Ronald Reagan was a great man

Southern Man said:
Lots of non-convictions and opinion there. :palm:
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Not much opinion, and a good 14 or 15 convictions. Also, there were a lot of pardons issued to his crowd.

But I would think that over a dozen convictions with his administration would pretty much shoot down the "Great President" title.
 
Southern Man said:
In your opinion.
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James Watt, Reagan's Secretary of the Interior was indicted on 41 felony counts for using connections at the Department of Housing and Urban Development to help his private clients seek federal funds for housing projects in Maryland, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands. Watt conceded that he had received $500,000 from clients who were granted very favorable housing contracts after he had intervened on their behalf. In testifying before a House committee Watt said: "That's what they offered and it sounded like a lot of money to me, and we settled on it." Watt was eventually sentenced to five years in prison and 500 hours of community service.

Fact, not opinion

E. Bob Wallach, close friend and law classmate of Attorney General Edwin Meese, was sentenced to six years in prison and fined $250,000 in connection with the Wedtech influence-peddling scandal.
Lyn Nofziger – Convicted on charges of illegal lobbying of White House in Wedtech scandal.

Fact, not opinion

Michael Deaver received three years' probation and was fined one hundred thousand dollars after being convicted for lying to a congressional subcommittee and a federal grand jury about his lobbying activities after leaving the White House.

Fact, not opinion

Elliott Abrams was appointed by President Reagan in 1985 to head the State Department's Latin American Bureau. He was closely linked with ex-White House aide Lt. Col. Oliver North's covert movement to aid the Contras. Working for North, Abrams coordinated inter-agency support for the contras and helped solicit illegal funding from foreign powers as well as domestic contributors. Abrams agreed to cooperate with Iran-Contra investigators and pled guilty to two charges reduced to misdemeanors. He was sentenced in 1991 to two years probation and 100 hours of community service but was pardoned by President George Bush.

Fact, not opinion

Robert C. McFarlane was appointed Ronald Reagan's National Security Advisor in October 1983 and become well-known as a champion of the MX missile program in his role as White House liaison to congress. In 1984, Mc Farlane initiated the review of U.S. policy towards Iran that led directly to the arms for hostages deal. He also supervised early National Security Council efforts to support the Contras. McFarlane pled guilty to four misdemeanors and was sentenced to two years probation and 200 hours of community service. He was also fined $20,000. He received a blanket pardon from President George Bush.

Fact, not opinion

Oliver North – Convicted of falsifying and destroying documents, accepting an illegal gratuity, and aiding and abetting the obstruction of Congress. Conviction overturned on appeal due to legal technicalities.

Fact, not opinion

John Poindexter, Reagan's national security advisor, – guilty of five criminal counts involving conspiracy to mislead Congress, obstructing congressional inquiries, lying to lawmakers, used "high national security" to mask deceit and wrong-doing.

Fact, not opinion

Richard Secord pleaded guilty to a felony charge of lying to Congress over Iran-Contra.

Fact, not opinion

Alan D. Fiers was the Chief of the Central Intelligence Agency's Central American Task Force. Fiers pled guilty in 1991 to two counts of withholding information from congress about Oliver North's activities and the diversion of Iran arms sale money to aid the Contras. He was sentenced to one year of probation and 100 hours of community service.

Fact, not opinion

Clair George was Chief of the CIA's Division of Covert Operations under President Reagan. In August 1992 a hung jury led U.S. District Judge Royce Lamberth to declare a mistrial in the case of Clair George who was accused of concealing from Congress his knowledge of the Iran-Contra affair. George had been named by Alan Fiers when Fiers turned state's evidence for Lawrence Walsh's investigation. In a second trial on charges of perjury, false statements and obstruction of justice, George was convicted of lying to two congressional committees in 1986.

Fact, not opinion



Add to that all the people who resigned because of scandals, and you have an out of control administration.

Being in command means you are responsible for what happens under you.
 
WinterBorn said:
James Watt, Reagan's Secretary of the Interior was indicted on 41 felony counts for using connections at the Department of Housing and Urban Development to help his private clients seek federal funds for housing projects in Maryland, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands. Watt conceded that he had received $500,000 from clients who were granted very favorable housing contracts after he had intervened on their behalf. In testifying before a House committee Watt said: "That's what they offered and it sounded like a lot of money to me, and we settled on it." Watt was eventually sentenced to five years in prison and 500 hours of community service.

Fact, not opinion

E. Bob Wallach, close friend and law classmate of Attorney General Edwin Meese, was sentenced to six years in prison and fined $250,000 in connection with the Wedtech influence-peddling scandal.
Lyn Nofziger – Convicted on charges of illegal lobbying of White House in Wedtech scandal.

