I used to think Russia gate was nothing.

Rump Tower is a big building, I am sure it has been under surveillance at some point or another, its not the same as Obama recently wiretapping Rump and doing something sick or watergateish.

Except that it has a whiff of Watergate lol. The objective in Watergate was political and Nixon got caught.

If the IC leaks were intended to damage Trump [and they clearly were] I fail to see much distinction. Except we can't know whether Obama was aware of it or not. Brennen was aware of it before congress, so I'd say it's better than a 50/50 chance Obama knew as well. And if Obama ordered it, Thingy owes Trump an apology. Also, breaking into a motel room is mere burglary. Unmasking and then releasing Flynn's name is a tad more serious.

What's the saying? Where's there's smoke there's fire?
 
So, you think Trump was telling the truth also?

Does Trump have his supporters hypnotized? Is there something he does at rallies?

No one asked Comey so I'll ask you lol.

Can you categorically deny that Trump Tower wasn't and/or hasn't been under electronic surveillance?

Yes or no will be fine.
 
I'll explain it to you guys: it's very clear at this point that Trump doesn't know anything beyond what Comey knows, or what Judge Napolitano knows, or what the NY Times knows, or whoever. He was shooting from the hip when he tweeted, and even he has essentially admitted that.

If it turns out that there was surveillance on the tower, that wasn't information that he had when he tweeted. I know you guys will be all over this board w/ threads about it - but Trump STILL LIED.

And beyond that, there truly is nothing at all - per Comey - to indicate that Obama was involved in anything, and Comey even stated that a President cannot order a wiretap. Let's not forget that "surveillance" isn't the measure here. Obama's involvement IS. Remember - he's the "bad (sick) guy".
 
I'll explain it to you guys: it's very clear at this point that Trump doesn't know anything beyond what Comey knows, or what Judge Napolitano knows, or what the NY Times knows, or whoever. He was shooting from the hip when he tweeted, and even he has essentially admitted that.

If it turns out that there was surveillance on the tower, that wasn't information that he had when he tweeted. I know you guys will be all over this board w/ threads about it - but Trump STILL LIED.

And beyond that, there truly is nothing at all - per Comey - to indicate that Obama was involved in anything, and Comey even stated that a President cannot order a wiretap. Let's not forget that "surveillance" isn't the measure here. Obama's involvement IS. Remember - he's the "bad (sick) guy".

I'm not sure he's not. Color my cynical, but I wouldn't be even mildy surprised if Obama wasn't aware of what was going on. Anyone who is capable of using the IRS against political opponents has already crossed that line.

Which bring us to the second point: if and when it can be factually demonstrated that Trump lied, I'll call him on it. But what's telling here is that it's quite apparent that the prospect of Trump lying is a bigger deal to you and a lot of other people than *the demonstrable criminality* within the IC.

If Trump lied he should own up to it. But anyone who thinks that's a bigger issue than the IC putting their fingers on the political scale has drank the punch.
 
I'm not sure he's not. Color my cynical, but I wouldn't be even mildy surprised if Obama wasn't aware of what was going on. Anyone who is capable of using the IRS against political opponents has already crossed that line.

Which bring us to the second point: if and when it can be factually demonstrated that Trump lied, I'll call him on it. But what's telling here is that it's quite apparent that the prospect of Trump lying is a bigger deal to you and a lot of other people than *the demonstrable criminality* within the IC.

If Trump lied he should own up to it. But anyone who thinks that's a bigger issue than the IC putting their fingers on the political scale has drank the punch.

Trump's lie isn't an isolated incident. It's part of a repetitive pattern. We're 2 months into his Presidency, and his credibility - nationally and globally - is almost down to zero.

So, we disagree. I think the credibility of the leader of the free world is a pretty huge thing. If our citizens and allies can't trust what he says, where does that leave us? What happens when a real crisis hits?

Yeah, we definitely do not agree on that. Pathological lying is a disturbing trait for a leader, and not being able to trust that leader undermines everything else. That has the potential to be much more damaging.
 
So, you think Trump was telling the truth also?

Does Trump have his supporters hypnotized? Is there something he does at rallies?

Members of the Donald Trump transition team, possibly including Trump himself, were under U.S. government surveillance following November’s presidential election, House Intelligence Chairman Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) told reporters Wednesday.

Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community.


“I have seen intelligence reports that clearly show that the president-elect and his team were, I guess, at least monitored,” Nunes told reporters. “It looks to me like it was all legally collected, but it was essentially a lot of information on the president-elect and his transition team and what they were doing.”
Nunes said he is heading to the White House later Wednesday to brief Trump on what he has learned, which he said came from “sources who thought that we should know it.” He said he was trying to get more information by Friday from the FBI, CIA and NSA.


Does Obama owe Trump an apology ?
 
Members of the Donald Trump transition team, possibly including Trump himself, were under U.S. government surveillance following November’s presidential election, House Intelligence Chairman Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) told reporters Wednesday.

Nunes said the surveillance appeared to be legal but that he was concerned because it was not related to the FBI’s investigation into Russia’s meddling in the election and was widely disseminated across the intelligence community.


“I have seen intelligence reports that clearly show that the president-elect and his team were, I guess, at least monitored,” Nunes told reporters. “It looks to me like it was all legally collected, but it was essentially a lot of information on the president-elect and his transition team and what they were doing.”
Nunes said he is heading to the White House later Wednesday to brief Trump on what he has learned, which he said came from “sources who thought that we should know it.” He said he was trying to get more information by Friday from the FBI, CIA and NSA.


Does Obama owe Trump an apology ?

I'll bite - why would Obama owe Trump an apology?
 
I can't read his mind.

So, you would really think that he knows something that Comey & pretty much no one else does; that upon repeated calls to release whatever evidence he has, the guy who doesn't hesitate for a second to blab everything on twitter would decide to show some discretion & keep it close to the vest; that he wouldn't reveal anything he knows & would allow his press secretary to do an embarrassing tapdance over & over again trying to cover for him; and that he'd actually come out and say that he didn't really put an "opinion" out there and was just going by what he heard from Judge Napolitano, and that it was really Fox that should be questioned about it.

Interesting.
 
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