A smarter way to get 'free' electricity

[Walt]

Who says I can't? In any event, it doesn't matter whether it's me or anyone else. It CAN be done. That's the point. Althea acted as if it couldn't be done.

It can be done only for the most connected, high value investors. That is not you.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

Technically, Althea said YOU cannot invest in a privately held utility, which is correct. There is no way any reasonably sized privately held company would even consider having you as an investor.

this is so cravenly fucking pathetic and weak.

 

[Into the Night]

Let's say the electric utility pays 1% dividends, and you pay $5,000 a year for electricity. Then if you invest $500,000 in the electric utility, your dividends would before taxes pay for your electricity...

Okay. Let's use this contrivance of yours.

But there are two obvious problems with that. Because the dividends are income, you have to pay taxes on it, so will be losing money.

You are not losing money, Sock. The government is simply taking some of your income, like they always do. Using YOUR wacky logic, there is no point in working for wages.

Also, you could buy very safe bonds and get $25k returns on that money. That would pay your electricity, your taxes, and give you a nice profit.

So you are comparing one contrivance with another contrivance as a 'proof'. Won't work, Sock.

You definitely have a 6th grader understanding of accounting.

You are describing yourself again, Sock. You cannot blame YOUR problem on anybody else.

The IRS considers dividends to be income, so you have to pay taxes on it.

All net income above a certain level is taxed.

I doubt you would be able to get your electricity considered a business expense on investments into a electric utility.

He doesn't need to. The IRS taxes the income of both of your contrivances.

It is probably best to try to maximize your income, not "pair" your income to expenses. If you make $10k a month, from any income stream, you can easily pay $200 a month for electricity.

You are forgetting the value of the principle again, Sock. For some odd reason you figure that's lost money.

 

[Into the Night]

Equity in a corporation means for the most part means shares. You are buying a share of the corporation, and the certificates of these shares are called shares.

One can buy and sell shares in a privately held company, but it is difficult. If there are too many owners, it has to be publicly traded, so the number of owners is limited. And because there is not automatic price discovery, there must be lengthy negotiations before a sale. The Shark Tank makes it look easy, but the negotiations usually last for weeks if not months.

In short, while ONE can buy shares in a privately held company, YOU cannot.

It is not difficult to buy and sell shares in a private company. All private companies on the stock market are publicly traded, Sock. All of them are automatic price discovery, Sock.
ANYONE can buy stock in a publicly traded company, Sock. That's what 'public trading' means.

The only limit on the number of owners is the number of shares issued for the company.

 

[Walt]

All private companies on the stock market are publicly traded, Sock.

Privately held companies are by definition not publicly traded.

 

[Into the Night]

Gardner cherry picked the time frame, and he did a terrible job of cherry picking.

The claim was that holding electric utility stocks is a hedge against higher electric rates. That somehow the stocks would go up with expenses. The reality is that in the last five years, inputs into making electricity have gone up, and stock prices have fallen.

Cherry picking fallacy. The overall price per share of any energy stock has gone up. You are simply focusing on the economic depression caused by DEMOCRATS.

 

[Into the Night]

The dipshit is wrong again.





Maybe an ignorant shithead like you would not pay more for a home equipped with solar power but the market says differently for the intelligent buyer.

Still trying to justify wasting your money on solar panels?

 

[Into the Night]

Privately held companies are by definition not publicly traded.

No such definition. ALL publicly traded companies are private companies, Sock.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

No such definition. ALL publicly traded companies are private companies, Sock.

but not all companies are publicly traded.

are those double private?

 

[Into the Night]

Privately held companies are by definition not publicly traded.

All private companies on the stock market are publicly traded, Sock.

 

[Into the Night]

but not all companies are publicly traded.

So?

are those double private?

No. They are just not publicly traded.

Examples:
A company organized as a sole proprietorship will never be publicly traded. The owner retains all ownership.

