My FB post on the war

anonymoose said:
It's too late , but do you think Ukraine and the U.S.'s policy would have been a little different had they realized Putin was a serious threat?
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they realized it. They also ignored diplomacy to defang the threat
If you recall impeachment- even asking Zelensky to look at corruption was heresy

Blind NATO expansion, utter lack of diplomacy. uber-militarization, and yes Putin "little Russia" ambitions
got us here
I've said for years this was a festering potential for war
 
Darla said:
I was not referring to the contents of his post, which I don't bother reading because anatta is a propagandist. I was trying to give him a heads up about how stupid he is, but apparently no one else noticed. And that's for the best. Not everyone is as ethical as me.
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self preening Wokeness coupled with self imposed ignorance
 
anatta said:
it's complicated. I thought how can I make a post that sums it up when you have so many factors as to why
it came to this.. I settled on this to try to give some perspective for those
only getting western propaganda ( ya we do it as well as Russia):
~~

You can be sure we had a hand in militarizing Kyiv government and turning it into a hostile actor against Russia, which is not to excuse Potin's war but Ukraine had become a defacto NATO state. Intolerable for Russia.
US ( Trump and Biden ) were glad to dismiss Russia's legit security needs; the usual Cold War 2.0 play...
It goes back to the Euromaidan and our part in overthrowing the pro-Russian government (Obama state dept) which started the war in Donbas..."it's complicated"
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Ukraine is not a defacto NATO state in the way that it matters in this situation... If it were we would have boots on the ground defending them as it required of NATO states.
 
LV426 said:
By inviting Belarus into this, Russia is showing its very, very weak hand...the Belorussians aren't going to swing this war of occupation to Russia.

Russia also weakens its leverage over Crimea and Donbass if it's unable to occupy Kyiv and Kharkiv...after all, if Russia can't manage to capture either city, it certainly can't maintain its current occupation.
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soo much wrong here. WhoTheFuck is Yelensky?
 
Jarod said:
Ukraine is not a defacto NATO state in the way that it matters in this situation... If it were we would have boots on the ground defending them as it required of NATO states.
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that's why it's a "defacto" state and we dont have boots.
It doesnt matter much now, but it did leading up to this clusterfuck,

Ukraine functions best for east and west as a neutral, or at least a buffer state.
We turned it into a "defacto" NATO outpost - and we told Russia to fuck off when they complained about it
 
Darla said:
I was not referring to the contents of his post, which I don't bother reading because anatta is a propagandist. I was trying to give him a heads up about how stupid he is, but apparently no one else noticed. And that's for the best. Not everyone is as ethical as me.
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I was a simple question that only required a 'yes' or 'no'. Was it too uncomfortable for you to answer?
Is it because anatta's OP has merit?
 
reagansghost said:
hey have you been watching that Soviet armor you're so proud of in action?

why are there so many holes in the turrets and smoke pouring out of the cupolas?
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ya know what a JAVELIN is? fire and forget ? what it's fight path is?? all tanks are lighter armored on the turret
 
anatta said:
ya know what a JAVELIN is? fire and forget ? what it's fight path is?? all tanks are lighter armored on the turret
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then y'all should add a few mm's of armor on those turrets doncha think? they could use some of that TUSK explosive reactive armor right about now, huh?

oh I know Javelins are fire and forget...........forget about the slobs down range, they're toast
 
anatta said:
here we go again..
how many Russians do you know NOT part of the opposition> anecdotals are fine but...

I distinctly did not "blame NATO" i said it was "Putins war"
if you bothered with some historical research instead of the constant democratic (small d) preening
you would find out what I wrote (OP) is a quick outline of events.

NATO expansion and uber-militarization are the fruits of the Euromaidan.
Toss in the Crimean annexation as well.

if I had to lay the background blame at one culprit it was refusing to use any diplomacy with Putin
and his legit "red lines". as I often called it "Putting Putin in a box"

"War is the ultimate failure of diplomacy" is the relevant mantra
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Generally, all we have out of Russia is anecdotal. There is no reliable polling I trust. I only correspond with educated, urban Russians. Undoubtedly Russia has it's own version of slack jawed MAGA rightwing nationalists, who have bought into Kremlin propaganda about Nazis governing Ukraine.


Given Putin's unjustified unprovoked, and unprecedented attack on an eastern European democratic nation, NATO was Entirely Justified basing troops in Poland and Lithuania.

