How Alex P. Keaton Predicted The New Conservative Movement

Nomad said:
So what do you suggest Dems do?

Accept Republican policy?

How is that a win?
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I’d advise engaging in other more important issues and roll your eyes at Republicans when they bring up the culture wars and quite Reagan by saying...”Well there you go again.”.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
I’d advise engaging in other more important issues and roll your eyes at Republicans when they bring up the culture wars and quite Reagan by saying...”Well there you go again.”.
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Well, as advice goes, that is just too broad and generalized to follow or even completely understand.

Where should we do this?

On forums? Twitter? Facebook?

And what happens when their lies begin to take root because we Dems are busy trying to be high-minded and above it all?

No offense, but fuck that.

I'm sick and tired of these overly polite "Femocrats" who sit and play nice while the other side uses gutter tactics.

I'd rather pick up the shit they fling at us and smack them right back in their faces with it.

As if any of it matters in terms of changing anything anyway.
 
countryboy said:
Lol. No true conservative would vote for the most conservative governing president since Ronald Reagan? Yeah okay. And who else is currently representative of conservative values, AND running for president? You're such a retard.
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"Conservative values" ,translation,tax cuts for Billionaires,and kids in cages
 
Havana Moon said:
It's precisely the same arrogance on display with Corbynites, they were totally convinced that they'd win in a landslide. Berniebots are no different and they are in for a hell of a shock come November unless the economy tanks in the meantime.
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You mean in March. Bernie won’t win the nomination.
 
Nomad said:
Well, as advice goes, that is just too broad and generalized to follow or even completely understand.

Where should we do this?

On forums? Twitter? Facebook?

And what happens when their lies begin to take root because we Dems are busy trying to be high-minded and above it all?

No offense, but fuck that.

I'm sick and tired of these overly polite "Femocrats" who sit and play nice while the other side uses gutter tactics.

I'd rather pick up the shit they fling at us and smack them right back in their faces with it.

As if any of it matters in terms of changing anything anyway.
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Those are good points and in general I agree but in that spirit take on culture war issues from a position of strength, that is, we already won that war, is what I’m saying.
 
countryboy said:
Funny, but you are the one deflecting. Do you deny Obama put children in cages? You can if you want to, but it's well documented, so that only makes you look stupid, or ignorant. Which is it, stupid, or ignorant? There's no third option.
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Is this a history forum now?
Trump is President TODAY,obviously the huge increase is on him!
 
anonymoose said:
I see no relation at all to the Alex Keaton of the '80's and conservatives of the present. I do agree that he would not have voted for Trump in '16 and would in '20.
That's true of lots of voters including me.
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What's true is a lot of voters, including you are idiots. [Adolf Twitler]

And yes, you may quote me on that- if you like!
 
countryboy said:
Funny, but you are the one deflecting. Do you deny Obama put children in cages? You can if you want to, but it's well documented, so that only makes you look stupid, or ignorant. Which is it, stupid, or ignorant? There's no third option.
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Sure there is, the 3rd option is someone like you- STUPID, IGNORANT, AND AN ASSHOLE!
 
The stupidest thread of the day!

There is no Conservative Movement today- nothing Conservative coming from the Republican party.

The Republicans have been hijacked and bastardized by Donald Trump to become the new Planet Of The White Apes- the party of White Nationalism- The Party of Hate- the Party of the highest Deficit in US History- The Party of division- the party of Conspiracy Theories and Fake News- the party of lawlessness- the party of deception, lies, propaganda, and misinformation- the anti-democracy party- the party of corruption- the party of abandoning our allies and hopping into bed with the enemy- the party of "Ive got mine, FUCK YOU!"- the party of self-importance- the party of grabbing women by the pussy- the party of cheaters and winning at any cost- the party of confederate statues and flags- THE PARTY OF IDIOTS LED BY DONALD TRUMP.

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Adolf_Twitler said:
The stupidest thread of the day!

There is no Conservative Movement today- nothing Conservative coming from the Republican party.