A company organized as a partnership will never be publicly traded. The partners retain all ownership (usually by a specified share of the company, as defined in the documents).

A company organized as a corporation might or might not be publicly traded. Those are not are effectively like partnerships, but with corporate protections isolating personal assets from corporate ones. The taxes are more complicated, but the protections are generally worth it. The IRS has a simplified corporate taxing method, often called a subchapter S corporation, and can be used by smaller corporations that are not publicly traded.

ALL of them are private companies.

The utility being discussed here is a publicly traded private company.

 

[Walt]

The overall price per share of any energy stock has gone up.

I actually suggested you go with energy stocks rather than electrical stocks. Electrical stocks are a poor hedge against higher electricity prices, but energy stocks are at least a halfway decent hedge. I am glad you agree with me.

You are simply focusing on the economic depression caused by DEMOCRATS.

What economic depression?

 

[Walt]

No such definition.

Privately held companies have been defined for over a century.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privately_held_company

ALL publicly traded companies are private companies, Sock.

Even that is not true. A public company can have stocks publicly traded. It is rare, but not impossible.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

Still trying to justify wasting your money on solar panels?

sunken cost fallacy.

 

[gfm7175]

It can be done only for the most connected, high value investors. That is not you.

Ummm, no. Anyone with a bit of money can do it.

 

[gfm7175]

What economic depression?

Walt =

 

[Into the Night]

I actually suggested you go with energy stocks rather than electrical stocks.

Electric stocks ARE energy stocks, Sock.

Electrical stocks are a poor hedge against higher electricity prices,

Not really.

but energy stocks are at least a halfway decent hedge. I am glad you agree with me.

Electrical stocks ARE energy stocks, Sock.

What economic depression?

The one you keep denying, because you deny history and anything that makes the Democrats look bad. The one the DEMOCRATS caused by shutting down businesses and destroying them.

 

[Althea]

I thought it was a "prepayment".... ????


Projection. You should stop now.

Hey genius...how much 'equity' can you buy from Musk for X?

 

[Althea]

Let's say the electric utility pays 1% dividends, and you pay $5,000 a year for electricity. Then if you invest $500,000 in the electric utility, your dividends would before taxes pay for your electricity... But there are two obvious problems with that. Because the dividends are income, you have to pay taxes on it, so will be losing money. Also, you could buy very safe bonds and get $25k returns on that money. That would pay your electricity, your taxes, and give you a nice profit.



You definitely have a 6th grader understanding of accounting. The IRS considers dividends to be income, so you have to pay taxes on it. I doubt you would be able to get your electricity considered a business expense on investments into a electric utility.

It is probably best to try to maximize your income, not "pair" your income to expenses. If you make $10k a month, from any income stream, you can easily pay $200 a month for electricity.

I tried to explain this to gfm and Terry. If they want to get 'free' electricity by looking for a stock that's only paying a 4% dividend, then let them try.

Of course, this is evidently a 'thought experiment'.

 

[Althea]

Equity in a corporation means for the most part means shares. You are buying a share of the corporation, and the certificates of these shares are called shares.

One can buy and sell shares in a privately held company, but it is difficult. If there are too many owners, it has to be publicly traded, so the number of owners is limited. And because there is not automatic price discovery, there must be lengthy negotiations before a sale. The Shark Tank makes it look easy, but the negotiations usually last for weeks if not months.

In short, while ONE can buy shares in a privately held company, YOU cannot.

As the discussion devolved into back pedaling, and making false claims, the terminology was lost.

Lots of companies are publicly traded on a variety of markets. If a company is not publicly traded, like Twitter (now X) nobody can magically acquire equity in a company that isn't taking outside investment.

The Shark Tank reference was moronic. Companies/individuals approach the Sharks LOOKING for investment. Which is why I can't get gfm to tell us one time a Shark ever knocked on a door looking to obtain equity in a business that simply isn't looking for investors.