Pat Toomey: Background Checks Died Because GOP Didn't Want To Help Obama

Bfgrn said:
We have been over this ad nauseam. There is a loophole in the law that allows gun sellers to move large volumes of weapons at gun shows without the requirement of running a background check. These gun sellers are WELL AWARE there is a loophole, because they use it and abuse it. The loophole was created in 1986. Under the Gun Control Act of 1968, federal law clearly defined private sellers as anyone who sold no more than four firearms per year. But the 1986 Firearm Owners Protection Act lifted that restriction and loosely defined private sellers as people who do not rely on gun sales as the principal way of obtaining their livelihood.

“Today, private parties sometimes sell large numbers of new and used firearms while claiming hobbyist status and exemption from the requirements imposed on licensed retailers”

As far as the investigation by NY City, that was a private investigation. NYC has no jurisdiction in Ohio, Tennessee, Nevada and Arizona. All the private investigators can do is share their findings with state and federal agencies.

Some states have conducted their own sting operations at gun shows and there have been arrests and prosecutions.

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A.G. Schneiderman Announces Results Of Statewide Undercover Gun Show Investigation

"Operation Background Bust" Shows Blatant Disregard for Gun Show Laws Requiring Background Checks

Vendors Sold Guns to Customers Who Disclosed They Had Orders of Protections Against Them - Fully Knowing They Couldn't Pass a Background Check

AG Calls On Lawmakers to Address 'Accountability-Gap' in Gun Show Law

Schneiderman: Illegal Sales at Gun Shows Endanger the Public by Giving Felons, Terrorists and the Dangerously Mentally Ill an Open and Anonymous Marketplace to Buy Guns Without a Background Check


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ALBANY - Attorney General Eric T. Schneiderman today announced that his office has filed criminal charges against 10 gun sellers from across New York State who violated the state's background check requirement for the sale of firearms at gun shows. This investigation exposed both a flagrant and dangerous disregard of the law that jeopardizes the public's safety and the need to immediately strengthen the state’s existing gun show laws to better protect all New Yorkers.

As a result of the investigation Schneiderman's office is also sending out cease and desist letters to gun show operators based upon the violations found to date. The letters direct them to comply with the law and to cease practices that permit gun sales without background checks. Additionally, later today the Attorney General will issue subpoenas to several gun show operators seeking documentation and testimony related to the respective gun show events. The Attorney General's investigation is ongoing.

ny.gov

Why don't you stop being a helpless dependent on me to educate you? READ


AMERICA’S GUN SHOWS: OPEN MARKETS FOR CRIMINALS
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Cue the repeated question(s) in 3....2....1....
 
Bfgrn said:
We have been over this ad nauseam. There is a loophole in the law that allows gun sellers to move large volumes of weapons at gun shows without the requirement of running a background check. These gun sellers are WELL AWARE there is a loophole, because they use it and abuse it. The loophole was created in 1986. Under the Gun Control Act of 1968, federal law clearly defined private sellers as anyone who sold no more than four firearms per year. But the 1986 Firearm Owners Protection Act lifted that restriction and loosely defined private sellers as people who do not rely on gun sales as the principal way of obtaining their livelihood.

“Today, private parties sometimes sell large numbers of new and used firearms while claiming hobbyist status and exemption from the requirements imposed on licensed retailers”

As far as the investigation by NY City, that was a private investigation. NYC has no jurisdiction in Ohio, Tennessee, Nevada and Arizona. All the private investigators can do is share their findings with state and federal agencies.

Some states have conducted their own sting operations at gun shows and there have been arrests and prosecutions.

qNP2MBa.png


A.G. Schneiderman Announces Results Of Statewide Undercover Gun Show Investigation

"Operation Background Bust" Shows Blatant Disregard for Gun Show Laws Requiring Background Checks

Vendors Sold Guns to Customers Who Disclosed They Had Orders of Protections Against Them - Fully Knowing They Couldn't Pass a Background Check

AG Calls On Lawmakers to Address 'Accountability-Gap' in Gun Show Law

Schneiderman: Illegal Sales at Gun Shows Endanger the Public by Giving Felons, Terrorists and the Dangerously Mentally Ill an Open and Anonymous Marketplace to Buy Guns Without a Background Check


nyag.JPG


ALBANY - Attorney General Eric T. Schneiderman today announced that his office has filed criminal charges against 10 gun sellers from across New York State who violated the state's background check requirement for the sale of firearms at gun shows. This investigation exposed both a flagrant and dangerous disregard of the law that jeopardizes the public's safety and the need to immediately strengthen the state’s existing gun show laws to better protect all New Yorkers.

