canceled.2021.1
#AMERICAISDEAD
This is why yours is the only pro abortion position I respect. I don’t like it but at least you are honest about it being murder and don’t twist yourself into knots like the other JPP phonies who call
cawacko and mott - what would it take for them to flip parties?
- Thread starter BRUTALITOPS
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This is why yours is the only pro abortion position I respect. I don’t like it but at least you are honest about it being murder and don’t twist yourself into knots like the other JPP phonies who call
PostmodernProphet
fully immersed in faith..
and everyone else's........
ok lets explain this for your small brain
tax cuts are not something that is being "given" to anyone.
it's something that is not being TAKEN
The rich already have more money of theirs taken, both by percentage and by net amount, than a poor person.
you seem to have this false idea that there is just this magical pool of money that everybody owns and is entitled to, and the rich people line up and get more from this public pool of money that magically appears.
this is false.
the magical pool of money that you think exists only exists because it was already previously taken from the rich
christiefan915
Catalyst
Stop defending moron trump and his voodoo economics. My ideas are formed from what the experts say, not what message board posters think. Read up on who profited the most from the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act."The $1.5 trillion cut, however, has so far disproportionately benefited the country’s richest citizens. In 2025, a quarter of tax benefits will go to the wealthiest 1 percent of Americans, and 66 percent will go to the top 20 percent of earners, according to the Urban-Brookings Tax Policy Center.
...trump repeatedly told voters that they would see the benefits of decreased corporate tax rates in their paychecks. But an analysis by the Economic Policy Institute (EPI) found that compensation for top executives grew by 17.6 percent in 2017. Real average hourly earnings for workers, meanwhile, remained relatively stagnant. Since the tax plan passed, the study found, companies spent 37 times more money on stock buybacks than on bonuses or increased wages for workers.
https://www.newsweek.com/trump-tax-cuts-rich-americans-republicans-1133372
...so far, the cuts have not been linked to an increase in labor share or more investments. The Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago’s current capital spending index indicates private business investment plans have remained in negative territory since 2015. The most certain effect of the tax cuts has been to help fuel a massive increase in the federal deficit and debt. So where is all the money saved from corporate tax cuts going? First, to companies’ bottom lines and second to stock buybacks, which were recently at a record high. So far, in 2018, the 500 corporations in the S&P Index have received $30 billion from the corporate rate cut, which in turn accounts for over 40 percent of S&P equity earnings growth.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/teresa...rom-the-tax-cut-10-months-later/#53090c3626bb
https://itep.org/tax-reform-princip...august-raise-more-questions-than-they-answer/
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
I hate to say this cause I’m a shirt tail relative of the Taft family but he was certainly better than Bob Taft. I think Kasich governed well and competently. As to being great? I’ll leave that to historians. He can certainly be an abrasive asshole.
cawacko
Well-known member
"The $1.5 trillion cut, however, has so far disproportionately benefited the country’s richest citizens. In 2025, a quarter of tax benefits will go to the wealthiest 1 percent of Americans, and 66 percent will go to the top 20 percent of earners, according to the Urban-Brookings Tax Policy Center.
...trump repeatedly told voters that they would see the benefits of decreased corporate tax rates in their paychecks. But an analysis by the Economic Policy Institute (EPI) found that compensation for top executives grew by 17.6 percent in 2017. Real average hourly earnings for workers, meanwhile, remained relatively stagnant. Since the tax plan passed, the study found, companies spent 37 times more money on stock buybacks than on bonuses or increased wages for workers.
https://www.newsweek.com/trump-tax-cuts-rich-americans-republicans-1133372
...so far, the cuts have not been linked to an increase in labor share or more investments. The Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago’s current capital spending index indicates private business investment plans have remained in negative territory since 2015. The most certain effect of the tax cuts has been to help fuel a massive increase in the federal deficit and debt. So where is all the money saved from corporate tax cuts going? First, to companies’ bottom lines and second to stock buybacks, which were recently at a record high. So far, in 2018, the 500 corporations in the S&P Index have received $30 billion from the corporate rate cut, which in turn accounts for over 40 percent of S&P equity earnings growth.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/teresa...rom-the-tax-cut-10-months-later/#53090c3626bb
https://itep.org/tax-reform-princip...august-raise-more-questions-than-they-answer/
What Grind stated had nothing to do with Trump or "vodoo economics". You said the government gives tax money to the rich (via tax cuts). That is incorrect. The government can only give out what it first takes in via taxes. People keeping more money that they earn isn't taking money from someone else. If you keep more of your own money does not mean you are taking money from me.
