World's greatest churches

Penderyn said:
I love the few tiny little churches, like the chapel of St David's Mother, left over from before Augustine got to Britain to impose Popery, when we were still Christian, a very few very early Non-Conformist chapels like the one some of my family used to attend down in the Vale of Glamorgan, little whitewashed places when they could afford no show. and, yes indeed, Quaker Meeting Houses. You can feel 'the beauty of holiness' coming out of the walls! I don't know any Orthodox churches other than one a niece was married in, which was Anglican taken over, but I find the big Continental churches a bit soulless. As to Anglican churches, except where the local big family has taken over completely, I can live with them.
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There is a lot to be said for the simplicity of the Quakers. It speaks to their values and conscience; their belief in the light within. I myself have had the honor to participate marginally with the Society of Friends.

On the flip side, a large part of me believes that Protestantism was in too much of a rush to discard ritual, to discard mysticism, and the mysterious. Even to this day, I find the Eastern Orthodox tradition of the veneration of icons, the veneration of Saints, the veneration of the cross, and all the aesthetics they devote to glorify the divine, to collectively represent something about humanity that is generally lacking in garden variety day to day life.

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IMHO you may be a bit overly generous to those friends, but that is just my opinion..

It seems the quaker state wasn't much different than the bad states in many ways.....
 
Bill said:
IMHO you may be a bit overly generous to those friends, but that is just my opinion..

It seems the quaker state wasn't much different than the bad states in many ways.....
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My understanding, is that by the standards of the 1680s, William Penn's Pennsylvania colony was relatively religiously tolerant, and relatively fair in dealing with native Americans, in comparison to the general standards of the time. In hindsight, from the perspective of the 21st century, all the colonists look pretty barbaric.

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Part of Pennsylvania’s success was due to William Penn avoiding the three biggest mistakes of other colonies: religious intolerance, brutal treatment of laborers, and exploitation of the natives.
A. Although there were indentured servants in Pennsylvania, they were treated better and had more social mobility than in Virginia.
B. Pennsylvania was open to settlement by anyone who was willing to work, regardless of religious affiliation.
C. Penn bargained fairly with the Indians for both land and trade goods and welcomed refugee tribes into the colony.
D. These policies brought Pennsylvania into conflict with New York and Maryland.

Pennsylvania, founded on Penn’s ideals of justice and tolerance, arguably became the model for the emerging American society.

- source citation: Professor Robert J. Allison. Suffolk University
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I am no expert on William Penn's 17th century Pennsylvania Colony, and my only experience has been with Quakers of the 20 and 21st century. That is who I base my opinion on the Society of Friends.
 
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Cypress said:
My understanding, is that by the standards of the 1680s, William Penn's Pennsylvania colony was relatively religiously tolerant, and relatively fair in dealing with native Americans, in comparison to the general standards of the time. In hindsight, from the perspective of the 21st century, all the colonists look pretty barbaric.

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I am no expert on William Penn's 17th century Pennsylvania Colony, and my only experience has been with Quakers of the 20 and 21st century. That is who I base my opinion on the Society of Friends.
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Yes, I agree that in their time there were, & on slavery.......

Some were allowed & or succumbed to assimilation but those good ppl's ancestors & the newbies perhaps looking for free land sent the rest packing all the same..

I recently discovered a drop or two in one of my family lines, although it is so far back & it is very hard to verify.. Was a lady named straight feather, Swanee which were in that area, over into Ohio...

Lots of good ppl had good intentions but they didn't always know whats best for someone else & there weren't always good options...
 
Cypress said:
There is a lot to be said for the simplicity of the Quakers. It speaks to their values and conscience; their belief in the light within. I myself have had the honor to participate marginally with the Society of Friends.

On the flip side, a large part of me believes that Protestantism was in too much of a rush to discard ritual, to discard mysticism, and the mysterious. Even to this day, I find the Eastern Orthodox tradition of the veneration of icons, the veneration of Saints, the veneration of the cross, and all the aesthetics they devote to glorify the divine, to collectively represent something about humanity that is generally lacking in garden variety day to day life.

RQ8DgsV.jpg
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I agree, actually - I was brought up fairly 'high' Anglican and I like the Orthodox services I've heard. With all rituals, though, I'm troubled about the sort of beliefs that accumulate with them.
 
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Obviously not actually one of the world’s greatest churches: a sidebar at best, this a memorial representing the location of the former Orthodox Church in my father’s village. Bolsheviks burned this church to the ground and murdered the priest around 1920.
KfDsuJT.jpg
 
Cypress said:
Obviously not actually one of the world’s greatest churches: a sidebar at best, this a memorial representing the location of the former Orthodox Church in my father’s village. Bolsheviks burned this church to the ground and murdered the priest around 1920.
KfDsuJT.jpg
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Sad memory, but a new start?? Do they again own the land to rebuild??

Is putin the head of the Russian Orthodox Church??
 
Bill said:
Sad memory, but a new start?? Do they again own the land to rebuild??

Is putin the head of the Russian Orthodox Church??
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The Patriarch of Moscow is the primate of the Russian Orthodox Church, but it is widely believed Putin and the Patriarch make common cause on a range of cultural issues. Outside of 80 years of Communist rule, Russia has always been a quasi-theocracy.

There are no plans to rebuild that church. That village never recovered from the Nazi occupation when most of the residents perished. There are only a couple hundred people in that village today, not enough to justify a church and a priest.
 
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