Do you still support America's genocide in the Middle East?

We need a new national policy. To make oil worthless as an energy source with renewable energy, nuclear power and electric cars.
 
hotdog said:
I said make oil worthless as an "energy source"
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Okay, Okay... no need to go all BIG LETTER on me! I misread.

Still, whenever I hear people talk like this, it is usually followed by some pinhead trying to pass a bill to charge me an extra tax to make "the dream" happen. I am all for some massive effort to move away from oil as an energy source, but I firmly believe this should be done through the private sector, not by government. I don't have a problem with tax incentives or even grant loans for upstarts and research, to get the whole thing off the ground, but government 'involvement' in the process should be limited to that.

The thing people need to realize is this... no matter what we did... best case scenario, we are looking at 30-50 years, before oil would become totally obsolete as an energy source. Do you have any idea of how many internal combustion engines are out there? We can't just tell people to scrap them and buy the 'newest-latest-greatest-thing' can we? What about the poooooooor.... who have the '68 Impala in need of a ring job? Are we going to have to buy them an electric car at $40,000? How about avid car collectors? You want to tell them their classic is now a worthless hunk of scrap metal? How about the diesel-powered and jet fuel-powered machinery that no other energy source we've come up with, can produce enough horsepower to replace? You see, it will be a VERY long time before we can work this all out, to where we have sufficient capabilities to declare oil obsolete as an energy source. Even then, the world will still need oil to produce plastics and a number of other products.

And on a side note... the term "renewable energy" is somewhat of an oxymoron, there really is no such thing as energy that is renewable. Energy is energy... once it is spent, it doesn't 'renew' itself... against the laws of physics. There is, what I would call 'recyclable energy' where a certain percentage of the energy can be reused. This is what you are talking about.

But be careful with this line of thinking hotdog... I have read enough of your posts to know you are pretty much a conservative guy, don't get sucked into the liberal trap like a John McCain or Lindsey Graham... the libs depend on softies like you, to push their socialism down our throats... and they have no shame about it, they'll use this longing desire to make oil obsolete, to burden us with even more debt and obligation. THE WAY is through good old fashioned capitalism and the free market. The American entrepreneurial spirit, and ingenuity.... not Government Nannyism!
 
Dune said:
You denying genocide is no different than an alcholic denying a drinking problem. It is expected. What is sad is that you can't offer any evidence to support your claim.
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No, what is sad; is your pathetic attempts to continue to defend your dumbfuck conclusion.
 
USFREEDOM911 said:
No, what is sad; is your pathetic attempts to continue to defend your dumbfuck conclusion.
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Maybe we invaded Iraq so that the media would have something to talk about. News stations created the war by first preasuring Bush to attack Iraq and then turned against him once they had successfully manipulated him into doing what they want. The war in Iraq isn't about genocide its about ratings. War is good news and bad war news is the best. The television stations/press needs stories so now the media is taking over politics to create the stories they need.
 
hotdog said:
Maybe we invaded Iraq so that the media would have something to talk about. News stations created the war by first preasuring Bush to attack Iraq and then turned against him once they had successfully manipulated him into doing what they want. The war in Iraq isn't about genocide its about ratings. War is good news and bad war news is the best. The television stations/press needs stories so now the media is taking over politics to create the stories they need.
Click to expand...

I take back my earlier comments about you sounding like a conservative... you are sounding more and more like a TROLL!

Can you be any more goofy? ....Ratings? You think our government spent hundreds of billions of dollars and countless soldiers lives, so that TV and press could have better ratings?

No one "pressured" Bush into doing a DAMN thing! He tried, for two years solid, to remedy the situation in Iraq through diplomatic efforts. Finally, after every effort had been (reasonably) exhausted, with the authorization voted on by Congress, he used his authority to order the invasion and liberation of Iraq. There was no pressure for him to do this, to the contrary, the pressure was for him to NOT do it, and as soon as he did, that pressure turned into anti-war vitriol, and it still hasn't subsided, even after the war was won, Saddam was toppled, and Clinton's 1998 Iraq Liberation Act was realized, with a functioning democratic government in Iraq.