The Republicans have been hijacked and bastardized by Donald Trump to become the new Planet Of The White Apes- the party of White Nationalism- The Party of Hate- the Party of the highest Deficit in US History- The Party of division- the party of Conspiracy Theories and Fake News- the party of lawlessness- the party of deception, lies, propaganda, and misinformation- the anti-democracy party- the party of corruption- the party of abandoning our allies and hopping into bed with the enemy- the party of "Ive got mine, FUCK YOU!"- the party of self-importance- the party of grabbing women by the pussy- the party of cheaters and winning at any cost- the party of confederate statues and flags- THE PARTY OF IDIOTS LED BY DONALD TRUMP.

003bcd14afbfc068b8fce77b1dcdb856e7b9b372.jpeg
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Anything talking about Family Ties or Alex P. Keaton is awesome. Go F yourself Adolph
 
Nomad said:
Republicans are constantly chipping away at Roe v Wade and everyone knows it.
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On the flipside, the Democrats often push extreme abortion laws, like the recent NY one.

Nomad said:
The right to not die because you're not financially well off is considered a civil liberty by civilized people.
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Healthcare is a service or amenity. Only on rare occasion can a service be a right. One of the few cases of this is the right to an attorney. I understand the argument that socialized medicine would benefit many people, but it's not a right. If you're going to make an argument in favor of it, economic rationales are far more logical. Treating it as a right opens the door to all kinds of faulty logic.

Nomad said:
Limiting the kind of deadly weapons that can be manufactured, sold and possessed is a 100% common sense issue to people who have common sense.
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Start with the government then. Limiting "deadly weapons" to the state is a recipe for authoritarianism.

Nomad said:
Many Republicans do push for creationism and those who don't sit quietly and allow it to be pushed.

Republicans, including Trump have suggested or attempted to ban Muslim immigration and shut down Mosques.
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The freedom of religion applies to citizens. There is nothing barring immigration policy from banning a specific religion or nationality, as shown by previous policies that were in place that did this sort of thing. You'll have to cite this "shutting down" claim, however.

Nomad said:
Republicans are anti-gay and favor laws that allow discrimination.
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Well, that's news to the Log Cabin Republicans.

Nomad said:
There have been numerous instances of Republicans attempting and succeeding in purging voter lists, limiting early voting, adding new requirements shortly before elections....

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...ceef88-f762-11e9-a285-882a8e386a96_story.html
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...an editorial from WAPO, so that's no surprise they would see it that way


Nomad said:
The states have fully legalized Marijuana are almost exclusively blue Democrat states.
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That is true, and it's a good demonstration of how states can decide on their own if they want to legalize it. Not all Democrats want to legalize it, and not all Republicans want to ban it. It's become less of a partisan issue than it was in the past, particularly when looking at libertarian leaning conservatives.

Something that has gained more traction in a bipartisan manner is the decriminalization of marijuana. That would be a safer approach overall, in order to make sure that the legislative changes don't inadvertently benefit cartels.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Not really. We roll our eyes at the supporters of populist for not knowing their history and the pretentious manner in which they portray ignorance as a virtue. Just like Huey Long Trumps supporters will eventually be let down by his inability to keep the promises he’s made. Just like what happened with Long and Bryan,
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Ignorance isn't a virtue, but neither is elitism.

There was a time when Democrats actually listened to the white working class rather than putting them down. Establishment Republicans also used to do this. Because elements of both parties continue to insult "rednecks", they understandably choose to support populists.

You seem to resent the white working class yourself.
 
cawacko said:
The premise can be debated but as a Gen Xer I loved Family Ties as a kid and was definitely a huge fan of Alex P. Keaton. Great memories reading this column.




How Alex P. Keaton Predicted The New Conservative Movement

Alex P. Keaton, the countercultural conservative from the 1980s sitcom 'Family Ties,' tells us a lot about the new conservative movement.


