Street Glider
Verified User
Remarkably, yeah.
But liberals still sought to blame him, and they did their level best to ensure that others didn't vote for Bush because of 9/11, despite the fact that he had nothing to do with it...
Republicans Need to Get Rid of Trump to Win in 2024
- Thread starter LurchAddams
- Start date
Remarkably, yeah.
But liberals still sought to blame him, and they did their level best to ensure that others didn't vote for Bush because of 9/11, despite the fact that he had nothing to do with it...
And Conservatives will blame Biden, but I’m not sure it will work.
Street Glider
Verified User
That's pretty much what I've been saying all along...
Geeko Sportivo
Verified User
SINCE DAY ONE of DOnald Trump's presidency, I have been baffled by one mystery: Why do working-class white men— the most reliable component of Donald Trump’s base— still support someone who is, by their own standards, the least masculine man ever to hold the modern presidency? The question is not whether Trump fails to meet some archaic or idealized version of masculinity. The president’s inability to measure up to Marcus Aurelius or Omar Bradley is not the issue. Rather, the question is why so many of Trump’s working-class white male voters refuse to hold Trump to their own standards of masculinity— why they support a man who behaves more like a little boy- or even beyond that- A LITTLE SPOILED RICH BRAT THAT NEVER GOT A SPANKING! Like the child you often hear screaming at the top of their lungs at the Grocery store because his MOMMY won't let him have some candy!
I am a son of the working class, and I know these cultural standards. The men I grew up with think of themselves as pretty tough guys, and most of them are. They are not the products of elite universities and cosmopolitan living. These are men whose fathers and grandfathers came from a culture that looks down upon lying, cheating, and bragging, especially about sex or courage.
Not every working-class male voted for Trump, and not all of them have these traits, of course. And I do not present these beliefs and attitudes as uniformly virtuous in themselves. Some of these traditional masculine virtues have a dark side: Toughness and dominance become bullying and abuse; self-reliance becomes isolation; silence becomes internalized rage. Rather, I am noting that courage, honesty, respect, an economy of words, a bit of modesty, and a willingness to take responsibility are all virtues prized by the self-identified class of hard-working men, the stand-up guys, among whom I was raised.
And yet, many of these same men expect none of those characteristics from Trump, who is a vain, cowardly, lying, vulgar, jabbering blowhard. Put another way, as a question I have asked many of the men I know: Is Trump a man your father and grandfather would have respected?
I should point out here that I am not criticizing Trump’s manifest lack of masculinity solely because he offends my personal sense of maleness. He does, of course. But then again, a lot about the president offends me, as a man, and as an American.
Trump behaves in ways that many working-class men would ridicule: “He wears bronzer, shits on a toilet made out of 24k solid Gold, is obsessed with his physical appearance (check out the strange comb-over folks), whines constantly, can't control his emotions, wags his wife around like a SEXUAL TROPHY, Said, "I would marry my daughter had she not been my daughter and BTW, SHE HAS NICE BEASTS". Real men would never make sexual comments about their daughters!
I am not a psychologist, BUT I AM WILLING TO TAKE A CLOSER LOOK! And though I cannot adjudicate the theories of male behavior that might explain some of this- Others have tried. Two researchers who looked back at the 2016 presidential election suggested that support for Trump was higher in areas where there were more internet searches for topics such as “erectile dysfunction,” “how to get girls,” and “penis enlargement” than in pro–Hillary Clinton areas of the country. (One can only hope that correlation is not causation.) The idea that insecure men support bullies and authoritarians is a sign of SEX GONE SOUR. To reduce all of this to sexual inadequacy, however, is too facile. It cannot explain why millions of men look the other way when Trump acts in ways they would typically find shameful. Nor is arguing that Trump is a bad person and therefore that the people who support him are either brainwashed or also bad people helpful. He is, and some of them are. But that doesn’t explain why men who would normally ostracize someone like Trump continue to embrace him.