Now.... Jump ahead to Egypt... and we have the same anti-war liberals lecturing us about the need for democracy in Egypt! It's the Bush Fucking Doctrine! Being promoted and lauded by LIBERALS!
 
it's obviously not genocide, because we don't discriminate like that. We kill regardless of country of origin. Get in the way of the oil, or imperial intentions and you die.
 
Dixie said:
I take back my earlier comments about you sounding like a conservative... you are sounding more and more like a TROLL!

Can you be any more goofy? ....Ratings? You think our government spent hundreds of billions of dollars and countless soldiers lives, so that TV and press could have better ratings?

No one "pressured" Bush into doing a DAMN thing! He tried, for two years solid, to remedy the situation in Iraq through diplomatic efforts. Finally, after every effort had been (reasonably) exhausted, with the authorization voted on by Congress, he used his authority to order the invasion and liberation of Iraq. There was no pressure for him to do this, to the contrary, the pressure was for him to NOT do it, and as soon as he did, that pressure turned into anti-war vitriol, and it still hasn't subsided, even after the war was won, Saddam was toppled, and Clinton's 1998 Iraq Liberation Act was realized, with a functioning democratic government in Iraq.

Now.... Jump ahead to Egypt... and we have the same anti-war liberals lecturing us about the need for democracy in Egypt! It's the Bush Fucking Doctrine! Being promoted and lauded by LIBERALS!
Click to expand...

Cheney, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz pressured Bush plenty, don't kid yourself otherwise.

As to Egypt, this liberal thinks we should do NOTHING there either. Leave the cretins to their own devices.
 
hotdog said:
Maybe we invaded Iraq so that the media would have something to talk about. News stations created the war by first preasuring Bush to attack Iraq and then turned against him once they had successfully manipulated him into doing what they want. The war in Iraq isn't about genocide its about ratings. War is good news and bad war news is the best. The television stations/press needs stories so now the media is taking over politics to create the stories they need.
Click to expand...

Or, maybe we went there because Bush's daddy got spanked there, and Cheney is a greedy inhuman prick.
 
Dixie said:
Okay, Okay... no need to go all BIG LETTER on me! I misread.

Still, whenever I hear people talk like this, it is usually followed by some pinhead trying to pass a bill to charge me an extra tax to make "the dream" happen. I am all for some massive effort to move away from oil as an energy source, but I firmly believe this should be done through the private sector, not by government. I don't have a problem with tax incentives or even grant loans for upstarts and research, to get the whole thing off the ground, but government 'involvement' in the process should be limited to that.

The thing people need to realize is this... no matter what we did... best case scenario, we are looking at 30-50 years, before oil would become totally obsolete as an energy source. Do you have any idea of how many internal combustion engines are out there? We can't just tell people to scrap them and buy the 'newest-latest-greatest-thing' can we? What about the poooooooor.... who have the '68 Impala in need of a ring job? Are we going to have to buy them an electric car at $40,000? How about avid car collectors? You want to tell them their classic is now a worthless hunk of scrap metal? How about the diesel-powered and jet fuel-powered machinery that no other energy source we've come up with, can produce enough horsepower to replace? You see, it will be a VERY long time before we can work this all out, to where we have sufficient capabilities to declare oil obsolete as an energy source. Even then, the world will still need oil to produce plastics and a number of other products.

And on a side note... the term "renewable energy" is somewhat of an oxymoron, there really is no such thing as energy that is renewable. Energy is energy... once it is spent, it doesn't 'renew' itself... against the laws of physics. There is, what I would call 'recyclable energy' where a certain percentage of the energy can be reused. This is what you are talking about.

But be careful with this line of thinking hotdog... I have read enough of your posts to know you are pretty much a conservative guy, don't get sucked into the liberal trap like a John McCain or Lindsey Graham... the libs depend on softies like you, to push their socialism down our throats... and they have no shame about it, they'll use this longing desire to make oil obsolete, to burden us with even more debt and obligation. THE WAY is through good old fashioned capitalism and the free market. The American entrepreneurial spirit, and ingenuity.... not Government Nannyism!
Click to expand...

While you are likely right about the time frame, you are wrong about the reasons. Plenty of liquid fuels can be manufactured to run classics and diesels. The reason we are not headed there is we don't have the will. Tree-huggers are too few, liberals are too lackadasical, republican leadership is too greedy and republican followers are too stupid.

