profits.

In addition, banks, thrift institutions and mortgage companies have been pressing Fannie Mae to help them make more loans to so-called subprime borrowers. These borrowers whose incomes, credit ratings and savings are not good enough to qualify for conventional loans, can only get loans from finance companies that charge much higher interest rates -- anywhere from three to four percentage points higher than conventional loans.

''Fannie Mae has expanded home ownership for millions of families in the 1990's by reducing down payment requirements,'' said Franklin D. Raines, Fannie Mae's chairman and chief executive officer. ''Yet there remain too many borrowers whose credit is just a notch below what our underwriting has required who have been relegated to paying significantly higher mortgage rates in the so-called subprime market.''

Demographic information on these borrowers is sketchy. But at least one study indicates that 18 percent of the loans in the subprime market went to black borrowers, compared to 5 per cent of loans in the conventional loan market.

In moving, even tentatively, into this new area of lending, Fannie Mae is taking on significantly more risk, which may not pose any difficulties during flush economic times. But the government-subsidized corporation may run into trouble in an economic downturn, prompting a government rescue similar to that of the savings and loan industry in the 1980's.

''From the perspective of many people, including me, this is another thrift industry growing up around us,'' said Peter Wallison a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. ''If they fail, the government will have to step up and bail them out the way it stepped up and bailed out the thrift industry.''

Under Fannie Mae's pilot program, consumers who qualify can secure a mortgage with an interest rate one percentage point above that of a conventional, 30-year fixed rate mortgage of less than $240,000 -- a rate that currently averages about 7.76 per cent. If the borrower makes his or her monthly payments on time for two years, the one percentage point premium is dropped.

Fannie Mae, the nation's biggest underwriter of home mortgages, does not lend money directly to consumers. Instead, it purchases loans that banks make on what is called the secondary market. By expanding the type of loans that it will buy, Fannie Mae is hoping to spur banks to make more loans to people with less-than-stellar credit ratings.

Fannie Mae officials stress that the new mortgages will be extended to all potential borrowers who can qualify for a mortgage. But they add that the move is intended in part to increase the number of minority and low income home owners who tend to have worse credit ratings than non-Hispanic whites.

Home ownership has, in fact, exploded among minorities during the economic boom of the 1990's. The number of mortgages extended to Hispanic applicants jumped by 87.2 per cent from 1993 to 1998, according to Harvard University's Joint Center for Housing Studies. During that same period the number of African Americans who got mortgages to buy a home increased by 71.9 per cent and the number of Asian Americans by 46.3 per cent.

In contrast, the number of non-Hispanic whites who received loans for homes increased by 31.2 per cent.

Despite these gains, home ownership rates for minorities continue to lag behind non-Hispanic whites, in part because blacks and Hispanics in particular tend to have on average worse credit ratings.

In July, the Department of Housing and Urban Development proposed that by the year 2001, 50 percent of Fannie Mae's and Freddie Mac's portfolio be made up of loans to low and moderate-income borrowers. Last year, 44 percent of the loans Fannie Mae purchased were from these groups.

The change in policy also comes at the same time that HUD is investigating allegations of racial discrimination in the automated underwriting systems used by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to determine the credit-worthiness of credit applicants.

http://www.nytimes.com/1999/09/30/business/fannie-mae-eases-credit-to-aid-mortgage-lending.html


And in case you ever decide to read BEYOND what appeals to your ideals and catch up since 1999, you should note the following:

http://newsone.blackplanet.com/nati...ic-crisis-and-the-community-reinvestment-act/

http://mediamatters.org/research/200812230007?f=h_latest

 
We will reform health care. It will happen this year. I'm absolutely convinced of that.

This is a problem we can no longer wait to fix. Deferring reform is nothing more than defending the status quo, and those who would oppose our efforts should take a hard look at just what it is they're defending. Over the last decade, health insurance premiums have risen three times faster than wages. Deductibles and out-of-pocket costs are skyrocketing. And every single day we wait to act, thousands of Americans lose their insurance, some turning to nurses in the emergency room as their only recourse.

So make no mistake: The status quo on health care is not an option for the United States of America. It is threatening the financial stability of our families, our businesses, and government itself. It is unsustainable.

This is an issue that affects the health and financial well-being of every single American and the stability of our entire economy. By helping improve quality and efficiency, the reforms we make will help bring our deficits under control in the long-term.

