Catch-22

[Mason Michaels]

Back in my hippy days it was de rigeur to read all of those stream of consciousness type books like On the Road, Electric Kool Aid Acid Test, Catch 22 etc. I recently picked up Zen and the Art of Motorbike Maintenance after many years and that was well worth the effort, maybe I should reread Catch 22? I used to listen to pretentious students raving about it at university perhaps that's what put me off it?

If you are interested there is a truly excellent book called A Piece of Cake written in the 80s and made into a TV miniseries, truly wonderful book about an RAF squadron in WW2. It has some memorable quotes.

"They're all a bit mad, you know. They wouldn't do it unless there was a damn good chance of getting killed, wouldn't they? So they can't be completely normal. They're not what you'd call model citizens, any of them. More like Vandals, I suppose. They're just itching to be turned loose with an eight-gun Hurricane on some lumbering great bomber. I mean that's your average fighter pilot's attitude, isn't it? Show him something, anything really, and deep down inside, his first reaction is: What sort of a mess could I make of that with a couple of three-second bursts? Herd of cows, doubledecker bus, garden party--makes no difference what it is, that's the thought in the back of his mind. Not surprising, really. I've often thought it's a damn good job they're in the RAF, otherwise they'd all be out there blowing up banks."

"The whole purpose of the armed forces can be summed up in one word – killing. Now, I don’t find that goal – in your words – marvellous, or magnificent, and try as I might I cannot bring myself to feel proud of it. Grateful, perhaps, as one is selfishly grateful for the existence of men who keep the sewage system working. But proud? No."

"One tries to be open minded. If anyone can show me the glamour in a man’s head getting blown off, I shall do my best to see it."

"You know… leadership is a confidence trick. You have to persuade men that you can do absolutely anything, otherwise they lose confidence in you and instead of following eagerly into the jaws of death they begin wondering whether perhaps they should go to the toilet instead."

I read a interview with Joseph Heller he said everything he knew about the outside world was Catch 22.Everything he knew about the inside world in your head was Something Happened

 

[Minister of Truth]

Catch-22 is a book where you're damned if you read it and damned if you don't read it.

 

[Cypress]

its amazing how the right wingers love the liberal point of view in movies, art and music

Paul "boy wonder" Ryan's favorite band purportedly is Rage Against the Machine, who are basically of the same political litmus as Leon Trotsky.

Ann Coulter is a devoted Dead Head and loyal adherent to the Grateful Dead.

David Brooks is a groupie of Bruce Springsteen>the ultimate blue collar, union labor hero.

I chalk it up to the fact that conservatives, by disposition and temperament, are not creative, artistic, original. Even though they can be drawn to those who are. I think that is why fields like accounting, banking, marketing draw the interest of many teabaggers.

 

[Nomad]

Paul "boy wonder" Ryan's favorite band purportedly is Rage Against the Machine, who are basically of the same political litmus as Leon Trotsky.

Ann Coulter is a devoted Dead Head and loyal adherent to the Grateful Dead.

David Brooks is a groupie of Bruce Springsteen>the ultimate blue collar, union labor hero.

I chalk it up to the fact that conservatives, by disposition and temperament, are not creative, artistic, original. Even though they can be drawn to those who are. I think that is why fields like accounting, banking, marketing draw the interest of many teabaggers.

I've noticed the penchant for uber righties to head bang and rock out, etc.

I've always found it odd how such straight-laced square heads who profess to be so against the culture of sex, drugs and rock-n-roll, can turn around and embrace the music of sex, drugs and rock-n-roll.

Total case of cognitive dissonance at play there.

 

[Nomad]

Back in my hippy days it was de rigeur to read all of those stream of consciousness type books like On the Road, Electric Kool Aid Acid Test, Catch 22 etc. I recently picked up Zen and the Art of Motorbike Maintenance after many years and that was well worth the effort, maybe I should reread Catch 22? I used to listen to pretentious students raving about it at university perhaps that's what put me off it?

Catch-22 is not even in the same category as those books.

Catch-22 is pure satire. Those other books were something altogether different.

Tom Robbins (Even Cowgirls Get The Blues, Another Roadside Attraction, Jitterbug Perfume) is that kind of writer.

 

[Cypress]

I've noticed the penchant for uber righties to head bang and rock out, etc.

I've always found it odd how such straight-laced square heads who profess to be so against the culture of sex, drugs and rock-n-roll, can turn around and embrace the music of sex, drugs and rock-n-roll.