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
Sighh....you’re naive if you don’t think that doesn’t exist to a significant extent in the here and now. I’m no revolutionary or even a reformer. It’s just part of our reality. The upper economic political class have always used government to protect their economic prerogatives and to redistribute productive wealth.
Why do think that most of the wealthiest people in our society are not the producers but middlemen?
canceled.2021.1
#AMERICAISDEAD
Where do leftists get this notion that a tax cut means the gobblement “gave” someone money?
The only way you can believe this is if you believe it is the gobblements money to begin with and not yours.
The only way you can believe this is if you believe it is the gobblements money to begin with and not yours.
ThatOwlWoman
Leftist Vermin
I agree with Jade's language and characterization of "pro-life." "Pro-choice" in common vernacular refers only to abortion rights, not to taxes, sniffing glue, doing naughty things with farm animals, or any other specious corruptions of the phrase.
This is what they actually believe
I don’t know how they think this way. This is basic stuff that I knew at 12 years old
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
Let’s explain this as it is in reality. Taxes have always been used to redistribute productive wealth. For most of history it has been solely redistributed from the producers to the political class.
We currently live in a Republic that represents a blip in time in history where the producers have real political influence to prevent all taxes being redistributed to the political class. Even then much of the taxes paid by our producers is indirectly redistributed in a manner that disproportionately benefits the political class. Now one could argue with varying degrees of truth that those redistributions benefit it all and that the common people do have power to have some of that redistributed to their advantage but the notion that our taxes are taken from the producers and only redistributed downwards is simply wrong.
That’s why it’s my goal in life to one day be part of the political class...but that’s just an aspiration...i’m Not unhappy being a middle class American.
christiefan915
Catalyst
Then what would you call it? I'm not arguing semantics. I'll give a simple example and you can explain it better to me.
If in 2017 you as part of a married couple were in the top tax bracket, your rate was 39.6%.
If in 2018 you as part of a married couple were in the top tax bracket, your rate was 37%.
Yes, I know that you already paid the taxes but your rate in 2018 was lower than in 2017. If you won't call it a cut, what would you call it?
cawacko
Well-known member
I'll offer an example then answer your question.
We all know cities and states offer economic incentives to businesses. One way they do it is by offering a dollar amount, say $10m, if they promise to move their HQ to the state and hire a certain number of workers. The city/state will pay that money up front and often rely on the good word of the business to fulfill their promise. So the city/states make this "investment" with the belief it will pay more back to the city/state in the long run. But the city/state is taking our money up front and giving it to the business.
Another way they do it is to tell a business if you move here and create X number of jobs we will give you a break on your taxes. So they aren't giving money away up front. They aren't taking money from you and me and just giving it to the business. In this scenario the business has to produce. (one can still call this corporate welfare but if you're going to do corporate welfare would you rather the first or second example?)
It's the same with taxes. I understand your point about the lowering of marginal rates. But keeping more of the money you earn, via lower rates, isn't taking from someone else. Let's say you make $100K and pay $25K in taxes one year and $22K in taxes the following year because rates were reduced, you didn't "take" $3K from "me" because you paid less. The government can't give me, you or us something it never had.
Minister of Truth
Practically Perfect
So, you are giving people back their own money, and that's a problem for you. I got a nifty tax break, which I would like to keep for myself.
Mott the Hoople
Sweet Jane
I don’t get to upset about it. Death and taxes. Know what I mean? At the end of the day, even after taxes, as a middle class American My earnings are in the top 0.1% of the entire human population. It’s good to be the King.
no, it doesn't. who ever said that? nobody. i think you've been confused for a very long time. it wouldn't even make sense, because again a perceived innocent life is different from a serial killer. surely you can understand that difference even if you are pro choice
it terrifies me that this even needs to be explained. I literally do not comprehend how someone can be an adult and not know this. to me not understanding this is equivalent to saying something like "oh wait, you mean I'm supposed to wipe after taking a shit? huh"
so mott, getting back to the topic at hand before we had the tourettes crew jump in about abortion, what would be meaningful, tangible steps by republicans that they could make to win you over? what do you exactly mean about southern populism and how would you fix that element within the party?