This is what the debate in Congress is all about: Whether we'll keep talking and tinkering and letting this problem fester as more families and businesses go under, and more Americans lose their coverage. Or whether we'll seize this opportunity, one we might not have again for generations, and finally pass health insurance reform this year, in 2009.

If you like your doctor or health care provider, you can keep them. If you like your health care plan, you can keep that too.

But here's what else reform will mean for you: you'll save money. If you lose your job, change your job, or start a new business, you'll still be able to find quality health insurance you can afford.

If you have a preexisting medical condition, no insurance company will be able to deny you coverage.

You won't have to worry about being priced out of the market. You won't have to worry about one illness leading your family into financial ruin. That's what reform means.

Thanks to the work of key committees in Congress, we are now closer to the goal of health reform than we have ever been. This progress should make us hopeful, but it shouldn't make us complacent. It should instead provide the urgency for both the House and the Senate to finish their critical work on health reform before the August recess.
 
and Pres Bush tried to tighten the requirements back - Dems opposed


New Agency Proposed to Oversee Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae
By STEPHEN LABATON
The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago.

Under the plan, disclosed at a Congressional hearing today, a new agency would be created within the Treasury Department to assume supervision of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the government-sponsored companies that are the two largest players in the mortgage lending industry.

The new agency would have the authority, which now rests with Congress, to set one of the two capital-reserve requirements for the companies. It would exercise authority over any new lines of business. And it would determine whether the two are adequately managing the risks of their ballooning portfolios.

The plan is an acknowledgment by the administration that oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- which together have issued more than $1.5 trillion in outstanding debt -- is broken. A report by outside investigators in July concluded that Freddie Mac manipulated its accounting to mislead investors, and critics have said Fannie Mae does not adequately hedge against rising interest rates.

''There is a general recognition that the supervisory system for housing-related government-sponsored enterprises neither has the tools, nor the stature, to deal effectively with the current size, complexity and importance of these enterprises,'' Treasury Secretary John W. Snow told the House Financial Services Committee in an appearance with Housing Secretary Mel Martinez, who also backed the plan.

Mr. Snow said that Congress should eliminate the power of the president to appoint directors to the companies, a sign that the administration is less concerned about the perks of patronage than it is about the potential political problems associated with any new difficulties arising at the companies.

The administration's proposal, which was endorsed in large part today by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, would not repeal the significant government subsidies granted to the two companies. And it does not alter the implicit guarantee that Washington will bail the companies out if they run into financial difficulty; that perception enables them to issue debt at significantly lower rates than their competitors. Nor would it remove the companies' exemptions from taxes and antifraud provisions of federal securities laws.

The proposal is the opening act in one of the biggest and most significant lobbying battles of the Congressional session.

After the hearing, Representative Michael G. Oxley, chairman of the Financial Services Committee, and Senator Richard Shelby, chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, announced their intention to draft legislation based on the administration's proposal. Industry executives said Congress could complete action on legislation before leaving for recess in the fall.

''The current regulator does not have the tools, or the mandate, to adequately regulate these enterprises,'' Mr. Oxley said at the hearing. ''We have seen in recent months that mismanagement and questionable accounting practices went largely unnoticed by the Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight,'' the independent agency that now regulates the companies.

''These irregularities, which have been going on for several years, should have been detected earlier by the regulator,'' he added.

The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight, which is part of the Department of Housing and Urban Development, was created by Congress in 1992 after the bailout of the savings and loan industry and concerns about regulation of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, which buy mortgages from lenders and repackage them as securities or hold them in their own portfolios.

At the time, the companies and their allies beat back efforts for tougher oversight by the Treasury Department, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation or the Federal Reserve. Supporters of the companies said efforts to regulate the lenders tightly under those agencies might diminish their ability to finance loans for lower-income families. This year, however, the chances of passing legislation to tighten the oversight are better than in the past.

Reflecting the changing political climate, both Fannie Mae and its leading rivals applauded the administration's package. The support from Fannie Mae came after a round of discussions between it and the administration and assurances from the Treasury that it would not seek to change the company's mission.

After those assurances, Franklin D. Raines, Fannie Mae's chief executive, endorsed the shift of regulatory oversight to the Treasury Department, as well as other elements of the plan.

''We welcome the administration's approach outlined today,'' Mr. Raines said. The company opposes some smaller elements of the package, like one that eliminates the authority of the president to appoint 5 of the company's 18 board members.

Company executives said that the company preferred having the president select some directors. The company is also likely to lobby against the efforts that give regulators too much authority to approve its products.

