Con Law - Lesson 1 "The Preamble"

Jarod said:
this is just the start. If and when I have time I will continue with other parts of the constitution. Parts are important, including the preamble. Very significant part of the preamble is the promotion of the common good. The writers were very specific about the words they chose the capitalizations and the sentence structure.

It’s more than just a forward, it’s an intention statement, that can be used when discussing the framers intent in later portions.
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yes they chose carefully as they knew parsing would be attempted.
like the meaning of "promote".
 
Poor Richard Saunders said:
Much of what is in the preamble is included in the later document.

We the People of the United States, - defined in Art IV section 2
in Order to form a more perfect Union, - Art IV, Art VII
establish Justice, Art III
insure domestic Tranquility, Art IV section 4
provide for the common defense, Art I, Art II, Art IV
promote the general Welfare, Art I Section 8 Paragraph 1 It is specifically mentioned as a power of Congress

and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, - a wishful outcome for all of the above but the ability to unsecure anything is in Art V
do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America." Art VII
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Again...'general welfare' does NOT mean communism of fascism in any way, not to cancel any part of the Constitution in any way.
'General welfare' means 'for the benefit of the general population'. In other words, it is again a directive, and a restraint. NOT a power or authority.
'Common defense' means just that. It is also a directive, and an authority, to create a national military.
 
evince said:
They told us their intent



If it was throw away they would have thrown it away


You have no interest in the founders INTENT


THANK YOU FOR ADMITTING THAT



It was always a right wing bullshit lie
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That would be YOU.

It is YOU that wants to discard the Constitution.
 
Jarod said:
The reason not to include something meaningless in a legal document is because it might be misconstrued to mean something unintended.

Well, the question about what the limits are is a big debate and needs to be answered during our study of the rest of the document.
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'general welfare' has a specific meaning. It does NOT mean 'communism' or 'fascism' or 'socialism' of any kind.
It simply means that the purpose of the federal government (one of its restraints) is that any power or authority it DOES have declared to it in the Constitution must be used for the benefit of the people and of the States.

Socialism is theft of wealth. It is NOT a benefit. NOTHING authorizes socialism.

The Social Security Administration is unconstitutional. It is forceably taking the wealth of people that are productive and giving it to the unproductive most of it to the government itself!). It is by force. It is NOT charity. It is theft.
It is not general welfare.

Improving post roads into freeways is constitutional. It is funded by those that use it through gas taxes. It is a power that the federal government maintain or build post roads. It is also good for the general welfare of the people and the States.

Passing legislation to construct a dam on a river is constitutional. It controls the river so it doesn't run all over and destroy, and converts it into useful irrigation water and electrical power. People can also build safely near the river now. It improves the general welfare of both the people and the States.

Passing legislation to build a wall on the border with Mexico is constitutional. The federal government is responsible for maintaining national border security. This protection of U.S. territory is a benefit to the people and to the States. This is again the general welfare clause in action.

The welfare clause it itself a limit and a restraint.
 
evince said:
It’s very clear what it meant



general is a word


It’s defined in the dictionary


Welfare has a meaning


It’s defined n the dictionary



The founders were aware of the meanings of those words
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Dictionaries do not define any word.

You do not get to speak for the dead.
 
evince said:
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/welfare


welfare noun
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wel·​fare | \ ˈwel-ˌfer \
Essential Meaning of welfare
1 : a government program for poor or unemployed people that helps pay for their food, housing, medical costs, etc.
He wants to do away with welfare.
His family is on welfare. [=receiving government assistance]
2 : the state of being happy, healthy, or successful : WELL-BEING
I have your welfare at heart.
The welfare of all the orphans was at stake.
She donates to organizations concerned about animal welfare.
Full Definition of welfare (Entry 1 of 2)
1 : the state of doing well especially in respect to good fortune, happiness, well-being, or prosperity
must look out for your own welfare
2a : aid in the form of money or necessities for those in need
b : an agency or program through which such aid is distributed
welfare adjective
Definition of welfare (Entry 2 of 2)
1 : of, relating to, or concerned with welfare and especially with improvement of the welfare of disadvantaged social groups
welfare legislation
2 : receiving public welfare benefits
welfare families

Synonyms & Antonyms
More Example Sentences
Learn More About welfare

Synonyms & Antonyms for welfare
Synonyms: Noun
good, interest, weal, well-being
Antonyms: Noun
ill-being
Visit
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Theft is not welfare. Dictionaries do not define any word. Socialism is theft of wealth. That includes fascism and communism. No, you cannot cancel the rest of the constitution that way.
 
evince said:
1 : of, relating to, or affecting all the people or things in a group
They have issued a general warning/order.
a general alarm
: involving or including many or most people



1 : the state of doing well especially in respect to good fortune, happiness, well-being, or prosperity
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You are in paradox.

