Hezbollah Democrats

Both are targeting civilians with the intent of bringing about political change through terror. Both sides are using the same tactics.

No, they simply are not. I've asked you for the examples, and you've been unable to give them. When was the last Israeli car bomb... suicide bomber... beheading... When did Israeli's fly planes into buildings, send Anthrax throught the mail, or set an IED? When did Israel kidnap people and hold them hostage, making political demands? When did Israel even hijack a plane? You want to make Israel seem as bad as the terrorists, but about all you can do is intellectualize definitions to fit your absurdity.
 
I think, from Dixie's overly-simplistic perspective, terrorism only involves suicide and Islam.

By Dixie's perspective, the IRA weren't a terrorist organisation.

They didn't use suicide bombing...

 
No, they simply are not. I've asked you for the examples, and you've been unable to give them. When was the last Israeli car bomb... suicide bomber... beheading... When did Israeli's fly planes into buildings, send Anthrax throught the mail, or set an IED? When did Israel kidnap people and hold them hostage, making political demands? When did Israel even hijack a plane? You want to make Israel seem as bad as the terrorists, but about all you can do is intellectualize definitions to fit your absurdity.

Dixie, you slow individual.

Car bombing, suicides, plane hijackings and IED are not the only forms of terrorism.

Terrorism is the targeting of civilians with the intent of bringing about political change through terror.

Bombing a civilian funeral from the air is as much terrorism as using a car bomb. It doesn't matter if you wear a uniform or use western military gear.

Using missiles to attack civilians is as much terrorism as suicide bombers.

And btw, Israelis used many of the tactics you described when it was campaigning for the formation of Israel.

Google the King David Hotel bombings....

I'm still waiting for you to try to define what you think terrorism is....
 
Terrorists use fear to gain political objectives....

The Bush administration uses fear to gain political objectives....

"If you elect John Kerry I am afraid we will see another 9-11 style attack on U.S. Soil" - Dick Cheney.
 
Terrorists use fear to gain political objectives....

Terrorists target civilians with the use or threat of force to gain political objectives.
 
AnyOldIron said:
Terrorists use fear to gain political objectives....

Terrorists target civilians with the use or threat of force to gain political objectives.
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Its the fear caused by the attacks that the terrorists use...

The Bush Administration is just once removed from it, but they are capitolizing on the same fear for political advantage!
 
Dixie said:
Both are targeting civilians with the intent of bringing about political change through terror. Both sides are using the same tactics.

No, they simply are not. I've asked you for the examples, and you've been unable to give them. When was the last Israeli car bomb... suicide bomber... beheading... When did Israeli's fly planes into buildings, send Anthrax throught the mail, or set an IED? When did Israel kidnap people and hold them hostage, making political demands? When did Israel even hijack a plane? You want to make Israel seem as bad as the terrorists, but about all you can do is intellectualize definitions to fit your absurdity.
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bombing a Christian civilian neighborhood in east Beirut is an example. Bombing a civilian funeral is an example. destroying entire civilian neighborhoods in south Beirut because Hezbollah has offices in the neighborhood is an example. That is using violence against members of the general population to generate fear and cause disruption. If America had turned all of Afghanistan into a sheet of radioactive glass because Osama was hiding on top of one hill in one area of the country, and, in so doing, se slaughtered hundreds of thousands of innocent civilian lives, that would be terrorism. I have no problem with Israel striking Hezbollah, but their targeting is too indiscriminant.
 
AnyOldIron said:
No, they simply are not. I've asked you for the examples, and you've been unable to give them. When was the last Israeli car bomb... suicide bomber... beheading... When did Israeli's fly planes into buildings, send Anthrax throught the mail, or set an IED? When did Israel kidnap people and hold them hostage, making political demands? When did Israel even hijack a plane? You want to make Israel seem as bad as the terrorists, but about all you can do is intellectualize definitions to fit your absurdity.

Dixie, you slow individual.

Car bombing, suicides, plane hijackings and IED are not the only forms of terrorism.