Freddie Mac, whose accounting is under investigation by the Securities and Exchange Commission and a United States attorney in Virginia, issued a statement calling the administration plan a ''responsible proposal.''

The stocks of Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae fell while the prices of their bonds generally rose. Shares of Freddie Mac fell $2.04, or 3.7 percent, to $53.40, while Fannie Mae was down $1.62, or 2.4 percent, to $66.74. The price of a Fannie Mae bond due in March 2013 rose to 97.337 from 96.525.Its yield fell to 4.726 percent from 4.835 percent on Tuesday.

Fannie Mae, which was previously known as the Federal National Mortgage Association, and Freddie Mac, which was the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation, have been criticized by rivals for exerting too much influence over their regulators.

''The regulator has not only been outmanned, it has been outlobbied,'' said Representative Richard H. Baker, the Louisiana Republican who has proposed legislation similar to the administration proposal and who leads a subcommittee that oversees the companies. ''Being underfunded does not explain how a glowing report of Freddie's operations was released only hours before the managerial upheaval that followed. This is not world-class regulatory work.''

Significant details must still be worked out before Congress can approve a bill. Among the groups denouncing the proposal today were the National Association of Home Builders and Congressional Democrats who fear that tighter regulation of the companies could sharply reduce their commitment to financing low-income and affordable housing.

''These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''

Representative Melvin L. Watt, Democrat of North Carolina, agreed.

''I don't see much other than a shell game going on here, moving something from one agency to another and in the process weakening the bargaining power of poorer families and their ability to get affordable housing,'' Mr. Watt said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/11/b...d-fannie-mae.html?sec=&spon=&pagewanted=print

Sorry genius, but this has been done to death. FYI:

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/underpants/129

http://mediamatters.org/research/200809210007
 

So the Dem Underground and Media Matters are better sources then the actual words of the Obamacare bill?

There is a pattern here. Dems want to rush this bill thru as fast as they can so we the voters, do not know what the hell is in it

This is same thing they did with the mega pork stimulus bill

Dems do indeed want to put private health care ins companies out of business - making the Federal government the only is compnay people and companies can get their coverage from

Dems only want more power and bigger government, and will tax all of us to the max to try and pay for it
 
From the NY Times


Governors Fear Medicaid Costs in Health Plan


BILOXI, Miss. — The nation’s governors, Democrats as well as Republicans, voiced deep concern Sunday about the shape of the health care plan emerging from Congress, fearing that Washington was about to hand them expensive new Medicaid obligations without money to pay for them.

The role of the states in a restructured health care system dominated the summer meeting of the National Governors Association here this weekend — with bipartisan animosity voiced against the plan during a closed-door luncheon on Saturday and in a private meeting on Sunday with the health and human services secretary, Kathleen Sebelius.

“I think the governors would all agree that what we don’t want from the federal government is unfunded mandates,” said Gov. Jim Douglas of Vermont, a Republican, the group’s incoming chairman. “We can’t have the Congress impose requirements that we are forced to absorb beyond our capacity to do so.”

The governors’ backlash creates yet another health care headache for the Obama administration, which has tried to recruit state leaders to pressure members of Congress to wrap up their fitful negotiations. Both Ms. Sebelius, who was Kansas’ governor before she joined the cabinet in April, and the federal Medicaid chief, Cindy Mann, made appearances at the meeting on Sunday. Meanwhile, other administration officials spent the day pushing President Obama’s proposal on television talk shows.

Mr. Obama also plans to address questions about his health plan at a news conference on Wednesday evening.

Ms. Sebelius emerged from her hour-long meeting with the governors saying that “there’s a recognition that states don’t have cash right now” and that “it’s difficult to send states the bill if they don’t have the money.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/20/health/policy/20health.html?_r=1&ref=politics
 
So the Dem Underground and Media Matters are better sources then the actual words of the Obamacare bill?

There is a pattern here. Dems want to rush this bill thru as fast as they can so we the voters, do not know what the hell is in it

This is same thing they did with the mega pork stimulus bill

Dems do indeed want to put private health care ins companies out of business - making the Federal government the only is compnay people and companies can get their coverage from

Dems only want more power and bigger government, and will tax all of us to the max to try and pay for it

Absolutely. It's all a power grab. There isn't a tax the Dems don't like. They are treading on dangerous terrority when they try to put more taxes on businesses. What will happen, businesses will pass it on to the consumer, or close their doors or move their business to other countries. Enough is enough.
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
Sorry genius, but this has been done to death. FYI:

http://journals.democraticundergroun...underpants/129

http://mediamatters.org/research/200809210007

So the Dem Underground and Media Matters are better sources then the actual words of the Obamacare bill?