In order to think about why these men support Trump, one must first grasp how deeply they are betraying their own definition of masculinity by looking more closely at the flaws they should, in principle, find revolting.
Is Trump honorable? This is a man who routinely refused to pay working people their due wages, and then lawyered them into the ground when they objected to being exploited. Trump is a rich downtown bully, the sort most working men usually hate. He has filed Bankrupt 6 times now, and leaving many investors holding the tab for millions upon millions of dollars they trusted to him, leaving workers and staff unpaid for their services and without paychecks. Yet he maintains a lavish lifestyle while floating his Billionaire status.
But even if we excuse Trump for the occasional hyperbole, the fact of the matter is that Trump is an obvious coward. He has two particular phobias: powerful men and intelligent women.
Whenever he is in the company of Russian President Vladimir Putin, to take the most cringe-inducing example, he visibly cowers. His attempts to ingratiate himself with Putin are embarrassing, especially given how effortlessly Putin can bend Trump to his will. When the Russian leader got Trump alone at a summit in Helsinki, he scared him so badly that at the subsequent joint press conference, Putin smiled pleasantly while the president of the United States publicly took the word of a former KGB officer over his own intelligence agencies.
Likewise, as Trump has shown repeatedly in the midst of the COVID-19 crisis, he is eager to criticize China, until he is asked about Chinese President Xi Jinping. In the course of the same few minutes, Trump will attack China—his preferred method for escaping responsibility for America’s disastrous response to the coronavirus pandemic—and then he will babble about how much he likes President Xi, desperately seeking to avoid giving offense to the Chinese Communist Party boss.
This is related to one of Trump’s most noticeable problems, which is that he can never stop talking. The old-school standard of masculinity is the strong and silent type, like Gary Cooper back in the day or Tom Hardy today. Trump, by comparison, is neither strong nor capable of silence.
And when Trump talks too much, he ends up saying things that more stereotypically masculine men wouldn’t, like that he fell in love with North Korea’s Kim Jong Un. “He wrote me beautiful letters, and they’re great letters,” Trump told a rally in West Virginia. “We fell in love.” One can only imagine the reaction among working-class white men if Barack Obama, or any other U.S. president, had talked about falling in love with a foreign leader. (George W. Bush once said he saw into Putin’s soul, and he has never lived it down among his critics.)
Is Trump a man who respects women? This is what secure and masculine men would expect, especially from a husband and a father of two daughters.
Leave aside for the moment that the working-class white men in the president’s base don’t seem to care that Trump had an affair with a porn star while his wife was home with a new baby, something for which many of them would probably beat their own brother-in-law senseless if he did it to their sister. Trump’s voters, male and female, have already decided to excuse this and other sordid episodes.
Sorry for my rant folks- BUT I AM MOST EMBARRASSED BY TRUMPTARDED MEN- EMBARRASSED FOR THEM- Embarrased for their wives and children as well!
I am a son of the working class, and I know these cultural standards. The men I grew up with think of themselves as pretty tough guys, and most of them are. They are not the products of elite universities and cosmopolitan living. These are men whose fathers and grandfathers came from a culture that looks down upon lying, cheating, and bragging, especially about sex or courage.
Not every working-class male voted for Trump, and not all of them have these traits, of course. And I do not present these beliefs and attitudes as uniformly virtuous in themselves. Some of these traditional masculine virtues have a dark side: Toughness and dominance become bullying and abuse; self-reliance becomes isolation; silence becomes internalized rage. Rather, I am noting that courage, honesty, respect, an economy of words, a bit of modesty, and a willingness to take responsibility are all virtues prized by the self-identified class of hard-working men, the stand-up guys, among whom I was raised.
And yet, many of these same men expect none of those characteristics from Trump, who is a vain, cowardly, lying, vulgar, jabbering blowhard. Put another way, as a question I have asked many of the men I know: Is Trump a man your father and grandfather would have respected?
