Trump imposes tariff on 180 countries, exempts Russia, Belarus, Cuba and North Korea.

[IBDaMann]

All farmers are individuals. Based on your statement here, you will never accept an individual as being representative of farmers because that individual is not all farmers. In other words, you have set a requirement that can never be met in order to always claim that any individual doesn't represent all farmers.

So let's make this clear in order for you argument to make sense - Name the representative of farmers that you would accept as representative of farmers. Until you can name who you think represents all farmers your argument is nothing but an attempt on your part to not accept any answer you disagree with.

You wasted all this bandwidth as a smokescreen to cover your EVASION of not stating what you are arguing about farmers.

 

[gfm7175]

Shouldn't you be clearly stating what you are claiming about all farmers?

He didn't claim anything about all farmers. Tbird (and now you) made a claim about "farmers in red states" expressing an "I didn't vote for this" sentiment. Neither of you have clarified precisely what that means nor clarified how you know that such a sentiment is held in any significant numbers amongst that group of people.

You don't get to have your argument entered into the discussion without ever expressing your argument.

He isn't trying to express an argument about "farmers in red states"... YOU are (now in place of Tbird).

Or do your rules not apply to you?

At this point your post is summarily dismissed since it violates the rules you laid out.

You can't blame IBDaMann for YOUR OWN issues.

 

[gfm7175]

I'm mostly waiting to see results. The same went with Biden and the economy. Biden's early economic policies saw inflation take off at nearly 1% per month. I'm not seeing that with Trump so far. In a month or two of tariffs, we'll have some results to discuss. Right now, all we have, for the most part, is a lot of speculation and the markets reacting to that rather than actual effects coming from actions taken.

We also have four prior years of records/results of Trump and his "scary tariff" policies. The same fear mongering happened THEN too, and none of it played out that way then, so I see no rational reason to believe that it's going to somehow play out that way NOW.

 

[Lionfish]

Nancy Pelosi in 1996 Assails U.S. Free Trade with China: ‘Is This Reciprocal?’​

 

[gfm7175]

He also imposed tariffs on two islands near Antartica that have no human inhabitants. Only penguins.

So?

 

[Tbird19482]

Okay, let's review the ENTIRE conversation then. I typically don't do this, but I'm in a really good mood today.

TBIRD: "Farmers in a lot of red states are already saying this isn't what I voted for and that they might go bankrupt".
GFM: "Oh really?! Which farmers?
TBIRD: "Read the news. Farmers in NC, FL, and more"
GFM: "Which farmers? States are not farmers".
TBIRD: "Farmers in those states you stupid MFer"
GFM: "Which farmers "in those states"?
TBIRD: ** raises white flag ** ** tips king **
GFM: "Fine, I'll just conclude that you were making shit up again".

** TBIRD "tags out" of the ring, Poor Richard Saunders enters the ring **

PRS: "You must think they aren't farmers if they are in a state... [you'd also believe any stupid shit that Trump told you to believe]".
GFM: "Farmers in NC" means about as much as "the experts" or "sources familiar with the matter" means. Nobody has yet to identify any of these farmers for me. I suspect that's because these "farmers" that are being referenced do not actually exist."
PRS: "LOL [you didn't yet respond to Trump putting tariffs on uninhabited islands]. Each of these stories cites at least one farmer.
GFM: "Why would I feel compelled to respond to that fact?" So apparently the point that TBIRD is trying to make is that an individual farmer here and there speaks for farmers in general?
PRS: "ROFLMAO ... [the article also mentions a couple other individuals, heads of farming organizations even, and those heads speak for farmers in general]"
GFM: "No they don't, and so?"
PRS: [YOU'RE MOVING GOALPOSTS!!!!! RAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!]

That's basically where we are right now. Neither Tbird nor you have made any sort of valid or meaningful point about these supposed "farmers in red states" who are supposedly saying "this isn't what I voted for". Your links showed a few individual farmers expressing various concerns that they have, but nothing about "I didn't vote for this". Even if you stretch the expressed concerns into meaning "I didn't vote for this", you're still facing the fact that a few individuals are not "farmers in general".

I see no reason to believe that "I didn't vote for this" is a popular sentiment amongst "farmers in red states" (or even farmers anywhere in the USA for that matter).

I " tagged out " because trying to talk to a complete MORON is useless.
And YOU ARE A FUCKING MORON.