As a result of the investigation Schneiderman's office is also sending out cease and desist letters to gun show operators based upon the violations found to date. The letters direct them to comply with the law and to cease practices that permit gun sales without background checks. Additionally, later today the Attorney General will issue subpoenas to several gun show operators seeking documentation and testimony related to the respective gun show events. The Attorney General's investigation is ongoing.

ny.gov

Why don't you stop being a helpless dependent on me to educate you? READ


AMERICA’S GUN SHOWS: OPEN MARKETS FOR CRIMINALS
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Your article shows that the laws are affective in prosecuting those who break them, so how are any more laws going to be more affective?
 
Bfgrn said:
Here is your phrase for the day:

"An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure"
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Then you agree that every car should be equipped with an ignition lock out system, so that drunks can't just buy a car to circumvent the one in their car, just use someone else's car, or even steal one.

You differ from most Drunk Lover Liberals (DLLs); because they just want to ignore the carnage caused by drunk drivers and this built in vehicular loophole.
 
Steelplate said:
Oh....I care about the Constitution....it was Dumber than Most that said the SCOTUS wasn't the final say on Constitutionality....it was jury box.or the ammo box.
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and i'm exactly right. If the government makes an obviously unconstitutional law, but the SCOTUS upholds it anyway (study DUI checkpoints where Rhenquist specifically says that they are 4th Amendment violations, but drunk driving is so dangerous that it requires them) then the JURY box is where we decide constitutionality by acquitting all defendants. If the government then decides to bypass OUR jury system (enemy combatant) we must resort to the cartridge box.
 
Steelplate said:
Not at all...I'm not angry....I'm just sick of hearing a bunch of school yard bullies trying to intimidate the populace with their guns....I'm not scared of your guns...I'm not scared of you and your ridiculous weekend warrior militias...you hate this country? Change it....simple as that....

If you aren't gonna do it...then stop talking as though you are. It's real simple.
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hey moron. we're not talking about killing YOU, unless you decide to throw your lot in with the traitors in the government.
 
Bfgrn said:
If private sellers at gun shows acknowledge selling 348 guns in less than a year, there IS a loophole.
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THAT is not a loophole. THAT is someone violating federal law by selling guns as a main form of business.

Bfgrn said:
And when 19 out of 30 private sellers made the sale after being told by the buyer they ""probably couldn't pass a background check", there IS a loophole.
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THAT is not a loophole because private sellers are NOT REQUIRED to do a background check by law.

Bfgrn said:
And when a private seller can hoist an AR-15s into the air and shout “No background checks! $1,500!” there IS a loophole.
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THAT is not a loophole. the ONLY weapon sold by a private seller that requires ANY paperwork is an automatic weapon.

Bfgrn said:
YOU are on the side of aiding, abetting and codling murderers, felons and wife beaters. You are an enemy of We, the People and an HUGE enemy of the Constitution.
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quit your bellyaching, communist. I am no more an enemy of the constitution than Benjamin Franklin or George Washington. If there is ANY enemy to freedom here, it's YOU!!!!
 
Rana said:
Private sales of vehicles, the transaction in Alaska for the sale has to be recorded with the DMV, so we do have a record of private vehicle sales, if you don't , then if you are the last registered driver, no proof of transfer, you are linked to anything done with that vehicle.
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now tell us WHY these sales are recorded
 
Bfgrn said:
NY City hired 40 private investigators and analysts supervised by the global investigation firm Kroll, Inc. worked for four months to capture video of gun shows.

The participating investigators have more than 460 years of combined law enforcement experience and they include retired federal agents and police officers. Participants were chosen based on prior experience conducting undercover operations.

A copy of the report is being sent to every member of Congress and the findings will be shared the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.


http://www.gunshowundercover2009.org/truth.html

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why weren't any of these PRIVATE 'investigators' arrested for buying weapons across state lines?
 
SmarterthanYou said:
THAT is not a loophole. THAT is someone violating federal law by selling guns as a main form of business.

THAT is not a loophole because private sellers are NOT REQUIRED to do a background check by law.

THAT is not a loophole. the ONLY weapon sold by a private seller that requires ANY paperwork is an automatic weapon.

quit your bellyaching, communist. I am no more an enemy of the constitution than Benjamin Franklin or George Washington. If there is ANY enemy to freedom here, it's YOU!!!!
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And there is a simple, common sense way of fixing this. It is beyond obvious to over 90% of Americans. But to you and your band of morons, it is beyond your comprehension ability.