I understand Russia has a history of being victimized by invasion. But Putin's war on democratic Ukraine has changed my calculus. I am fully hoping that Finland, Sweden, and a democratic Ukraine join NATO. And if democratic activists ever gain control of Belarus, I am going to hope for Belarusian NATO membership, even though it is an implausible long shot.
 
anonymoose said:
It's too late , but do you think Ukraine and the U.S.'s policy would have been a little different had they realized Putin was a serious threat?
Click to expand...
Darla said:
I was not referring to the contents of his post, which I don't bother reading because anatta is a propagandist. I was trying to give him a heads up about how stupid he is, but apparently no one else noticed. And that's for the best. Not everyone is as ethical as me.
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Since my question was obviously too uncomfortable for you to answer I’ll ask another that hopefully will give you less indigestion.
Do you think it was a mistake for NATO to expand to include Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania?
 
Cypress said:
Given Putin's unjustified unprovoked, and unprecedented attack on an eastern European democratic nation, NATO was Entirely Justified basing troops in Poland and Lithuania.

I understand Russia has a history of being victimized by invasion. But Putin's war on democratic Ukraine has changed my calculus. I am fully hoping that Finland, Sweden, and a democratic Ukraine join NATO. And if democratic activists ever gain control of Belarus, I am going to hope for Belarusian NATO membership, even though it is an implausible long shot.
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Disagree with Lithuania. That was a slap in the face. But the dye is cast now. Assuming Putin installs a puppet government in Ukraine , it wii be unstable. I’m sure Ukrainians are forever changed
with hatred for this aggression.
 
Cypress said:
Generally, all we have out of Russia is anecdotal. There is no reliable polling I trust. I only correspond with educated, urban Russians. Undoubtedly Russia has it's own version of slack jawed MAGA rightwing nationalists, who have bought into Kremlin propaganda about Nazis governing Ukraine.


Given Putin's unjustified unprovoked, and unprecedented attack on an eastern European democratic nation, NATO was Entirely Justified basing troops in Poland and Lithuania.

I understand Russia has a history of being victimized by invasion. But Putin's war on democratic Ukraine has changed my calculus. I am fully hoping that Finland, Sweden, and a democratic Ukraine join NATO. And if democratic activists ever gain control of Belarus, I am going to hope for Belarusian NATO membership, even though it is an implausible long shot.
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I dont have any problems with this -including forward staging of NATO as a defensive measure
my problem (and the world's) is NATO expansion. it was needless and aggressive and provoking
and it broke a promise - treaty or not

Zelensky however is far from democratic - how he got in and what he's done to opposition since
Locking up Poroshenko and closing down opposition TV and newspapers
-as well as backing off of Minsk Agreement while agitating for NATO

Six reasons Russia is at odds with Ukraine’s Zelensky
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/02/05/russia-putin-ukraine-zelensky/
 
reagansghost said:
then y'all should add a few mm's of armor on those turrets doncha think? they could use some of that TUSK explosive reactive armor right about now, huh?

oh I know Javelins are fire and forget...........forget about the slobs down range, they're toast
Click to expand...
I dont know enough to say if TUSK can be applied to turrets like it can with side armor
 
https://twitter.com/x/status/1498310064117059585

This is a really interesting translation of an article published on a Russian news agency site. It confirms what a lot of people smarter than those posting here suspected; this has little to do with NATO and much to do with Putin's old KGB delusions and his fury over the collapse of the soviet union.
 
Here's another interesting thread, confirming that Evince has been warning people about for a long time:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1498349668522201099


I tend to think that an obscure message board like JPP isn't high profile enough for these kind of actions, but...I do remember when during the W administration it was revealed, as a fact, that the GOP was hiring people to post on places like this. So I dunno...
 
Darla said:
Here's another interesting thread, confirming that Evince has been warning people about for a long time:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1498349668522201099


I tend to think that an obscure message board like JPP isn't high profile enough for these kind of actions, but...I do remember when during the W administration it was revealed, as a fact, that the GOP was hiring people to post on places like this. So I dunno...
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The Internet Research Agency (IRA; Russian: Агентство интернет-исследований translit: Agentstvo Internet-Issledovaniy), also known as Glavset[1] and known in Russian Internet slang as the Trolls from Olgino, is a Russian company engaged in online influence operations on behalf of Russian business and political interests.[2] It is linked to Russian oligarch Yevgeny Prigozhin and based in Saint Petersburg, Russia.

The January 2017 report issued by the United States Intelligence Community – Assessing Russian Activities and Intentions in Recent US Elections – described the Agency as a troll farm: "The likely financier of the so-called Internet Research Agency of professional trolls located in Saint Petersburg is a close ally of [Vladimir] Putin with ties to Russian intelligence," commenting that "they previously were devoted to supporting Russian actions in Ukraine—[and] started to advocate for President-elect Trump as early as December 2015."

The agency has employed fake accounts registered on major social networking sites,[3] discussion boards, online newspaper sites, and video hosting services to promote the Kremlin's interests in domestic and foreign policy including Ukraine and the Middle East as well as attempting to influence the 2016 United States presidential election. More than 1,000 employees reportedly worked in a single building of the agency in 2015.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Research_Agency
 
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