 

[Tbird19482]

He didn't claim anything about all farmers. Tbird (and now you) made a claim about "farmers in red states" expressing an "I didn't vote for this" sentiment. Neither of you have clarified precisely what that means nor clarified how you know that such a sentiment is held in any significant numbers amongst that group of people.

He isn't trying to express an argument about "farmers in red states"... YOU are (now in place of Tbird).

You can't blame IBDaMann for YOUR OWN issues.

You are too stupid that you don't even read the news.
Farmers in RED states HAVE been crying " I didn't vote for this"
Maybe if you actually read the news and NOT keep watching FOX you just might learn something.

 

[gfm7175]

I " tagged out " because trying to talk to a complete MORON is useless.
And YOU ARE A FUCKING MORON.

Insults are not examples of the supposed widespread sentiment of "farmers in red states" who "didn't vote for this" (whatever "this" means).

I realize that you've officially tagged out , unless you wish to give Poor Richard Saunders a little breather and tag back in for him for a bit.......

 

[gfm7175]

You are too stupid that you don't even read the news.
Farmers in RED states HAVE been crying " I didn't vote for this"
Maybe if you actually read the news and NOT keep watching FOX you just might learn something.

Oh YES!!! You're going to go against your word and "tag back in" for Poor Richard Saunders after all???!!! YIPPEE!!!!

"The news" is not a specific example of a supposed widespread sentiment that "farmers in red states" are expressing, namely an "I didn't vote for this" sentiment (whatever "this" means).

Repeating your claim that the above HAS been happening is not providing any specific examples of it happening, nor is it clarifying precisely what "this" means.

You're not doing very well at all. Maybe Poor Richard Saunders should tag back in for you... the sooner the better........

 

[Tbird19482]

Insults are not examples of the supposed widespread sentiment of "farmers in red states" who "didn't vote for this" (whatever "this" means).

I realize that you've officially tagged out , unless you wish to give Poor Richard Saunders a little breather and tag back in for him for a bit.......

Well IF you weren't such a fucking moron it might be different,
I made a statement that came right out of a news article where several Farmers from NC and farmers from several other RED states made that statement.
I never said it was all farmers nor it was happening in all states. POINT was there are farmers that voted for Trump that are now questioning if they voted the wrong way .
And DID come out and said " I didn't vote for this "
You are just being an ASSHOLE TROLL.

 

[Neoclitorus]

That's funny. Tell us when the Heard and McDonald Islands engaged in unfair trade practices.
I can wait for you to tell us how those penguins were manipulating their currency against the US dollar.

but you get that russia is already under sanctions right?

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

Okay, let's review the ENTIRE conversation then. I typically don't do this, but I'm in a really good mood today.

TBIRD: "Farmers in a lot of red states are already saying this isn't what I voted for and that they might go bankrupt".
GFM: "Oh really?! Which farmers?
TBIRD: "Read the news. Farmers in NC, FL, and more"
GFM: "Which farmers? States are not farmers".
TBIRD: "Farmers in those states you stupid MFer"
GFM: "Which farmers "in those states"?

Your first ask is "which farmers?"
This is equivalent to "Show me a green marble in the bag."
This is your initial goal you need met.

TBIRD: ** raises white flag ** ** tips king **

Made up response that never occurred. This is an attempt to obfuscate your goal post moves.

GFM: "Fine, I'll just conclude that you were making shit up again".

** TBIRD "tags out" of the ring, Poor Richard Saunders enters the ring **

Several posts not included to try to help obfuscate how you were being unreasonable.

PRS: "You must think they aren't farmers if they are in a state... [you'd also believe any stupid shit that Trump told you to believe]".
GFM: "Farmers in NC" means about as much as "the experts" or "sources familiar with the matter" means. Nobody has yet to identify any of these farmers for me. I suspect that's because these "farmers" that are being referenced do not actually exist."

At this point the goal is still to reference "farmers."
You left out my post which links to 6 different news articles that name and provide quotes from 10 different farmers and a letter sent to President Trump signed by 18 agricultural organizations that represent various types of farmers. Your ask that the farmers be identified has been met at this point. The goal was reached when one farmer was named.
This is equivalent to me showing you several green marbles in the bag.

