A brief history of Hell

[Dutch Uncle]

Buddhism had it's own fantastical myths and gruesome punishments in Hell.

My judgement is that most message board atheists are not actually impartial and detached irreligious individuals. They aren't actually atheists. They are crusading anti-christian zealots.

That's an excellent description of the type.

I've been on both an atheist ("Secular") forum and a Christian one. The Christian forum banned anyone who farted sideways so I left before being permbanned. The secular one had a lot of Brits along with American militants who leaned in varying degrees of militantism. It was a much more fun experience that introduced me to a world in which I've never been. Some of the members blamed me for its eventual collapse but that was because the owner was terminally ill and died about the time I was banned. Some people don't like being told they are hypocrites and fucking morons. LOL

That was all over 10 years ago and I've mellowed a lot since.

 

[ZenMode]

Weird that you are a strict biblical literalist. Only fire and brimstone fundamentalists tend to be strict biblical literalists.

Odd that an atheist would adopt the strict biblical literalism of small minority of world Christianity.

The Christian tradition I grew up in barely cares about the Old Testament, other than the fact that it supposedly has prophecies about Jesus, and it has iconic the Decalogue. The stories in the Torah, the Jewish ritual laws, the Jewish histories filling up the TaNakh either barely apply to christians, or are widely considered allegorical.

Of course the OT isn't a focus of churches, except of course Genesis and Psalms and Noah...and Passover. Few churches want to talk honestly about God's OT behavior. The NT stuff is much more paletable.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Of course the OT isn't a focus of churches, except of course Genesis and Psalms and Noah...and Passover. Few churches want to talk honestly about God's OT behavior. The NT stuff is much more paletable.

Probably because, unlike you, they understand it's mankind's perception of God, not God's true nature.

 

[Cypress]

That's an excellent description of the type.

I've been on both an atheist ("Secular") forum and a Christian one. The Christian forum banned anyone who farted sideways so I left before being permbanned. The secular one had a lot of Brits along with American militants who leaned in varying degrees of militantism. It was a much more fun experience that introduced me to a world in which I've never been. Some of the members blamed me for its eventual collapse but that was because the owner was terminally ill and died about the time I was banned. Some people don't like being told they are hypocrites and fucking morons. LOL

That was all over 10 years ago and I've mellowed a lot since.

Good times.

This is mellow for you?

I generally don't expect fruitful knowledge exchange with either the Megachurch Fundamentalists or the League of Militant Atheists, because they both tend to be extremely dogmatic and close minded.

The most fruitful avenues of reflection for me have frequently been from exposure with the free thinking and impartial atheists, agnostics, pantheists, aka Einstein, Niel Degrasse Tyson, Bart Ehrman, et al.

 

[BidenPresident]

Buddhism had it's own fantastical myths and gruesome punishments in Hell.

My judgement is that most message board atheists are not actually impartial and detached irreligious individuals. They aren't actually atheists. They are crusading anti-christian zealots.

My judgment is that everything I believe is correct. Funny, eh?

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Good times.

This is mellow for you?

I generally don't expect fruitful knowledge exchange with either the Megachurch Fundamentalists or the League of Militant Atheists, because they both tend to be extremely dogmatic and close minded.

The most fruitful avenues of reflection for me have frequently been from exposure with the free thinking and impartial atheists, agnostics, pantheists, aka Einstein, Niel Degrasse Tyson, Bart Ehrman, et al.

Agreed.

Yes. I used to be a real asshole.

It's good to see where the needle is on Fundies since sodomy laws have been disallowed and same-sex marriage is a right.

Most of them will have the most educated minds, but I'm often interested in the national and state averages on various issues as a base for social predictions. Chaos makes predictions difficult, but if the majority believe one way, then that's the direction they are moving. An example is seeing the aftermath of SCOTUS overturning Roe v. Wade. The fact a lot of states are supporting women's control over their bodies is very interesting to me.

 

[ZenMode]

Probably because, unlike you, they understand it's mankind's perception of God, not God's true nature.

That's what you want to believe. There is no reason that God's nature, if he existed, would need to change. He's perfect, right?

 

[Cypress]

Of course the OT isn't a focus of churches, except of course Genesis and Psalms and Noah...and Passover. Few churches want to talk honestly about God's OT behavior. The NT stuff is much more paletable.

So you have a grudging admiration for Jesus and the gospels.

The New Testament is a Christian book.
The Old Testament is essentially a Hebrew book. Have you tried approaching your Jewish neighbors and Jewish coworkers to complain about your lingering grievances concerning the stories of the Old Testament? If not, why not?

 

[Cypress]

Agreed.

Yes. I used to be a real asshole.

It's good to see where the needle is on Fundies since sodomy laws have been disallowed and same-sex marriage is a right.

Most of them will have the most educated minds, but I'm often interested in the national and state averages on various issues as a base for social predictions. Chaos makes predictions difficult, but if the majority believe one way, then that's the direction they are moving. An example is seeing the aftermath of SCOTUS overturning Roe v. Wade. The fact a lot of states are supporting women's control over their bodies is very interesting to me.

20 years ago, Republicans were trying to get state initiatives passed to ban gay marriage, with little success.

I think Republicans realized they could never enact their theocratic agenda through the democratic process. So they turned to the courts, and they acquired a lasting fondness for the tyranny of the minority.