AND, even private sellers are required by law to turn down a sale if they suspect the buyer is a criminal. When 19 out of 30 'private' sellers still make the sale after being told by the buyer they ""probably couldn't pass a background check", there IS a loophole.
 
Bfgrn said:
And there is a simple, common sense way of fixing this. It is beyond obvious to over 90% of Americans. But to you and your band of morons, it is beyond your comprehension ability.
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90% of you morons thought it was a wonderful idea to void the 4th Amendment in Watertown looking for one teenager as well. fuck you and what you THINK is right.

Bfgrn said:
AND, even private sellers are required by law to turn down a sale if they suspect the buyer is a criminal. When 19 out of 30 'private' sellers still make the sale after being told by the buyer they ""probably couldn't pass a background check", there IS a loophole.
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if it's a listed crime, then it's NOT a loophole.
 
The insipid stubborness and willful ignorance of NRA flunkies and gunners is truly amazing.

I asked why are they so scared of background checks....and they don't answer. Instead, they BS and blow smoke. But here are some facts they can't ignore:

To date, the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) has prevented nearly 1.8 million criminals and other prohibited purchasers from buying guns. The law also has a deterrent effect—prohibited purchasers are less likely to try to buy guns when they know comprehensive background check requirements are in place.

Unfortunately, current federal law requires criminal background checks only for guns sold through licensed firearm dealers, which account for just 60% of all gun sales in the United States. A loophole in the law allows individuals not “engaged in the business” of selling firearms to sell guns without a license—and without processing any paperwork. That means that two out of every five guns sold in the United States change hands without a background check.

Though commonly referred to as the “Gun Show Loophole,” the “private sales” described above include guns sold at gun shows, through classified newspaper ads, the Internet, and between individuals virtually anywhere.

Unfortunately, only six states (CA, CO, IL, NY, OR, RI) require universal background checks on all firearm sales at gun shows. Three more states (CT, MD, PA) require background checks on all handgun sales made at gun shows. Seven other states (HI, IA, MA, MI, NJ, NC, NE) require purchasers to obtain a permit and undergo a background check before buying a handgun. Florida allows its counties to regulate gun shows by requiring background checks on all firearms purchases at these events. 33 states have taken no action whatsoever to close the Gun Show Loophole.

http://www.csgv.org/issues-and-campaigns/gun-show-loophole
 
Taichiliberal said:
The insipid stubborness and willful ignorance of NRA flunkies and gunners is truly amazing.

I asked why are they so scared of background checks....and they don't answer. Instead, they BS and blow smoke. But here are some facts they can't ignore:

To date, the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) has prevented nearly 1.8 million criminals and other prohibited purchasers from buying guns. The law also has a deterrent effect—prohibited purchasers are less likely to try to buy guns when they know comprehensive background check requirements are in place.

Unfortunately, current federal law requires criminal background checks only for guns sold through licensed firearm dealers, which account for just 60% of all gun sales in the United States. A loophole in the law allows individuals not “engaged in the business” of selling firearms to sell guns without a license—and without processing any paperwork. That means that two out of every five guns sold in the United States change hands without a background check.

Though commonly referred to as the “Gun Show Loophole,” the “private sales” described above include guns sold at gun shows, through classified newspaper ads, the Internet, and between individuals virtually anywhere.

Unfortunately, only six states (CA, CO, IL, NY, OR, RI) require universal background checks on all firearm sales at gun shows. Three more states (CT, MD, PA) require background checks on all handgun sales made at gun shows. Seven other states (HI, IA, MA, MI, NJ, NC, NE) require purchasers to obtain a permit and undergo a background check before buying a handgun. Florida allows its counties to regulate gun shows by requiring background checks on all firearms purchases at these events. 33 states have taken no action whatsoever to close the Gun Show Loophole.

http://www.csgv.org/issues-and-campaigns/gun-show-loophole
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What percentage of those 1.8 million criminals and other prohibited purchasers were arrested, charged, and prosecuted?
 
USFREEDOM911 said:
What percentage of those 1.8 million criminals and other prohibited purchasers were arrested, charged, and prosecuted?
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People with past criminal records are denied purchase. If you have an outstanding warrant for your arrest, I sincerely doubt you'd be stupid enough to try and legally buy a gun....unless you go to a gun show and find an unlicensed dealer who WON'T do a background check on you.

Background checks for guns: What you need to know
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...nd-checks-for-guns-what-you-need-to-know?lite

You don't even have the cojones to admit that this information proves your assertion dead wrong. Clearly, you don't do any homework that might >gasp!< contradict your belief system.

See genius, the point is that these folk WERE PREVENTED from obtaining a gun. Got that?
 
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