Does Citizens United rank as one of the worst decisions of any SCOTUS?

[christiefan915]

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It's just business.

Spoiler

 

[archives]

This pretends that Assembling is not a right.

But hey, you can pretend that folks that own corporations and gather to form such don't have the same rights as you. I will be thrilled to tell Unions they can no longer run PACs because their right to assemble and to petition the government is suspended because they work under the same corporate law as all other corporations.

Methinks you would not like the result of such an idiotic and short-sighted ruling. Nobody is saying "absolute", that's your strawman in your own field. I get that you hate that money counts as speech in politics. You know, "Congress shall make no laws" and stuff, but hey, my belief in the rights we have even when they are annoying to me is pretty strong, I get that others think they only apply when folks do things they like with those rights... I think they exist even when they do things we do not like.

Taking away the rights of people because they are part of a corporation is wrong. Even when I do not like what they do.

Is a right, a regulated right, one certainly can’t have a parade with our first drawing a permit

Never said corporations don’t have a right to exist, rather questioned the inane opinion that corporations, basically a business entity, can contribute anything they want to anyone the chose because that business entity has free speech. Is a corporation a person? Can a corporation vote?

 

[Damocles]

Is a right, a regulated right, one certainly can’t have a parade with our first drawing a permit

Never said corporations don’t have a right to exist, rather questioned the inane opinion that corporations, basically a business entity, can contribute anything they want to anyone the chose because that business entity has free speech. Is a corporation a person? Can a corporation vote?

The people who make up the corporation can certainly vote. Just like a Union (which is a corporation).

They have a right to assemble (form a company), they have a right to petition their government... Just as you do. Even you have a right to form a corporation with like minded folks and petition the government.

Their rights are the same as yours, you too can assemble and form a corporation, and that entity can (with a vote of members) donate money and participate in the political forum.

 

[leaningright]

Again, translation from liberalese into English (translations provided by the letter threeve and the number H): That pesky first amendment that allows people to gather and form corporations! Those freedoms we have guaranteed by the constitution, they suck! Especially when gatherings of people use funds to advertise for a candidate I don't like! BASTiges!

Is a right, a regulated right, one certainly can’t have a parade with our first drawing a permit

Never said corporations don’t have a right to exist, rather questioned the inane opinion that corporations, basically a business entity, can contribute anything they want to anyone the chose because that business entity has free speech. Is a corporation a person? Can a corporation vote?

Some might ask the same thing about labor unions.

Some might see the OP ruling as an opportunity for their side to receive comparable funds.

Some might …

 

[archives]

The people who make up the corporation can certainly vote. Just like a Union (which is a corporation).

They have a right to assemble (form a company), they have a right to petition their government... Just as you do. Even you have a right to form a corporation with like minded folks and petition the government.

Their rights are the same as yours, you too can assemble and form a corporation, and that entity can (with a vote of members) donate money and participate in the political forum.

And those people all have the individual right of speech, the corporation is not a person, just like the Kansas City Chiefs are not a person, both are business entities

You keep trying to make it partisan, it isn’t, Democrats Republicans, it doesn’t matter, to think that one person is allowed to give a political candidate any amount they want, or that a foreign nation can do the same, certainly isn’t what the Founders envisioned

 

[archives]

Some might ask the same thing about labor unions.

Some might see the OP ruling as an opportunity for their side to receive comparable funds.

Some might …

Got to love those who jump in without knowing what the thread is discussing, and by the way, never left out Unions

 

[Damocles]

And those people all have the individual right of speech, the corporation is not a person, just like the Kansas City Chiefs are not a person, both are business entities

You keep trying to make it partisan, it isn’t, Democrats Republicans, it doesn’t matter, to think that one person is allowed to give a political candidate any amount they want, or that a foreign nation can do the same, certainly isn’t what the Founders envisioned

So it is the fact that they assemble to petition the government that is your issue? Yes, just like you they can vote individually, again, just like a union... They can do this even if they utilize their right to assemble and petition the government more effectively than you do, their rights are no more or less than the rights you also have.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

your deflection indicates that maybe you can't distinguish political propaganda from reality.

try again, are you capable of recognizing and ignoring obvious political propaganda that you see on tv?

like 'being against h1bs is racism'?

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

So it is the fact that they assemble to petition the government that is your issue? Yes, just like you they can vote individually, again, just like a union... They can do this even if they utilize their right to assemble and petition the government more effectively than you do, their rights are no more or less than the rights you also have.

it;s that they have more rights than people and less accountability.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

let's go fascists.

right here right now bitches.

show us how much corporate jizz you can swallow.

 

[Damocles]

it;s that they have more rights than people and less accountability.