Terrorism is the targeting of civilians with the intent of bringing about political change through terror.

Bombing a civilian funeral from the air is as much terrorism as using a car bomb. It doesn't matter if you wear a uniform or use western military gear.

Using missiles to attack civilians is as much terrorism as suicide bombers.

And btw, Israelis used many of the tactics you described when it was campaigning for the formation of Israel.

Google the King David Hotel bombings....

I'm still waiting for you to try to define what you think terrorism is....
Click to expand...
I think it also needs to be noted that terrorism is not the only illicit use of force or threat of force.

Some believe that "terrorism" should be reserved for acts that specifically target civilians and are explicitly intended to cause fear in a civilian population. By that definition, guerilla attacks against military personnel are not terrorist acts as such. By that definition, simple disdain for civilian deaths does not make one a terrorist. I suppose that constraining the definition so straightly is valid. It does mean, though, that many illicit uses of force that are not "terrorism" per se are equally heinous.
 
By that definition, simple disdain for civilian deaths does not make one a terrorist.

It is the targeting of civilians and civilian infrastructure that count.

For example a very clearly marked ambulance...
 
Of course the argument could be made that all attacks were 'accidents', but then would we believe Hizbollah if it repeatedly claimed to have 'accidents' that are really targeting military?

Could Hizbollah get away with stating that they are targeting IDF members based in Haifa with its rocket attacks there? That it was merely an accident that civilians died or for them to blame the IDF for being amongst civilians?

Would we bollocks....
 
AnyOldIron said:
By that definition, simple disdain for civilian deaths does not make one a terrorist.

It is the targeting of civilians and civilian infrastructure that count.

For example a very clearly marked ambulance...
Click to expand...
For me, it doesn't count for much. If we want to discriminate between terrorist attacks, on the one hand, and other immoral misues of military might, on the other, fine. I don't see much point in it but I'll get with the program.

As you point out yourself, almost no one ever admits to targetting civilians. It's not enough to take their word for it; we have to apply a certain amount of analytical filtering.

I think it's impossible to conclude that all Israeli soldiers are avoiding civilian targets. Most are, perhaps, but some are not.
 
Bravo, Bravo! Excellent apologist defense of terrorism here! You two are amazing in your support and defending of radical Islamic terror, it is so concisely clear to all who read your words, that there isn't anything I could possibly say to illustrate it better. It also demonstrates why Liberals and Democrats in general, don't have the slightest clue of what we are up against, or how to defeat it. You don't even know the difference between legitimate military actions and acts of terror on innocent civilians.

Let's be clear, "TERRORISM" is a word, it has a specific meaning and usage in the English language. In the context of our discussion, the word is used to describe terrorist tactics such as beheadings, suicide bombings, car bombs, kidnapping, hijacking, flying planes into buildings, improvising explosive devices, sending Anthrax through the mail, etc. This sort of barbaric 5th century, uncivilized practice of radical Islamics, to effect a political change, is called "TERRORISM." Now, maybe you have a better word to describe it, maybe "TERRORISM" is too broad and vague to use, because it could be construed (in your pinhead) to include legitimate governments using legitimate military actions as well? I don't know! If you feel better creating a new word to describe what I articulated above, I will be pleased to use that word instead, but as it stands, the only word I can attribute to the acts noted above, is "TERRORISM."

Israel is NOT guilty of this kind of TERRORISM!
The UK is NOT guilty of this kind of TERRORISM!
The US is NOT guilty of this kind of TERRORISM!

Islamic Fascists ARE guilty of this kind of TERRORISM!
 
Dixie said:
Israel is NOT guilty of this kind of TERRORISM!
The UK is NOT guilty of this kind of TERRORISM!
The US is NOT guilty of this kind of TERRORISM!

Islamic Fascists ARE guilty of this kind of TERRORISM!
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Fine. Have it your own way. But Israel IS guilty of other crimes just as bad. We will not call them "terrorism." You can calm down, take a deep breath and wipe off your face now. I'd suggest a bib next time, though.