PRS: "LOL [you didn't yet respond to Trump putting tariffs on uninhabited islands]. Each of these stories cites at least one farmer.
GFM: "Why would I feel compelled to respond to that fact?" So apparently the point that TBIRD is trying to make is that an individual farmer here and there speaks for farmers in general?

Here you move the goal posts for the first time. Rather than admitting that any farmers were identified as you asked you move the goal posts by making the goal no longer what you asked but by claiming TBird was saying something. You are not TBird. Your goal was reached but you decided to move the goal post.
Equivalent to you saying "None of those green marbles are large green marbles."

PRS: ROFLMAO ... [the article also mentions a couple other individuals, heads of farming organizations even, and those heads speak for farmers in general]

This would be equivalent to me saying, "It appears you didn't look at the green marbles because 3 of them are large green marbles."

Let's name some of those industry organizations that you claim don't speak for farmers.
American Soybean Association
American Feed Industry Association
International Fresh Produce Association
National Association of Wheat Growers
National Corn Growers Association
National Cotton Council
National Farmers Union
National Grain and Feed Association
National Milk Producers Association
National Pork Producers Council
American Farm Bureau Association

Your claim would be that these farmer run agencies that signed a letter to the President don't speak for the farmers that belong to those associations?
This is what the American Soybean association says on their website - The American Soybean Association (ASA) represents U.S. soybean farmers on domestic and international policy issues important to the soybean industry.
This is what the National Corn Growers Association says on their website - NCGA represents more than 36,000 dues-paying corn growers in 48 states, and the interests of more than 300,000 farmers who contribute through corn checkoff programs in their states

GFM: "No they don't, and so?"

And here you are saying "Those green marbles don't represent all the marbles in the bag!"
Clearly you have moved the goalposts from you can't name one name of a farmer to "No those farmers and farmer run organizations don't represent farmers.

PRS: [YOU'RE MOVING GOALPOSTS!!!!! RAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!]

That's basically where we are right now. Neither Tbird nor you have made any sort of valid or meaningful point about these supposed "farmers in red states" who are supposedly saying "this isn't what I voted for". Your links showed a few individual farmers expressing various concerns that they have, but nothing about "I didn't vote for this". Even if you stretch the expressed concerns into meaning "I didn't vote for this", you're still facing the fact that a few individuals are not "farmers in general".

I see no reason to believe that "I didn't vote for this" is a popular sentiment amongst "farmers in red states" (or even "blue states" for that matter).

Where we are right now is you being intellectually dishonest. You not only moved the goalposts but now you are denying that organizations that represent farmers actually represent farmers.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

but you get that russia is already under sanctions right?

On the same day that Trump announced tariffs for almost every country but Russia, North Korea, Belarus he eliminated some of the sanctions on Russia. He has also promised to lift all the Russian sanctions.

Trump says sanctions against Russia to be lifted 'at some point'

"No, we haven't lifted any sanctions on anybody… I guess it will be at some point, but right now, we haven't agreed to lift sanctions on anybody," Donald Trump said.

www.yahoo.com

 

[Neoclitorus]

On the same day that Trump announced tariffs for almost every country but Russia, North Korea, Belarus he eliminated some of the sanctions on Russia. He has also promised to lift all the Russian sanctions.

Trump says sanctions against Russia to be lifted 'at some point'

"No, we haven't lifted any sanctions on anybody… I guess it will be at some point, but right now, we haven't agreed to lift sanctions on anybody," Donald Trump said.

www.yahoo.com

but you get that russia is already under sanctions right?

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

He didn't claim anything about all farmers. Tbird (and now you) made a claim about "farmers in red states" expressing an "I didn't vote for this" sentiment. Neither of you have clarified precisely what that means nor clarified how you know that such a sentiment is held in any significant numbers amongst that group of people.

He isn't trying to express an argument about "farmers in red states"... YOU are (now in place of Tbird).

You can't blame IBDaMann for YOUR OWN issues.

Under IBDaMann's rules you have now conceded defeat. Thanks for playing with IBDaMann.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

but you get that russia is already under sanctions right?

But you get that Russia is under fewer sanctions today than it was 5 days ago, right?
And you also get that Trump has promised to drop all Russian sanctions, right?

 

[Neoclitorus]

But you get that Russia is under fewer sanctions today than it was 5 days ago, right?
And you also get that Trump has promised to drop all Russian sanctions, right?

probably part of stopping the war.

but they are tariffed and sanctioned.

please stop warmongering, and accept that perpetual war is gay and we need to rehome our economy.