There is nothing stopping you from doing the same, they have no more rights than you do, they just exercise theirs while you do not. This is like saying "that guy owns a gun, but I don't, therefore he has 'more rights' than I do!" That's nonsense, he just exercises his rights.

You didn't even vote, according to you, does that mean you don't have that right? Of course it doesn't.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

like 'being against h1bs is racism'?

propaganda indeed

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Is a right, a regulated right, one certainly can’t have a parade with our first drawing a permit

Never said corporations don’t have a right to exist, rather questioned the inane opinion that corporations, basically a business entity, can contribute anything they want to anyone the chose because that business entity has free speech. Is a corporation a person? Can a corporation vote?

if one needs a permission slip from the government, then it's no longer a right, but a privilege. this is something that the founders were well aware of and that you apparently are not.

 

[archives]

So it is the fact that they assemble to petition the government that is your issue? Yes, just like you they can vote individually, again, just like a union... They can do this even if they utilize their right to assemble and petition the government more effectively than you do, their rights are no more or less than the rights you also have.

Has absolutely nothing to do with right to assemble, nothing, and I already told you Unions are in the same boat as corporations, it is all about uncontrolled money in politics regardless of who gives it or receives it

Bottom line, Citizen United opened up the flood gates, and we only know a portion of how much is spent, even a foreign nation can contribute dark money to a PAC without anyone ever knowing all as a result of Citizen United

 

[archives]

if one needs a permission slip from the government, then it's no longer a right, but a privilege. this is something that the founders were well aware of and that you apparently are not.

Wrong, even the freedoms listed in the Bill of Rights were regulated when the Constitution was ratified, gun were regularly controlled as to could posses one, where they could be worn, and when one can use one

 

[T. A. Gardner]

Worst decisions by the Supreme Court? Citizen's United doesn't even come close.

Dred Scott. Pretty much ensured that a civil war would ensue.

FDR court packing that allowed the New Deal to move into law. Opened the door to a massive federal government

Row v. Wade Abortion was never a federal function, and making new law out of whole cloth was never something the Supreme Court should be doing.

Citizen's United really changed little or nothing. That sort of political graft is going to happen regardless, or does anyone really think that it won't if it's made illegal or questionable? At best, all that would happen otherwise is those feeding piles of money to politicians would find a different way to do it that circumvents whatever law(s) you put in place.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

Worst decisions by the Supreme Court? Citizen's United doesn't even come close.

Dred Scott. Pretty much ensured that a civil war would ensue.

FDR court packing that allowed the New Deal to move into law. Opened the door to a massive federal government

Row v. Wade Abortion was never a federal function, and making new law out of whole cloth was never something the Supreme Court should be doing.

Citizen's United really changed little or nothing. That sort of political graft is going to happen regardless, or does anyone really think that it won't if it's made illegal or questionable? At best, all that would happen otherwise is those feeding piles of money to politicians would find a different way to do it that circumvents whatever law(s) you put in place.

it's just an expression.

what is your take on citizens united?

you love it because you love fascism?

 

[T. A. Gardner]

it's just an expression.

what is your take on citizens united?

you love it because you love fascism?

My take on it is that Citizens United does little or nothing and changes little or nothing about greasing politicians with cash. That's going to happen and happen at the same level of spending regardless.

I also find your frivolous tossing in an ad hominem about fascism both pathetic and usual.

 

[Truck Fump / h1b]

My take on it is that Citizens United does little or nothing and changes little or nothing about greasing politicians with cash. That's going to happen and happen at the same level of spending regardless.

I also find your frivolous tossing in an ad hominem about fascism both pathetic and usual.

that seems like a poor take.

should we repeal it then if has no impact?

you good with that?

 

[archives]

Worst decisions by the Supreme Court? Citizen's United doesn't even come close.

Dred Scott. Pretty much ensured that a civil war would ensue.

FDR court packing that allowed the New Deal to move into law. Opened the door to a massive federal government

Row v. Wade Abortion was never a federal function, and making new law out of whole cloth was never something the Supreme Court should be doing.

Citizen's United really changed little or nothing. That sort of political graft is going to happen regardless, or does anyone really think that it won't if it's made illegal or questionable? At best, all that would happen otherwise is those feeding piles of money to politicians would find a different way to do it that circumvents whatever law(s) you put in place.

FDR did not pack the Court, threatening to, but did not

Money in politics did always exists, but there were some controls, for example, foreign nations could never contribute, and amounts given by individuals were regulated, with Citizens United, it is a free for all, you really don’t think a person gives a candidate $240 million because he likes the candidate’s policies did you

And Citizens United currently ranks anywhere from ninth to twelfth on the list of SCOTUS worst decisions in US History, and keep in mind there have been thousands of decisions in two hundred years of history