Did you actually READ the DOCUMENTED INFORMATION contained? And if you did, what can you logically/factually disprove or refute? Stop BS'ing and actually make a decent rebuttal.

There is a pattern here. Dems want to rush this bill thru as fast as they can so we the voters, do not know what the hell is in it

As opposed to the Shrub's many midnight fast shuffles? Get a clue, genius. Pushing a bill through so the opposition can't do much damage to it is par for the course in Congress. I didn't hear a damned thing from you neocon numbskulls when Tom Delay and company were strong arming bills through Congress and we the people were the last to get the details. However, as it stands now, the people are getting a little more info than normal...thanks to the many sources leaking to alternative news sources.

This is same thing they did with the mega pork stimulus bill

Once again, you keep treating your opinion as fact, and then build on it while ignoring any contrary information.

Dems do indeed want to put private health care ins companies out of business - making the Federal government the only is compnay people and companies can get their coverage from

Stop parroting the same old neocon BS....I posted proof positive that what you say here is a LIE. There is a choice, and if the HMO's are so scared of competition, then maybe they should CHANGE some of their policies to compete. That's what it's all about, right bunky? UPS and FedEx are doing just fine against the US Postal Service, you know.

Dems only want more power and bigger government, and will tax all of us to the max to try and pay for it

Braying like a neocon ass doesn't win the debate, genius. If you can't disprove the FACTS I put forth, then STFU.
 
Getting testy along with your racism? Must be that time of the month. *shrug*

Poor Southie....I prove what a willfully ignorant neocon clown you are at every turn, and it frustrates you so that your only recourse is to follow me around and throw rocks.

Like you, Red State is just another neocon who can't defend his position beyond repetiton of headline talking points.

Oh, and by the way, have you found an explanation as to why Hannity, Limbaugh, Crowley, Beck, Buchannan, Malkin, Murdoch are labeled neocons despite not fitting your criteria (i.e., non-Jewish)? Because if you can't, then you're just full of it. Carry on.
 
Poor Southie....I prove what a willfully ignorant neocon clown you are at every turn, and it frustrates you so that your only recourse is to follow me around and throw rocks.

Like you, Red State is just another neocon who can't defend his position beyond repetiton of headline talking points.

Oh, and by the way, have you found an explanation as to why Hannity, Limbaugh, Crowley, Beck, Buchannan, Malkin, Murdoch are labeled neocons despite not fitting your criteria (i.e., non-Jewish)? Because if you can't, then you're just full of it. Carry on.
Probably the same reason that someone would call a white guy nigger. *shrug*
 
Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
Poor Southie....I prove what a willfully ignorant neocon clown you are at every turn, and it frustrates you so that your only recourse is to follow me around and throw rocks.

Like you, Red State is just another neocon who can't defend his position beyond repetiton of headline talking points.

Oh, and by the way, have you found an explanation as to why Hannity, Limbaugh, Crowley, Beck, Buchannan, Malkin, Murdoch are labeled neocons despite not fitting your criteria (i.e., non-Jewish)? Because if you can't, then you're just full of it. Carry on.

Probably the same reason that someone would call a white guy nigger. *shrug*

Really? So in your excuse for a mind, new conservatives are all jews, neocon (an abbreviation for new conservative) is a "code word" for a racial slur....yet all the non-jewish pundits that I mentioned above are being slurred by a jewish code word? And this is compared to "someone calling a white guy nigger"...although to date I have not heard of this practice beyond the drivel written by white supremacists like David Duke. Now of course, you'll spend an inordinate amount of time scanning the web for examples that will support your nonsense.....which is more time than you spend actually READING any material provided by me regarding the original topic of discussion. Like I said before Southie, you're just frustrated that you can't BS your way past me on these boards. You can have the last predictable claims and words if you're not going to adhere to a simple burden of proof.
 
Only the willfully ignorant would try to pass off the "democratic underground" or "media matters" as legitimate sources for news....and WTF is "newsone-blackplanet" ?

What a fuckin' joke.... if the cons source FOX news or a link to Drudge, we get crucified...

Its no wonder this Clarabell is card carrying member of the JACKASS PARTY....
 
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