Fact, not opinion

Michael Deaver received three years' probation and was fined one hundred thousand dollars after being convicted for lying to a congressional subcommittee and a federal grand jury about his lobbying activities after leaving the White House.

Fact, not opinion

Elliott Abrams was appointed by President Reagan in 1985 to head the State Department's Latin American Bureau. He was closely linked with ex-White House aide Lt. Col. Oliver North's covert movement to aid the Contras. Working for North, Abrams coordinated inter-agency support for the contras and helped solicit illegal funding from foreign powers as well as domestic contributors. Abrams agreed to cooperate with Iran-Contra investigators and pled guilty to two charges reduced to misdemeanors. He was sentenced in 1991 to two years probation and 100 hours of community service but was pardoned by President George Bush.

Fact, not opinion

Robert C. McFarlane was appointed Ronald Reagan's National Security Advisor in October 1983 and become well-known as a champion of the MX missile program in his role as White House liaison to congress. In 1984, Mc Farlane initiated the review of U.S. policy towards Iran that led directly to the arms for hostages deal. He also supervised early National Security Council efforts to support the Contras. McFarlane pled guilty to four misdemeanors and was sentenced to two years probation and 200 hours of community service. He was also fined $20,000. He received a blanket pardon from President George Bush.

Fact, not opinion

Oliver North – Convicted of falsifying and destroying documents, accepting an illegal gratuity, and aiding and abetting the obstruction of Congress. Conviction overturned on appeal due to legal technicalities.

Fact, not opinion

John Poindexter, Reagan's national security advisor, – guilty of five criminal counts involving conspiracy to mislead Congress, obstructing congressional inquiries, lying to lawmakers, used "high national security" to mask deceit and wrong-doing.

Fact, not opinion

Richard Secord pleaded guilty to a felony charge of lying to Congress over Iran-Contra.

Fact, not opinion

Alan D. Fiers was the Chief of the Central Intelligence Agency's Central American Task Force. Fiers pled guilty in 1991 to two counts of withholding information from congress about Oliver North's activities and the diversion of Iran arms sale money to aid the Contras. He was sentenced to one year of probation and 100 hours of community service.

Fact, not opinion

Clair George was Chief of the CIA's Division of Covert Operations under President Reagan. In August 1992 a hung jury led U.S. District Judge Royce Lamberth to declare a mistrial in the case of Clair George who was accused of concealing from Congress his knowledge of the Iran-Contra affair. George had been named by Alan Fiers when Fiers turned state's evidence for Lawrence Walsh's investigation. In a second trial on charges of perjury, false statements and obstruction of justice, George was convicted of lying to two congressional committees in 1986.

Fact, not opinion



Add to that all the people who resigned because of scandals, and you have an out of control administration.

Being in command means you are responsible for what happens under you.
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You're wasting your time.....you're dealing with the willfully ignorant neocon mindset....they just deny and/or ignore facts that contradict their beliefs and/or propaganda.
 
Southern Man said:
Lots of non-convictions and opinion you glossed over. :)
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Lots of facts that you ignored.

I cut away the parts that could be opinion. I listed the convictions. That list shows Reagan was either didn't have control or was corrupt. Pick one.
 
Ron was great on economics and retardedly ghestapo on social issues!! Great man, no looney fucking SS clone.
 
WinterBorn said:
Lots of facts that you ignored.

I cut away the parts that could be opinion. I listed the convictions. That list shows Reagan was either didn't have control or was corrupt. Pick one.
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two convictions that didn't involve the Contra issues......hardly evidence of corruption......
 
WinterBorn said:
Lots of facts that you ignored.

I cut away the parts that could be opinion. I listed the convictions. That list shows Reagan was either didn't have control or was corrupt. Pick one.
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Until you compare Reagan's minor issues with the other presidents your stated conclusion is nothing but opinion.
 
Southern Man said:
Until you compare Reagan's minor issues with the other presidents your stated conclusion is nothing but opinion.
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No, that is not how I would call a president great. If there had been a bunch of inept crooks, the fact that you think he is less corrupt or inept does not count for much.

Lowering the standards is not the way to greatness. The number of resignations under scandal add to the convictions.
 
WinterBorn said:
No, that is not how I would call a president great. If there had been a bunch of inept crooks, the fact that you think he is less corrupt or inept does not count for much.

Lowering the standards is not the way to greatness. The number of resignations under scandal add to the convictions.
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I have to agree. Being less corrupt then Nixon or Clinton is hardly an argument that supports greatness.
 
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