I should point out here that I am not criticizing Trump’s manifest lack of masculinity solely because he offends my personal sense of maleness. He does, of course. But then again, a lot about the president offends me, as a man, and as an American.
Trump behaves in ways that many working-class men would ridicule: “He wears bronzer, shits on a toilet made out of 24k solid Gold, is obsessed with his physical appearance (check out the strange comb-over folks), whines constantly, can't control his emotions, wags his wife around like a SEXUAL TROPHY, Said, "I would marry my daughter had she not been my daughter and BTW, SHE HAS NICE BEASTS". Real men would never make sexual comments about their daughters!
I am not a psychologist, BUT I AM WILLING TO TAKE A CLOSER LOOK! And though I cannot adjudicate the theories of male behavior that might explain some of this- Others have tried. Two researchers who looked back at the 2016 presidential election suggested that support for Trump was higher in areas where there were more internet searches for topics such as “erectile dysfunction,” “how to get girls,” and “penis enlargement” than in pro–Hillary Clinton areas of the country. (One can only hope that correlation is not causation.) The idea that insecure men support bullies and authoritarians is a sign of SEX GONE SOUR. To reduce all of this to sexual inadequacy, however, is too facile. It cannot explain why millions of men look the other way when Trump acts in ways they would typically find shameful. Nor is arguing that Trump is a bad person and therefore that the people who support him are either brainwashed or also bad people helpful. He is, and some of them are. But that doesn’t explain why men who would normally ostracize someone like Trump continue to embrace him.
In order to think about why these men support Trump, one must first grasp how deeply they are betraying their own definition of masculinity by looking more closely at the flaws they should, in principle, find revolting.
Is Trump honorable? This is a man who routinely refused to pay working people their due wages, and then lawyered them into the ground when they objected to being exploited. Trump is a rich downtown bully, the sort most working men usually hate. He has filed Bankrupt 6 times now, and leaving many investors holding the tab for millions upon millions of dollars they trusted to him, leaving workers and staff unpaid for their services and without paychecks. Yet he maintains a lavish lifestyle while floating his Billionaire status.
But even if we excuse Trump for the occasional hyperbole, the fact of the matter is that Trump is an obvious coward. He has two particular phobias: powerful men and intelligent women.
Whenever he is in the company of Russian President Vladimir Putin, to take the most cringe-inducing example, he visibly cowers. His attempts to ingratiate himself with Putin are embarrassing, especially given how effortlessly Putin can bend Trump to his will. When the Russian leader got Trump alone at a summit in Helsinki, he scared him so badly that at the subsequent joint press conference, Putin smiled pleasantly while the president of the United States publicly took the word of a former KGB officer over his own intelligence agencies.
Likewise, as Trump has shown repeatedly in the midst of the COVID-19 crisis, he is eager to criticize China, until he is asked about Chinese President Xi Jinping. In the course of the same few minutes, Trump will attack China—his preferred method for escaping responsibility for America’s disastrous response to the coronavirus pandemic—and then he will babble about how much he likes President Xi, desperately seeking to avoid giving offense to the Chinese Communist Party boss.
This is related to one of Trump’s most noticeable problems, which is that he can never stop talking. The old-school standard of masculinity is the strong and silent type, like Gary Cooper back in the day or Tom Hardy today. Trump, by comparison, is neither strong nor capable of silence.
And when Trump talks too much, he ends up saying things that more stereotypically masculine men wouldn’t, like that he fell in love with North Korea’s Kim Jong Un. “He wrote me beautiful letters, and they’re great letters,” Trump told a rally in West Virginia. “We fell in love.” One can only imagine the reaction among working-class white men if Barack Obama, or any other U.S. president, had talked about falling in love with a foreign leader. (George W. Bush once said he saw into Putin’s soul, and he has never lived it down among his critics.)
Is Trump a man who respects women? This is what secure and masculine men would expect, especially from a husband and a father of two daughters.