Israel and the United States are guilty of killing too damned many innocent civilians in their attempts to kill terrorists. Lets call it "murder" instead of "terrorism" just to keep Dixie from throwing another tantrum.
 
terrorism

n : the calculated use of violence (or threat of violence) against civilians in order to attain goals that are political or religious or ideological in nature; this is done through intimindation or coercion or instilling fear [syn: act of terrorism, terrorist act]
Main Entry: ter·ror·ism
Pronunciation: 'ter-&r-"i-z&m
Function: noun
1 : the unlawful use or threat of violence esp. against the state or the public as a politically motivated means of attack or coercion
2 : violent and intimidating gang activity <street terrorism> —ter·ror·ist /-ist/ adj or noun —ter·ror·is·tic /"ter-&r-'is-tik/ adjective

The common themes are acts of violence against civilians to bring about political changes.
 
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Fine. Have it your own way.

It's not a matter of having it my own way, it's how it is.


But Israel IS guilty of other crimes just as bad.

I disagree. The horror and trauma caused by the terrorist tactics I described above, are evil beyond comparison to anything the civilized world has ever done. Sure, Israel is not without sin, neither is the US or any other country for that matter, but we are not in a fundamental holy war over those things now, the focus is on radical Islamic Fascism. Hezbollah is a part of that, along with alQaeda, Islamic Jihad, Al Axa, Hamas, Abu Nidal, and with the state sponsorship of Iran and Syria, who are supported by a host of other countries.

It's time for you "thinking" people of the world to understand, we can't afford to listen to your rhetoric and pontification anymore. We are on the brink of WWIII against a dangerous and evil enemy, and there is no choice except to face it. We can no longer bury our heads in the sand and pretend it will all be okay, we just need to better understand, throw a little more money at it, reach out... whatever! It doesn't work here! These people have vowed to kill us all, and they will not rest until they've accomplished that. You better start standing up for the people who are fighting them, instead of trying to stand in their way! When they are making your mother a video of your beheading, is not the time for you to become concerned about this, the time to understand it and deal with it is now.
 
the Lebanese civilians who die in their apartment buildings bombed by ordinance dropped from Israeli aircraft died in just as much horror and trauma as those Israelis who were sitting in a pizza parlor when a suicide bomber blew himself up in their midst. The lebanese civilian who is killed by tons of concrete crushing him is no less dead and died no less a horrific death than the western journalist beheaded by Zarqawi.

To claim that one creates horror and trauma and the other does not is simply ridiculous.
 
Dixie said:
Fine. Have it your own way.

It's not a matter of having it my own way, it's how it is.


But Israel IS guilty of other crimes just as bad.

I disagree. The horror and trauma caused by the terrorist tactics I described above, are evil beyond comparison to anything the civilized world has ever done. Sure, Israel is not without sin, neither is the US or any other country for that matter, but we are not in a fundamental holy war over those things now, the focus is on radical Islamic Fascism. Hezbollah is a part of that, along with alQaeda, Islamic Jihad, Al Axa, Hamas, Abu Nidal, and with the state sponsorship of Iran and Syria, who are supported by a host of other countries.

It's time for you "thinking" people of the world to understand, we can't afford to listen to your rhetoric and pontification anymore. We are on the brink of WWIII against a dangerous and evil enemy, and there is no choice except to face it. We can no longer bury our heads in the sand and pretend it will all be okay, we just need to better understand, throw a little more money at it, reach out... whatever! It doesn't work here! These people have vowed to kill us all, and they will not rest until they've accomplished that. You better start standing up for the people who are fighting them, instead of trying to stand in their way! When they are making your mother a video of your beheading, is not the time for you to become concerned about this, the time to understand it and deal with it is now.
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According to you, killing 50 innocent civilians is worse than killing 500 innocenct civilians if the guys who killed the 50 are what you call terrorists.

That's so stupid I'm not even going to laugh at it. I'm just going to shake my head.
:dunno:
 
Dang if I want to hear sensless ranting I will call my ex wife.
Ignore for dixie too, that worked out so nicely for Toby yesterday :)
 
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