EV's now more expensive in time and money to refuel than ICE vehicles

This is the latest major blunder Tesla has made with batteries, and other manufacturers are following suit:

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By potting the entire battery pack in rigid foam or other potting material, they've made the pack impossible to repair economically while ensuring that it is no longer economically recyclable. So, if just one battery in that pack goes bad out of the 7000 + in it, you end up needing a new pack at upwards of $20,000. STUPID!
 
Into the Night said:
If you don't drive your car 100,000 miles in seven years, you aren't driving your car much at all.
That's how they get out of the warranty period of 10 years.
Click to expand...

The average American drives 14 K miles a year. The EV owners seem to drive a little less. Now tell us again how you drive so much more and we should make cars suit your needs. The fact is EVs last way longer than the 100 K.
 
Nordberg said:
The average American drives 14 K miles a year. The EV owners seem to drive a little less. Now tell us again how you drive so much more and we should make cars suit your needs. The fact is EVs last way longer than the 100 K.
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Making up numbers and using them as data is a fallacy, dude. You also locked yourself in another paradox. You are being irrational again. You still haven't cleared your other paradoxes:

1) I don't maintain my car.
2) I take my car to the dealer for maintenance.

1) EV's take hours to charge.
2) I charge my EV in 5 minutes.

1) I drive my car 14k miles a year.
2) EVs last way longer than 100k miles.

1) My warranty is for 10 years or 100k miles.
2) EVs last way longer then 100k miles.

You're gonna have to decide, twit. You cannot argue both sides of a paradox. It's irrational.
 
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Into the Night said:
Neither microprocessors no Li-ion batteries are a key.

Lithium batteries are not used in EVs or computers. Li-ion batteries are.
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LI = Lithium Ion

They are prone to ignition just sitting there if corrosion sets in. Usually not a problem with computers and their coin batteries (used to run the RTC). It IS a problem with EVs, because they run out in the weather and the shit on the roads.
Click to expand...


{Highlights
•
The thermal runaway characteristics of high current rate overcharged 18,650 lithium-ion batteries were studied.

•
The thermal runaway processes of lithium-ion batteries were recorded by infrared and visible light cameras.

•
The combustion and explosion law of two times of thermal runaway was studied.

•
The higher the current rate, the more intense the thermal runaway reaction of lithium battery.}



[qoute]No, they were in use before microprocessors were really being applied to anything like that.[/quote]

They've been around since the 1960's. Use in consumer goods was extremely limited because:


{Overcharged lithium-ion batteries can experience thermal runaway that can cause spontaneous combustion or an explosion. By measuring the heat release rate, surface temperature, flame temperature, positive and negative electrode temperature and mass loss of 18650 NCM lithium-ion battery, the combustion and explosion characteristics of lithium-ion battery under different current rates were analyzed. The results show that the 18650 lithium-ion battery undergoes two thermal runaway behaviors when overcharge at a high current rate. The first thermal runaway leads to a continuous explosion reaction, while the second thermal runaway has a combustion and explosion reaction that is more violent than the first thermal runaway. As the current rate increases from 1 C to 3 C, the time for the first thermal runaway to occur decreases from 1554 to 360 s, the time for the second thermal runaway to occur decreases from 2515 to 522 s, and the explosive response becomes more violent.}

The use of microprocessors to regulate over charging (as well as rapid discharge) has made LI suitable for use in consumer goods.

While true, it is simply an easier way to do it than with the older circuitry. Kind of like FADEC engines today or even wall thermostats.

Overcharging is really not the problem with these batteries. Loss of retention and corrosion and battery fire is the problem with these batteries.
Cost is becoming more of an issue also, with the price of lithium going up as supplies dwindle. In 2021, lithium was around $7/kg. Today, it has risen to $60/kg after a high of $80/kg in 2022.
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It's the most serious problem with them.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0040603122001319
 
Nordberg said:
The average American drives 14 K miles a year. The EV owners seem to drive a little less. Now tell us again how you drive so much more and we should make cars suit your needs. The fact is EVs last way longer than the 100 K.
Click to expand...