Leave aside for the moment that the working-class white men in the president’s base don’t seem to care that Trump had an affair with a porn star while his wife was home with a new baby, something for which many of them would probably beat their own brother-in-law senseless if he did it to their sister. Trump’s voters, male and female, have already decided to excuse this and other sordid episodes.
Sorry for my rant folks- BUT I AM MOST EMBARRASSED BY TRUMPTARDED MEN- EMBARRASSED FOR THEM- Embarrased for their wives and children as well!
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Street Glider
Verified User
It seems to me that you're more interested in having a President who can do well in a street fight as opposed to someone who can be, you know, a President.
Now, I happen to agree with you regarding his conduct. He does act like a spoiled child at the mere hint of criticism or disagreement. But the fact of the matter is that we were in pretty good shape with him at the helm...
LurchAddams
There Can be Only One!
"Biden's poor performance on almost every front has shaken many liberal voters."
This is just wrong. His campaigning against the MAGAs destroying our democracy help halt the "red wave". Your statement can be proven objectively false. It's something you either heard on Fox News or it's your own personal fantasy. Democrats are going to continue to win elections as long as you throw your lot in with the white supremacists and election deniers.
LurchAddams
There Can be Only One!
I mean, the GOP should be owning the Senate now. Based on Biden's approval rating and the downturn in the economy alone. I don't know what SG is smoking - it must be Tucker Carlson's unit.
LurchAddams
There Can be Only One!
I tried to explain the same thing to him. Inflation is worldwide and much worse in Europe than here. He's just indoctrinated. There is nothing any Democrat could ever do please him.
LurchAddams
There Can be Only One!
So twump was in the "drivers seat" when we lost over a half-million people to Covid. According to your "logic" twump was to blame, correct?
LurchAddams
There Can be Only One!
Based on MAGAs lackluster performance on 11/8 it is already not working.
LurchAddams
There Can be Only One!
We were in terrible shape. The world was laughing at this carnival barker you're talking about.
I've figured out what turns you on about trump. It's NOT his policies, he has none.
I've seen you spew Democrat and liberal hate here and deny the evil twump has done.
You're a lib-bashing troll. He's a lib-bashing troll. That's his appeal to you. Period.
People like Tucker are the problem!
You seem sure it will work.
LurchAddams
There Can be Only One!
SG keeps talking about "trump's policies". twump had none. He was a full time traitor and troll. He committed crimes out in the open, knowing his office would protect him from accountability.
trump trolled his political enemies. That's his appeal to people like SG. Our democracy and standing in the world be damned.
But in their head he “totally owned the libs.” That’s what matters to them.
ThatOwlWoman
Leftist Vermin
He inherited a recovering economy from his predecessor, who in turn inherited a deep recession from *his* predecessor, and turned it around. In the Four Long Years of Sorrow, I have yet to have a single Trumpanzee tell me in any detail about which Trump policy(s) did anything to bolster the economy. If anything, his tariffs fucked it up -- we consumers are paying those tariffs, not China. Our farmers lost billions -- which our tax dollars helped to defray -- from the loss of soybean markets. Then there was the whole mishandling of the pandemic.
I think I can speak for most of us when I say that we want a POTUS who is and behaves like an adult. You know, like Joe Biden does.
gfm7175
Mega MAGA
Liberals also claimed, without evidence, that there was election fraud in both the 2000 and 2004 elections.
Maybe, but they did not claim that the election was totally invalid. There is always some fraud, but, thank god, there has not been enough to overturn any big election. The liberals never tried to invalidate a valid result and conceded the race.
Kamala Trump
Verified User
gfm7175
Mega MAGA
Not maybe... they DID do that.
Yes, they did. They claimed that the Presidency was stolen from both Gore and Kerry.
Right.
2018, 2020, and 2022 beg to differ.Yes, they did. See Bush 2000, Bush 2004, Trump 2016, and Stacey Abrams 2018 for some examples.