1) 'general welfare' means everybody.
2) 'general welfare' means a select group (the poor?).
 
Into the Night said:
Dutch Uncle said:
Into the Night said:
Bigotry. TDS. Inversion fallacy. You are describing yourself.
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Explain your reasoning. Support your argument. If you cannot, then why should anyone respect you?
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I don't need to explain your reasoning.
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Correct, but you dodged the question....and ended up confirming my assessment of you.

Liars are either dishonest people or mentally ill.

You are not a dishonest person, IMO, but by dodging the question and turning it on me, you proved you are a liar, sir.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
Correct, but you dodged the question....and ended up confirming my assessment of you.

Liars are either dishonest people or mentally ill.

You are not a dishonest person, IMO, but by dodging the question and turning it on me, you proved you are a liar, sir.
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Your fallacies are YOUR fallacies, stupid. They are part of YOUR fucked up reasoning. I do not need to explain YOUR reasoning (bad as it is) to you.
Psychoquackery. Insult fallacies. Attempted inversion. Trolling. No argument presented.
 
Into the Night said:
♬♪ I'm a little tea pot short and stout! ♪♩♬♪
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62cqdc.jpg
 
Jarod said:
"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."


These 52 words were presented to the Constitutional Convention by the "Committee on Style" and adopted to be what we call the Preamble to the Constitution. It is as good of a place to start our study of the United States Constitution as any. While there is debate as to the use of the Preamble to establish law and or structure of American government, it is clearly an attempt to set the tone and explain what the document is, how it is to be viewed and the what the document is intended to be and do.

1) "We the People of the United States..." The first seven words show us the class of people who this document applies to... There were several drafts of this portion of the Constitution including "We the people of the various states" as is used in the Articles of Confederation and there was" or "We the People of the various states" and "The People of the united States... (listing them)" as was used in the Treaty of France. It is commonly noted that the drafters did not know how many States would sign on so listing them was a bad idea. The choice of the novel previously unused phrase "We the People of the United States" creates the existence of an actual Nation of people called the United States... Note that they capitalized the phrase "United States" making it an entity on its own. The States are not even mentioned in the preamble.

2) "In Order to form a more perfect Union" - The reason the Constitution was written, and to establish its supremacy over the previous Government created by the Articles of Confederation.

3) "This Constitution..." is also another important phrase, establishing that this is it, the entirety of what is to be considered The Constitution, establishing that it was to be this single document as distinguished from what English Government calls its Document which is a series of Writings and Documents cobbled together to establish the form and structure of their government. The single document Constitution was a novel idea for these former English Subjects.

4) Particularly interesting is the actual power the "Preamble" has had when interpreting the Constitution of the United States, the Supreme Court has used it to illustrate the intent of the framers as to what powers they actually intended to give with the subsequent Articles. In, Berman v. Parker, 348 US 26 (1954) the Court held that the term "promote the general welfare.." illustrates that the writers intended to give the Federal Government powers that enabled them to promote the general welfare, in that case use the right of eminent domain.
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almost all of this bullshit post is being deliberately misconstrued by a liberal nazi to promote tyrannical government power
 
SmarterthanYou said:
almost all of this bullshit post is being deliberately misconstrued by a liberal nazi to promote tyrannical government power
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As opposed to your desire to overthrow the US government, killing any Americans, regardless of age, who get in your way?
 
Jarod said:
How so?
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because a bunch of morons, like yourself, have been led by the nose ring of slavery to believe that the Constitution was written to apply to Americans, when IN FACT, the constitution was written to apply to GOVERNMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm sure that accepting the above MIGHT be difficult for you, but IF, IF you are able to understand and accept the concept that WE THE PEOPLE wrote that constitution and that it prescribes LIMITED powers to the government, you MIGHT have an inkling of the idea about freedom that the founders tried to provide
 
SmarterthanYou said:
because a bunch of morons, like yourself, have been led by the nose ring of slavery to believe that the Constitution was written to apply to Americans, when IN FACT, the constitution was written to apply to GOVERNMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm sure that accepting the above MIGHT be difficult for you, but IF, IF you are able to understand and accept the concept that WE THE PEOPLE wrote that constitution and that it prescribes LIMITED powers to the government, you MIGHT have an inkling of the idea about freedom that the founders tried to provide
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You are barely literate and should be lecturing no one.
 
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