There is a reason you're a leftist...

100,000 / 14,000 - 7.14

ROFL

Fucking lefties...
 
Into the Night said:
Making up numbers and using them as data is a fallacy, dude. You also locked yourself in another paradox. You are being irrational again. You still haven't cleared your other paradoxes:

1) I don't maintain my car.
2) I take my car to the dealer for maintenance.

1) EV's take hours to charge.
2) I charge my EV in 5 minutes.

1) I drive my car 14k miles a year.
2) EVs last way longer than 100k miles.

1) My warranty is for 10 years or 100k miles.
2) EVs last way longer then 100k miles.

You're gonna have to decide, twit. You cannot argue both sides of a paradox. It's irrational.
Click to expand...

I love how he posts that Americans only drive 14K a year, so the 100,000 mile warranty will last "way longer" than 7 years...

Never grasping that at 14K the car will hit 100,000 miles in... Wait for it... 7 YEARS...
 
Uncensored2008 said:
LI = Lithium Ion
Click to expand...
It isn't, but I'll try to remember that you use it for that.
Uncensored2008 said:
{Highlights
•
The thermal runaway characteristics of high current rate overcharged 18,650 lithium-ion batteries were studied.

•
The thermal runaway processes of lithium-ion batteries were recorded by infrared and visible light cameras.

•
The combustion and explosion law of two times of thermal runaway was studied.

•
The higher the current rate, the more intense the thermal runaway reaction of lithium battery.}



[qoute]No, they were in use before microprocessors were really being applied to anything like that.
Click to expand...

They've been around since the 1960's. Use in consumer goods was extremely limited because:


{Overcharged lithium-ion batteries can experience thermal runaway that can cause spontaneous combustion or an explosion. By measuring the heat release rate, surface temperature, flame temperature, positive and negative electrode temperature and mass loss of 18650 NCM lithium-ion battery, the combustion and explosion characteristics of lithium-ion battery under different current rates were analyzed. The results show that the 18650 lithium-ion battery undergoes two thermal runaway behaviors when overcharge at a high current rate. The first thermal runaway leads to a continuous explosion reaction, while the second thermal runaway has a combustion and explosion reaction that is more violent than the first thermal runaway. As the current rate increases from 1 C to 3 C, the time for the first thermal runaway to occur decreases from 1554 to 360 s, the time for the second thermal runaway to occur decreases from 2515 to 522 s, and the explosive response becomes more violent.}

The use of microprocessors to regulate over charging (as well as rapid discharge) has made LI suitable for use in consumer goods. [/QUOTE]
Microprocessors are not required to maintain proper charging techniques. Indeed, microprocessors aren't even used during charging of many batteries...a typical laptop or desktop PC for example.

Uncensored2008 said:
It's the most serious problem with them.
Click to expand...
Thermal runaway can be a problem, but it's not the biggest problem. The most common failure mode for EV batteries is corrosion.
Corrosion CAN induce thermal runaway.
 
Uncensored2008 said:
That's not the key.

LI is prone to ignition if overcharged. What changed and made the batteries commonplace is the use of microprocessors in battery packs to regulate charge and discharge rates. Open any laptop and you'll find a control device.

A car uses a more sophisticated system than a laptop does, absolutely controlling the charge rate and ensuring the battery pack/bank is not overcharged.
Click to expand...

So don't overcharge them. A simple voltage regulator can prevent that!
So don't send too much current into them while charging. A simple current regulator can prevent that!

No microprocessor needed.
 
Nordberg said:
They last much longer than 100K. Is that tough for rights like you to understand? Stupid damn pig-headed rights. All the info that has given to you and you cannot learn. How sad.
Click to expand...

They may not last even a few days. It depends if they are damaged in a collision or by a defective charging station.
 
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