For people of a certain advanced age, the first openly Republican or conservative fictional character they can remember is Alex P. Keaton from the NBC sitcom “Family Ties.” The role launched Michael J. Fox’s career, but it did something else, too: in many ways, Alex Keaton predicted the conservative movement that we see emerging today. Energetic and aggressive, Keaton was an unapologetic conservative character at a time conservatism was in many ways an apologetic underdog.

It is important to note that Alex P. Keaton was born in 1965, the very first year of Generation X. The comic tension he provided was his rejection of the 1960s hippie ethos of his progressive parents. He is arguably the first manifestation of something that is now a staple of our society, the countercultural conservative. Conservatism as counter culture has reached an apex in the age of Trump. But its seeds can be seen in this old NBC sitcom. Keaton might as well have said, “Okay, Boomer.”

When the show launched in 1982, and indeed for the following three decades, most conservatives in the media were very unlike Alex P. Keaton. The Platonic ideal of the late 20th century conservative pundit was a George Will, or a William F. Buckley. Both operated with a kind of outsider status, Buckley in particular, although still a conservative hero always seemed to be operating from a defensive crouch. He stood athwart history, he looked for the conservative who was most electable. The mantra coming out of the 1960s seemed to be, “We will eventually lose, but we can lose more slowly.”

This was not the way of Alex P. Keaton, the first Gen X conservative. He was joyous and confident in his conservatism, a kind of Reaganite happy warrior. And it is interesting to note that this character was an iconoclast for supporting Reagan, even though in the show’s third season Reagan won an absolute landslide of an election against Walter Mondale. Surely there were millions of Alex P. Keatons heading off to college or the workforce, yet in the eyes of Hollywood this type was still a freak.

As it turns out, there were a lot of Alex P. Keatons, and just as the character would be, they are now in their 40s and 50s and for the first time taking institutional power within conservatism. The new energy that the Gen X conservative is bringing has everything to do with being countercultural. In fact, it might fairly be said that Gen X had no culture, only countercultures. The conservative of the past was of the past, always seeming to want to wind the clock back — to the 1950s, back to some American ideal unsullied by the riotous 1960s.

But the conservative contemporaries of the hippie Boomers were in some ways ill-equipped to fight those who had bested them in defining a generation, so it would fall to the children of the flower children to challenge the shibboleths of Woodstock. Every Gen X kid who grew up rolling his eyes at stories of communes and anti-war protests, who has a nostalgic disdain for Crosby, Stills, and Nash, carries in him the essence of the new conservative.

Although we like to center Donald Trump in everything these days, what we see looking back to Alex P. Keaton and the almost-adulthood of Gen X is that Trump is a manifestation of the new conservatism, not its creator. The pugnacious nature of the former latchkey kids, the last generation to play outside without a cell phone, lies at the heart of Trumpism. The question for conservatives used to be “How do we stop losing?” now it’s “How do we keep winning?”

It is interesting to wonder if Alex P. Keaton would have voted for Trump. I tend to think he might not have in 2016, but I tend to think he would in 2020. He would have come to see, as many who were incredulous about Trump, that the blusterer in chief from Queens showed a way out of constant apology, towards a positive right, interested in building, not simply conserving.

Gen X will not hold power for long. It is a tiny generation, and those born after 1980 are already installing themselves as the new arbiters. But what the kids, and by kids I mean most of my editors, will inherit from Gen X is all about Alex P. Keaton. A winning smile, a joke, an anxiousness for the fray. The old conservative movement has given way, and in its place stands a generation willing to fight, and unwilling to accept their parents; 1960s as the be all and end all of what America is.


https://thefederalist.com/2020/01/28/how-alex-p-keaton-predicted-the-new-conservative-movement/
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The problem there is that Trump isn't a conservative, unless now conservative principles include ignoring deficits/debt, heightened Executive power, Judicial activism, stronger Federal Gov't, expanded use of Executive Action, and the antithesis of any understanding of Family Values

To say that the character was "counter culture" is incorrect, his role on the show was his exuberant support of traditional culture, and dismissing Reaganism as the product of a "defensive crouch" is inane

Seems as if David Marcus is plagiarizing off of the Millennial Movement that will be hitting its stride in a decade or so
 
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