What Socrates can teach us about the art of civilized arguing

Cypress said:
The dialectic method of teaching has not been widely used in highschool or college undergraduate education since the medieval Christian scholastic universities.
Click to expand...
we used it in my Catholic high school. of course not all the time .
Lecture hall was presentations. And classroom could be more teacher led instructions

But a few of the Christian brothers I had would get us to interact and "teach ourselves" by the SM
of course moderated by the teacher when we went off tangent
It was the best thing I ever practiced. It made me think logically and inquisitively at the same time
 
The instruction of the Kalamas (Kalama Sutta) is justly famous for its encouragement of free inquiry;
the spirit of the sutta signifies a teaching that is exempt from fanaticism, bigotry, dogmatism, and intolerance.
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/soma/wheel008.html
"Come, Kalamas. Do not go upon what has been acquired by repeated hearing; nor upon tradition; nor upon rumor; nor upon what is in a scripture; nor upon surmise; nor upon an axiom; nor upon specious reasoning; nor upon a bias towards a notion that has been pondered over; nor upon another's seeming ability; nor upon the consideration, 'The monk is our teacher.'
Kalamas, when you yourselves know: 'These things are good; these things are not blamable; these things are praised by the wise; undertaken and observed, these things lead to benefit and happiness,' enter on and abide in them.
 
BidenPresident said:
This is his “meditation” on liberal education, meaning “education not for making a living but for living meaningfully.” He joins the century-old criticism of the scientific and vocational focus of research universities that are preoccupied with “the production and accumulation of new knowledge” rather than “the cultivation of whole persons.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/12/31/harvard-classics-socrates-how-to-argue/
Click to expand...

You're a fucktard and stop abusing Socrates to try to make yourself look smart.
 
BidenPresident said:
This is his “meditation” on liberal education, meaning “education not for making a living but for living meaningfully.” He joins the century-old criticism of the scientific and vocational focus of research universities that are preoccupied with “the production and accumulation of new knowledge” rather than “the cultivation of whole persons.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/12/31/harvard-classics-socrates-how-to-argue/
Click to expand...

I am sure the philosophy of Socrates would not relate to the GQP/GOP war mongering insurgency of sedition and insurrection that are much too uncivilized to come to terms with. Yet the philosophy of Socrates seems more beneficial to the common decency of humanity and society for his simplistic and logical reasons of the 21st century too. To which this is a Socrates logic that existed long before the GQP/GOP and tRump's mob came on the scene to be a problem against humanity of 2000 years ago (Socrates (/ˈsɒkrətiːz/; Greek: Σωκράτης; c. 470–399 BC) :

Philosophy. Socrates believed that philosophy should achieve practical results for the greater well-being of society. He attempted to establish an ethical system based on human reason rather than theological doctrine. Socrates pointed out that human choice was motivated by the desire for happiness."

https://www.biography.com/scholar/s... one.-,Philosophy,by the desire for happiness.
 
Last edited:
gemini104104 said:
I am sure the philosophy of Socrates would not relate to the GQP/GOP war mongering insurgency of sedition and insurrection that are much to uncivilized come to terms with. Yet more beneficial to the common decency of humanity and society for his simplistic and logical reasons why. This and to which this is a logic that existed long before the GQP/GOP and tRump's mob came on the scene to be a problem against humanity 2000 years ago (Socrates (/ˈsɒkrətiːz/; Greek: Σωκράτης; c. 470–399 BC) :

Philosophy. Socrates believed that philosophy should achieve practical results for the greater well-being of society. He attempted to establish an ethical system based on human reason rather than theological doctrine. Socrates pointed out that human choice was motivated by the desire for happiness."

https://www.biography.com/scholar/s... one.-,Philosophy,by the desire for happiness.
Click to expand...

I am sure you'd stone Socrates to death because he'd question wearing a mask.
 
Guille said:
I am sure you'd stone Socrates to death because he'd question wearing a mask.
Click to expand...


Socrates would also question the idea of forced vaccinations when there's now more outbreaks than before vaccinations.

Modern leftists would kill Socrates reallll quick.
 
dukkha said:
we used it in my Catholic high school. of course not all the time .
Lecture hall was presentations. And classroom could be more teacher led instructions

But a few of the Christian brothers I had would get us to interact and "teach ourselves" by the SM
of course moderated by the teacher when we went off tangent
It was the best thing I ever practiced. It made me think logically and inquisitively at the same time
Click to expand...

Dialectic is fine if you want to sit around talking about ethics or the meaning of life.

But the primary reason knowledge exploded after the rennassaice is because people like Francis Bacon and his contemporaries realized deduction from first principles were only going to get you so far.

They realized the physics, biology, medicine, teleology of Aristotle and Galen were largely just wrong, even if superficially seemingly well-reasoned.

Only thinkers like Euclid survived scathed into the modern era, because mathematics is the one discipline where deduction works really well.

So beginning with modern thinkers like Bacon and Galileo, inductive logic and reasoning largely replaced deduction as the primary scaffolding underlying modern knowledge.
 
Last edited:
guno said:
The dialectical method, a discourse between two or more people holding different points of view about a subject but wishing to establish the truth through reasoned argumentation.
Click to expand...

Right, that's what I mean: nobody actually teaches that way in college or high school, at least not in any measurable way.

The only places something like a real dialectic actually occurs are at academic conferences and seminars between scholars and researchers and their colleagues and peers.
 
Cypress said:
Right, that's what I mean: nobody actually teaches that way in college or high school, at least not in any measurable way.

The only places something like a real dialectic actually occurs are at academic conferences and seminars between scholars and researchers and their colleagues and peers.
Click to expand...


Centuries before the Socratic method was introduced into modern law schools, students of the Talmud were engaging in a very similar enterprise. After describing the basic process of Talmud study, and discussing the parallels between Talmudic analysis and modern legal education, the Article illustrates how a single question raised by the Talmud (dealing with an issue of unjust enrichment) can unfold into increasing layers of complexity, thereby challenging the student at higher and higher levels.

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1844708

Our Talmud which is a discussion and back and forth uses the Socratic method , that is how Jews learn to this today, a method of thinking

The Gemara, however, is not just a book of knowledge. It is an art, a discipline, a unique training center for the Jewish mind. Alan Dershowitz once remarked that his exceptional grasp of the finer points of the law was a direct result of his studying Talmud; Toronto philanthropist Albert Reichman, when asked for his secret to being so successful in business, simply remarked, “I study Talmud every day!” The Talmudic – or Socratic – method of study is to attack every subject from all angles, to direct and dissect each aspect, until finally arriving at the Truth. Often, it is not so much the result, as it is the process which is paramount. One studies for the sake of studying, not just to come to hard and fast conclusions.

https://www.jpost.com/judaism/judaisms-secret-weapon-612876
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top