Renewable energy; it is not the energy that is renewable, obviously, it is the source that is renewable. many are, oil is not. I doubt we have 50 years worth left.
 
Am I the only one laughing at the cousin marrier thinking he know's the inner circle of Bush. That's fucking hillarious. Thanks Dixtard.
 
Topspin said:
Am I the only one laughing at the cousin marrier thinking he know's the inner circle of Bush. That's fucking hillarious. Thanks Dixtard.
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I stopped reding Dixies posts a long time ago. So many words to say so little just isn't worth my time right now.
 
He's funny for a fat ass Bama redneck posing as someone educated.
He is Larry the cable guy with less money.
 
No said:
And the opinions of proles with no supporting evidence whatsoever (as you've yet to produce any sort of evidence at all in this thread) is all anyone needs to here.
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Acusations of genocide are always extremely controversial.

Who wants to admit that their beloved country is murdeering inocents?

Proof is a matter of opinion, is there enough criteria or isn't there. I say there is, you say there isn't. I get it. Estimates of Iraqi deaths are all over the chart, from as low as 100,000 to as high as 1.5 million and everywhere between.

I can post all kinds of links which can then be dismissed as liberal B.S.
That's kind of pointless.

Here are some facts, though;

Iraq had nothing to do with 9-11.
Even as the towers were still burning Iraq was being blamed.
Cheney and Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz wanted a war. They didn't really care where.
Bush is a moron who couldn't shine shoes well, and was readily manipulated by those three criminals.
We invaded a soverign nation, unprovoked, and against the will of most of the world.
We built a house of cards coilition composed of those dependent on us.
Iraqis have been and are being killed indiscriminantly.
As soon as we were in Iraq, Iran entered our cross-hairs.
We support Israel regardless of the atrocities they commit against arabs.
Said support is one of the major causes of Jihad.
Israelies are religous fanatics who never back down though history has seen them crushed repeatedly. Their land was stolen from it's rightful inhabitants and is retained by force and bloodshed only.
We will never leave Iraq, anymore than we have left Germany, or Japan.
We bombed the crap out of IRAQ in '91, destroying the 4th largest air force in the world, at the time.Like other dictators we bombed the crap out of, Saddam would never have bothered us again.
We used massive amounts of depleted urainum in our bombs in the second gulf war, the killing there will last for thousands of generations.
Under army rule #80, only geneticaly modified seeds provided by Monsanto Corp can be planted by Iraqis. The native seeds, bred for the local conditions for 4,000 years are illegal. This alone, while disguised as heinous corporate greed and fascism is truly genocidal. I can continue this for days, but grow tired of it. Refute away, assholes and deniers.
 
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Dune said:
Acusations of genocide are always extremely controversial.

Who wants to admit that their beloved country is murdeering inocents?

Proof is a matter of opinion, is there enough criteria or isn't there. I say there is, you say there isn't. I get it. Estimates of Iraqi deaths are all over the chart, from as low as 100,000 to as high as 1.5 million and everywhere between.

I can post all kinds of links which can then be dismissed as liberal B.S.
That's kind of pointless.
Click to expand...
So... no you don't have sources? Ok then this next part will be super easy
Here are some facts, though;

