That is the goal of some who support the voucher system. Online school or Virtual School is much closer to no school than public school.
Holders war on private school vouchers...
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That is the goal of some who support the voucher system. Online school or Virtual School is much closer to no school than public school.
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The Almighty
Now you are just making up crap. The voucher system is designed to increase competition. You have not shown one example of any politician that wants to eliminate 'free' education.
cawacko
Well-known member
No. You just ignored everything I said. You (and others like you) don't want to make changes to our education systems even though it is failing our most needy students. Like I said you don't really give a shit about failing inner city schools other than saying they need more money. That's the status quo you are attempting to conserve.
On line k-12 schools and curriculum are both out there...and being subsidized by educational dollars out of state governments. We are continuiong to fight this in our state as our school baroness dictator (State Superintendent) is a rabid supporter of virtual and on-line schools. She is such a wise dentist.
cawacko
Well-known member
He's talking out of his ass. Sure there are some Libertarians who say they want that but they aren't in office or in power. Look at the amount of power and money NCLB, passed by a Republican President and Republican Congress (and partially written by Democrats), gave the federal government over education. That was the opposite of trying to eliminate free public education.
I agree that failing schools need to be changed and students who live in failing school districts need to be given a choice. Charter schools would be what I support for that choice, not virtual or on-line schools.
cawacko
Well-known member
Yes it is. If leading Republicans want to eliminate free education in America and go back to education as it was in 19th century as Jarod claims they have a funny way of showing it by passing NCLB.
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The Almighty
thank you captain obvious.
He was addressing Jarods absurd claim that conservatives are trying to eliminate universal education.
christiefan915
Catalyst
You probably heard the latest about our biggest, richest one. Corruption to the max.
"For more than a year, federal investigators pursued suspicions about Nicholas Trombetta, a high-flying educator with small-town origins who created the biggest, richest cyber school in the state. From his Beaver County headquarters in Midland, Mr. Trombetta painstakingly built an elaborate money-making machine called Pennsylvania Cyber Charter School. Fueled by taxpayers, the school became wildly successful over the years -- more than 10,000 students and $100 million in revenue in 2012 -- and a savior for depressed Midland.
But Mr. Trombetta didn't stop there. He is accused of creating entity after entity, ultimately controlling what prosecutors said was an intricate web of interlocking businesses whose purpose was to enrich himself, his sister and various associates.
After months of conducting records searches and interviews, and wielding the power of the grand jury, investigators Friday revealed that they had finally peeled away enough layers of the proverbial onion to file 11 fraud and tax charges against Mr. Trombetta.
Prosecutors claim the educator and entrepreneur stole nearly $1 million.
"We allege this was a conscious, intentional scheme to steal money that was to be used to educate our children," U.S. attorney David Hickton said during a news conference Friday at the FBI field office on Pittsburgh's South Side."
christiefan915
Catalyst
You know it.
[h=1]Feds: PA Cyber Charter School founder Trombetta schemed to steal $1 million[/h]
Charges against Nicholas Trombetta include fraud, tax conspiracy and filing false returns; accountant Neal Prence also indicted
christiefan915
Catalyst
Once you actually see the corruption of one, it makes you cynical about all of them. And yes, I do know you can't paint them all evil but it does bring down the level of trust.
christiefan915
Catalyst
NCLB fails.
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The Almighty
I agree. But we can also show corruption in the public school systems. That said, I am not supportive of online schools for k-12.
cawacko
Well-known member
I agree but that's not what we were discussing.
Crashk
Unite or Die
6. Vouchers do not improve opportunities for children from low-income families:
Vouchers do little to help the poor. The payments often do not cover the entire cost of tuition or other mandatory fees for private schools. Thus, only families with the money to cover the cost of the rest of the tuition, uniforms, transportation, books and other supplies can use the vouchers. In Cleveland, the majority of families who were granted a voucher but did not use it cited the additional costs as the reason they could not use the voucher. Vouchers actually hurt low-income families by undermining the public schools they rely on.
10 Reasons Why Private School Vouchers Should Be Rejected
1. Vouchers undermine religious liberty:
The vast majority of private schools are run by religious groups. According to the U.S. Department of Education, 76 percent of private schools have a religious affiliation....vouchers force Americans to pay taxes to support religion. This runs counter to the First Amendment’s guarantee of religious liberty. In America, all religious activities should be supported with voluntary contributions.
2. Vouchers divert public money to unaccountable private schools:
School vouchers are little more than a backdoor way for the government to subsidize religious and other private schools...
3. Vouchers violate many state constitutional provisions:
4. The people do not support vouchers:
Americans have repeatedly expressed opposition to vouchers in public opinion polls. More tellingly, when people are given an opportunity to vote directly on vouchers through ballot referenda, they always reject the concept – usually by wide margins
5. Vouchers do not improve student academic performance:
According to multiple studies of the District of Columbia, Milwaukee and Cleveland school voucher programs, the targeted population does not perform better in reading and math than students in public schools.
6. Vouchers do not improve opportunities for children from low-income families:
Above
7. Vouchers do not save taxpayer money:
Vouchers do not decrease education costs. Instead, tax money that would ordinarily go to public schools now pays for vouchers, thus harming public schools.
8. Vouchers do not increase education choice:
Voucher programs do not increase “choice” for parents because it’s the private schools that will ultimately decide whether to admit a student. These institutions are not required to give parents the information necessary to determine whether the school is meeting their children’s needs.
9. Vouchers lead to private schools of questionable quality:
In Milwaukee and Cleveland, the availability of vouchers led con artists to create fly-by-night schools in order to bilk the public purse.
10. Vouchers distract from the real issue of reform:
Voucher plans usually allow a small percentage of children to leave public schools for enrollment in private schools. This does nothing for the large percentage of youngsters left behind. Most public schools do a very good job; those that don’t should be fixed, not abandoned. Vouchers become an excuse for politicians to dodge issues like adequate funding, class size, teacher training and curriculum reform.
Ninety percent of American children attend public schools. Our focus should be on fully funding and improving this system, not siphoning money into private systems.
https://www.au.org/church-state/feb...reasons-why-private-school-vouchers-should-be
Trying to make education for the rich only will fail. If I were a conservative who works for a living I would reject vouchers. But then again, rich only education is part of conservative ideology, and we all know how those filthy unionized teachers in public schools vote and as conservatives we can't have educators voting against conservative ideology.
Face it cons, its all about trying to destroy labor unions and making a buck off of 1st graders.
cawacko
Well-known member
And what is your suggestion for improving failing inner city public schools?
And I'm glad you made your position clear that the teachers union is more important than children's education.
cawacko
Well-known member
Actually Crash your link says we need to "fully fund" our schools. Essentially what that's saying is there will never be enough money. If schools are performing poorly it must be because they aren't "fully funded". In the meantime maintain the status quo while nothing changes.
They show it by supporting voucher programs in an effort to starve public education from funding necessary to be successful.
cawacko
Well-known member
Spending billions on NCLB and small amounts on vouchers isn't how I would go about destroying public education if that was my goal.