Total case of cognitive dissonance at play there.

I do not begrudge the teabaggers. A 22 year old Trump loving wingnut likes good music as much as his/her liberal peers.

What other choice does the intrepid teabagger have? In my day, the choice was to either listen to the extremely lame Christian metal band Stryper -- or to metal gods Iron Maiden.

The choice is a really no brainer >> it is a pre-determined outcome given how the creative/artistic gene is predominantly found in liberals.

Conservative metal wanna-bees, Stryper>>

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Back in my hippy days it was de rigeur to read all of those stream of consciousness type books like On the Road, Electric Kool Aid Acid Test, Catch 22 etc. I recently picked up Zen and the Art of Motorbike Maintenance after many years and that was well worth the effort, maybe I should reread Catch 22? I used to listen to pretentious students raving about it at university perhaps that's what put me off it?

If you are interested there is a truly excellent book called A Piece of Cake written in the 80s and made into a TV miniseries, truly wonderful book about an RAF squadron in WW2. It has some memorable quotes.

"They're all a bit mad, you know. They wouldn't do it unless there was a damn good chance of getting killed, wouldn't they? So they can't be completely normal. They're not what you'd call model citizens, any of them. More like Vandals, I suppose. They're just itching to be turned loose with an eight-gun Hurricane on some lumbering great bomber. I mean that's your average fighter pilot's attitude, isn't it? Show him something, anything really, and deep down inside, his first reaction is: What sort of a mess could I make of that with a couple of three-second bursts? Herd of cows, doubledecker bus, garden party--makes no difference what it is, that's the thought in the back of his mind. Not surprising, really. I've often thought it's a damn good job they're in the RAF, otherwise they'd all be out there blowing up banks."

"The whole purpose of the armed forces can be summed up in one word – killing. Now, I don’t find that goal – in your words – marvellous, or magnificent, and try as I might I cannot bring myself to feel proud of it. Grateful, perhaps, as one is selfishly grateful for the existence of men who keep the sewage system working. But proud? No."

"One tries to be open minded. If anyone can show me the glamour in a man’s head getting blown off, I shall do my best to see it."

"You know… leadership is a confidence trick. You have to persuade men that you can do absolutely anything, otherwise they lose confidence in you and instead of following eagerly into the jaws of death they begin wondering whether perhaps they should go to the toilet instead."

Oh I love Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance. Though a very good and thought provoking book it's not as good as its title. I think it's the best title for a book ever.

I wouldn't describe Catch-22 as "stream of consciousness". The writing technique is third party omniscient narrative in which the narrator tells the story via the characters point of view. Heller uses a circular method of telling the story lines in which by the third or fourth chapter you're familiar with all the major events. As Heller introduces more characters and narrates their point of view of the same events he provides more detail about those events and the the telling of the events becomes less and less absurd and funny and more dark and horrifying climaxing in Snowden's secret. The novel ends on a high note when the main character, Yossarian, receives some unexpected good news. What makes Catch-22 a difficult read for most people is its separate story lines are out of sequence and non-chronological (kind of like the movie Pulp Fiction) and there are about 20 some major characters. Since the basis of the humor in Catch-22 is the absurdity of circular reasoning he has structured the story non-chronologically, where he keeps circling back to events and describes them with more detail from another characters point of view.

The humor in Catch-22 is based on absurdity, circular reasoning and logical irrationality that Heller models from real world experiences, such as, Milo Minderbinder's motto "What's good for M&M enterprises is what's good for the country" or that the three most powerful persons in the Italian theater of the war are a Mess Officer, a Mail Clerk and a shit head obsessed with parades.

Catch-22 itself is a humorous example of circular reasoning. Flying bombing missions was extremely dangerous. Attrition rates for air crews were over 100% at 12 missions. So to keep flying you have to be crazy.

"There was only one catch and that was Catch-22, which specified that a concern for one's safety in the face of dangers that were real and immediate was the process of a rational mind. Orr was crazy and could be grounded. All he had to do was ask; and as soon as he did, he would no longer be crazy and would have to fly more missions. Orr would be crazy to fly more missions and sane if he didn't, but if he were sane he had to fly them. If he flew them he was crazy and didn't have to, but if he didn't want to he was sane and had to. Yossarian was moved very deeply by the absolute simplicity of this clause of Catch-22 and let out a respectful whistle. " Catch-22, pp 56.

 

[Mott the Hoople]

Catch-22 is a book where you're damned if you read it and damned if you don't read it.

Exactly.