Iraq had nothing to do with 9-11.
Click to expand...
Sure they did.
Even as the towers were still burning Iraq was being blamed.
Click to expand...
Yes, people do tend to blame Iraq, as it was the most topical ME country of the time.
Cheney and Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz wanted a war. They didn't really care where.
Click to expand...
No they didn't.
Bush is a moron who couldn't shine shoes well, and was readily manipulated by those three criminals.
Click to expand...
Nope.
We invaded a soverign nation, unprovoked, and against the will of most of the world.
Click to expand...
THIS...
We built a house of cards coilition composed of those dependent on us.
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...CONTRADICTS THIS. So we either had a coalition or we didn't It can't be both. (by the way, the irony of you calling someone stupid but being unable to use the built in spell check is pretty funny [yes, I know it's not true irony])
Iraqis have been and are being killed indiscriminantly.
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So why couldn't I kill any without a literal TON of paperwork and investigations?
As soon as we were in Iraq, Iran entered our cross-hairs.
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And? They've been in our 'cross hairs' since Carter.
We support Israel regardless of the atrocities they commit against arabs.
Click to expand...
No argument here
Said support is one of the major causes of Jihad.
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None here either.
Israelies are religous fanatics who never back down though history has seen them crushed repeatedly. Their land was stolen from it's rightful inhabitants and is retained by force and bloodshed only.
Click to expand...
So is every nation in the ME that isn't Iran. Lrn2History.
We will never leave Iraq, anymore than we have left Germany, or Japan.
Click to expand...
Well those countries want us there so...
We bombed the crap out of IRAQ in '91, destroying the 4th largest air force in the world, at the time.Like other dictators we bombed the crap out of, Saddam would never have bothered us again.
Click to expand...
Yup, stunning victory by American armed forces. But see here's the thing about international affairs. When we enter alliances, we kind have to look out for them too...
We used massive amounts of depleted urainum in our bombs in the second gulf war, the killing there will last for thousands of generations.
Click to expand...
I see you're confused. Bombs do not contain DU, as there is no purpose to it. Tank shells CAN contain DU though, but since we killed hardly any other tanks (what the DU shells are used for) I'd say that's pretty much a non issue.
Under army rule #80, only geneticaly modified seeds provided by Monsanto Corp can be planted by Iraqis. The native seeds, bred for the local conditions for 4,000 years are illegal. This alone, while disguised as heinous corporate greed and fascism is truly genocidal. I can continue this for days, but grow tired of it. Refute away, assholes and deniers.
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So let me get this straight.... it's a genocide, because supposedly they can't plant a certain type of seed. Not a type of crop mind you, just a type of seed for a crop.

That's not genocide at all. Anywhere. In the universe. Ever.
 
Dune said:
Cheney, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz pressured Bush plenty, don't kid yourself otherwise.

As to Egypt, this liberal thinks we should do NOTHING there either. Leave the cretins to their own devices.
Click to expand...

The fact that you call the Egyptians 'cretins' adds to the evidence of your complete ignorance in this thread.
 
Dune said:
Acusations of genocide are always extremely controversial.

Who wants to admit that their beloved country is murdeering inocents?

Proof is a matter of opinion, is there enough criteria or isn't there. I say there is, you say there isn't. I get it. Estimates of Iraqi deaths are all over the chart, from as low as 100,000 to as high as 1.5 million and everywhere between.

I can post all kinds of links which can then be dismissed as liberal B.S.
That's kind of pointless.

Here are some facts, though;

Iraq had nothing to do with 9-11.
Even as the towers were still burning Iraq was being blamed.
Cheney and Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz wanted a war. They didn't really care where.
Bush is a moron who couldn't shine shoes well, and was readily manipulated by those three criminals.
We invaded a soverign nation, unprovoked, and against the will of most of the world.
We built a house of cards coilition composed of those dependent on us.
Iraqis have been and are being killed indiscriminantly.
As soon as we were in Iraq, Iran entered our cross-hairs.
We support Israel regardless of the atrocities they commit against arabs.
Said support is one of the major causes of Jihad.
Israelies are religous fanatics who never back down though history has seen them crushed repeatedly. Their land was stolen from it's rightful inhabitants and is retained by force and bloodshed only.
We will never leave Iraq, anymore than we have left Germany, or Japan.
We bombed the crap out of IRAQ in '91, destroying the 4th largest air force in the world, at the time.Like other dictators we bombed the crap out of, Saddam would never have bothered us again.
We used massive amounts of depleted urainum in our bombs in the second gulf war, the killing there will last for thousands of generations.
Under army rule #80, only geneticaly modified seeds provided by Monsanto Corp can be planted by Iraqis. The native seeds, bred for the local conditions for 4,000 years are illegal. This alone, while disguised as heinous corporate greed and fascism is truly genocidal. I can continue this for days, but grow tired of it. Refute away, assholes and deniers.
Click to expand...

you were right about your posts being dismissed as liberal bull shit....starting from the beginning, nobody claimed Iraq had anything to do with 9/11.....that's a baseless claim from the left and always has been....
 
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