 

[Tbird19482]

Your first ask is "which farmers?"
This is equivalent to "Show me a green marble in the bag."
This is your initial goal you need met.

Made up response that never occurred. This is an attempt to obfuscate your goal post moves.

Several posts not included to try to help obfuscate how you were being unreasonable.

At this point the goal is still to reference "farmers."
You left out my post which links to 6 different news articles that name and provide quotes from 10 different farmers and a letter sent to President Trump signed by 18 agricultural organizations that represent various types of farmers. Your ask that the farmers be identified has been met at this point. The goal was reached when one farmer was named.
This is equivalent to me showing you several green marbles in the bag.

Here you move the goal posts for the first time. Rather than admitting that any farmers were identified as you asked you move the goal posts by making the goal no longer what you asked but by claiming TBird was saying something. You are not TBird. Your goal was reached but you decided to move the goal post.
Equivalent to you saying "None of those green marbles are large green marbles."

This would be equivalent to me saying, "It appears you didn't look at the green marbles because 3 of them are large green marbles."

Let's name some of those industry organizations that you claim don't speak for farmers.
American Soybean Association
American Feed Industry Association
International Fresh Produce Association
National Association of Wheat Growers
National Corn Growers Association
National Cotton Council
National Farmers Union
National Grain and Feed Association
National Milk Producers Association
National Pork Producers Council
American Farm Bureau Association

Your claim would be that these farmer run agencies that signed a letter to the President don't speak for the farmers that belong to those associations?
This is what the American Soybean association says on their website - The American Soybean Association (ASA) represents U.S. soybean farmers on domestic and international policy issues important to the soybean industry.
This is what the National Corn Growers Association says on their website - NCGA represents more than 36,000 dues-paying corn growers in 48 states, and the interests of more than 300,000 farmers who contribute through corn checkoff programs in their states


And here you are saying "Those green marbles don't represent all the marbles in the bag!"
Clearly you have moved the goalposts from you can't name one name of a farmer to "No those farmers and farmer run organizations don't represent farmers.


Where we are right now is you being intellectually dishonest. You not only moved the goalposts but now you are denying that organizations that represent farmers actually represent farmers.

He is too stupid to understand it was a general statement that was in the news and I just pointed it out.
and IF he had read your links he would have known it was a true statement and a lot of farmers that voted for Trump are questioning if they voted wrong and against their own better interest.
In time they won't be the only ones when Trumps tariffs and other BS finally turns around and bites them in the ass there will be a lot more of them
It just will take a little time.

 

[gfm7175]

Well IF you weren't such a fucking moron it might be different,

It doesn't work to blame me for your own issues.

I made a statement that came right out of a news article where several Farmers from NC and farmers from several other RED states made that statement.

???????

I never said it was all farmers nor it was happening in all states.

Right. You said "farmers in red states" and you never clarified what "it" (or "this") means, specifically.

POINT was there are farmers that voted for Trump that are now questioning if they voted the wrong way .

Roughly 9 out of 500 people voted for "other candidate" for President in 2024. If you're likewise telling me that 9 out of 500 "farmers in red states" are now saying "I didn't vote for this", I would tell you 'big whoop' because that amounts to basically nobody.

 

[Poor Richard Saunders]

He didn't claim anything about all farmers. Tbird (and now you) made a claim about "farmers in red states" expressing an "I didn't vote for this" sentiment. Neither of you have clarified precisely what that means nor clarified how you know that such a sentiment is held in any significant numbers amongst that group of people.

He isn't trying to express an argument about "farmers in red states"... YOU are (now in place of Tbird).

You can't blame IBDaMann for YOUR OWN issues.

Thanks for clarifying that you clearly moved the goalpots when you claimed this -

GFM: "Why would I feel compelled to respond to that fact?" So apparently the point that TBIRD is trying to make is that an individual farmer here and there speaks for farmers in general?

Once again, we see you being intellectually dishonest by misrepresenting the statements of TBird and trying to lie about your moving the goalposts. It is you that is moving the goalposts to demand that some farmers now speak for farmers in general when TBird made no such claim.

This is what Tbird said. It in now way implies that farmers mean all farmers or even most farmers.

Farmers in a lot of red states are already saying this isn't what I voted for , and are also saying they might go bankrupt.

Your intellectual dishonesty is there for all to see.