 

[Yakuda]

20 years ago, Republicans were trying to get state initiatives passed to ban gay marriage, with little success.

I think Republicans realized they could never enact their theocratic agenda through the democratic process. So they turned to the courts, and they acquired a lasting fondness for the tyranny of the minority.

Yeah that's when I realized how much damage leftist controlled education had done to Americans.

Btw how was gay "marriage" legalized? Oh that's right the supreme court. Thats how fucking much you love the "democratic process", huh? Abortion too! It's the sanctimonious stupidity that gets me.

 

[ZenMode]

So you have a grudging admiration for Jesus and the gospels.

The New Testament is a Christian book.
The Old Testament is essentially a Hebrew book. Have you tried approaching your Jewish neighbors and Jewish coworkers to complain about your lingering grievances concerning the stories of the Old Testament? If not, why not?

Jesus and God are the same being according to Christians. The OT are writings about God and the NT are writings about the same God.

What is being claimed is that the homicidal maniac of the OT was actually behaving morally when he drowned the world, murdered all the first born in Egypt, commands man to kill his new wife if she's not a virgin on your wedding night, commands neighbors killing each other for working on Saturday, commands the killing of children for back-talk.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

That's what you want to believe. There is no reason that God's nature, if he existed, would need to change. He's perfect, right?

Exactly my point and the point you are either avoiding, denying or unable to see.

So what did change, 'Mode? I've mentioned what changed several times before but you seem to be more interested in being angry at God for some reason.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Yeah that's when I realized how much damage leftist controlled education had done to Americans.

Btw how was gay "marriage" legalized? Oh that's right the supreme court.


Thats how fucking much you love the "democratic process", huh? Abortion too! It's the sanctimonious stupidity that gets me.

Your hatred of "leftists" is one reason why you are distancing yourself from God and, therefore, will go to Hell.

Do you believe all Americans have unalienable rights, Yak? Do you believe God made all people equal in the eyes of God?

Another example of your hatred of your fellow man. Not your brother's keeper, eh? LOL

 

[ZenMode]

Exactly my point and the point you are either avoiding, denying or unable to see.

So what did change, 'Mode? I've mentioned what changed several times before but you seem to be more interested in being angry at God for some reason.

Your implication was that man's change in views are what changed. In response to that, I asked:

Based on what criteria do you separate the facts from fiction in the Bible and why would God allow false information into the Bible?


https://www.justplainpolitics.com/s...A-brief-history-of-Hell&p=5864570#post5864570

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Your implication was that man's change in views are what changed. In response to that, I asked:

Based on what criteria do you separate the facts from fiction in the Bible and why would God allow false information into the Bible?


https://www.justplainpolitics.com/s...A-brief-history-of-Hell&p=5864570#post5864570

Based upon the fact that God is unknowable. Why else is this such a controversial subject with hundreds of religions? Man knows instinctively that there is more to existence than what's in front of his nose, but no one knows all the mysteries of the Universe much less what lies beyond it.

Once again you are dodging the fact you hate God instead of accepting that the God of the Bible, especially the OT God, is a four thousand year old perception of mankind.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

20 years ago, Republicans were trying to get state initiatives passed to ban gay marriage, with little success.

I think Republicans realized they could never enact their theocratic agenda through the democratic process. So they turned to the courts, and they acquired a lasting fondness for the tyranny of the minority.

IIRC, they did pass several state initiatives but those were negated by Federal SCOTUS rulings as a 14th Amendment issue.

Agreed on alternate Republican paths to strip Americans of their rights and impose their religious views across the land.

 

[Cypress]

Yeah that's when I realized how much damage leftist controlled education had done to Americans.

Btw how was gay "marriage" legalized? Oh that's right the supreme court. Thats how fucking much you love the "democratic process", huh? Abortion too! It's the sanctimonious stupidity that gets me.

The nation gets more liberal over time.

The year is now 2023. I am pretty confident that if banning gay marriage were put to a national vote now, it would fail.

 

[ZenMode]

Based upon the fact that God is unknowable. Why else is this such a controversial subject with hundreds of religions? Man knows instinctively that there is more to existence than what's in front of his nose, but no one knows all the mysteries of the Universe much less what lies beyond it.

Once again you are dodging the fact you hate God instead of accepting that the God of the Bible, especially the OT God, is a four thousand year old perception of mankind.

How does the belief that your God is unknowable help you determine which of mans' stories about him are real or fake?

 

[Dutch Uncle]

The nation gets more liberal over time.

The year is now 2023. I am pretty confident that if banning gay marriage were put to a national vote now, it would fail.

If you define "more liberal" to be "more freedom for citizens", I agree. This is a distinction separate from some Democratic initiatives that are anti-freedom.

Agreed. The Republicans would be idiots to try to have it overturned in SCOTUS only to see the backlash in the states.

 

[Yakuda]

The nation gets more liberal over time.

The year is now 2023. I am pretty confident that if banning gay marriage were put to a national vote now, it would fail.

Sadly thats true and we are suffering the deleterious effects of it.

Yes as I said previously peoples brains have been fucked up by leftist indoctrination. Beyond that if a national vote was taken to reinstate slavery and it passed, that wouldn't make slavery a good thing.

As to the subject of hell, the topic of this thread, when people have more than a 3rd grade level of understanding they realize hell is a choice.