Religion is for....

PostmodernProphet said:
god is eternal, it was not necessary for anything to bring him into existence...
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Essentially, I think you're restating Coomb's cosmological argument:

  1. Every finite and contingent being has a cause.
  2. Nothing finite and contingent can cause itself.
  3. A causal chain cannot be of infinite length.
  4. Therefore, a First Cause (or something that is not an effect) must exist.
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But why would infinite things be free from cause? You'd have to justify that. Something coming out of nowhere seems at least as logical to me as something existing forever.
 
AnyOldIron said:
Darwin doesn't come on here and try to poke the zealots, you zealot.

128 years of death is a serious barrier to contributing to online discussions.

Zealot? Me? ha ha! If someone could just produce a convincing argument for deities and the like I will change my opinion. No zealot me.

The sole reason for doing this is to get people who agree with you to tell you how smart you are, it makes you feel good.

Still taking those pop-psychology night classes Damo?

Weed makes me feel good. Sex makes me feel good. Red wine makes me feel good. Sunny days make me feel good.

I come here to chat to you guys. I like discussing things with people who completely oppose me. But, and don't take offense at this, you are just avatars on a screen. I don't really care how you all feel about me.

Real men don't need that type of validation on religious (or non-religious) belief.

As Felix Lighter says to Bond in Casino Royale...

"Do I look like I need the validation?"
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Yes, you do look like you seek validation.
 
AnyOldIron said:
a- doesn't mean causeless it means without.
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and what did you think it was that abiogenesis was "without"?.....


Well that pretty convenient! How does that work exactly?
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????....how does eternal "work"?....I think eternal simply "is".....

Well, if you class faith as recognising the impossibility of absolute knowledge, maybe.
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no, simply defining faith as "belief in the absence of proof"


Science, essentially through repeated observation, has produced everything we have and everything we do. It has created the computer you type on, farmed the food you eat and all of the knowledge you bring to this debate.
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well actually no....science is a methodical process of examining the universe around us.....factories produce things, farmers farm food.....science is just a tool that is used to bring those things about.....
and my belief in a creating deity will bring as much to the table as your faith that scientists will someday be able to observe and study a nontheistic origin of life........

It doesn't. We were discussing the comparable strengths of the two moral systems.
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well, actually we are discussing your ability to provide a rational basis for the claims you made in the opening post.....this statement doesn't accomplish it....

If there is no deity, what creates the innate meaning in existence?
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[/quote]
circular argument.....you make the assumption that reality is nihilistic and conclude from that there is no deity......my response is that reality is NOT nihilistic....does that then prove there IS a deity?.....
 
AssHatZombie said:
No it doesn't. Asserting so is just stupid.

In a secular society you're free to be or not be a christian. Maybe that's what you're thinking of. in christianity, though, god is non-negotiable.
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???...how strange....do you somehow have the impression that Christianity doesn't consider you free to choose not to believe in God?.....true, we believe you are fucking yourself over royally by choosing not to, but obviously, the entire religion is about making that choice.....
 
Damocles said:
Darwin doesn't come on here and try to poke the zealots, you zealot. The sole reason for doing this is to get people who agree with you to tell you how smart you are, it makes you feel good. Real men don't need that type of validation on religious (or non-religious) belief.

me -> :pke: <- you

:D <- me again after poking the weird atheist zealot.
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I'm confused.....I thought he came here to get punished......
 
PostmodernProphet said:
???...how strange....do you somehow have the impression that Christianity doesn't consider you free to choose not to believe in God?.....true, we believe you are fucking yourself over royally by choosing not to, but obviously, the entire religion is about making that choice.....
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If you choose to be a christian, god is not negotiable. If you don't believe in god, you are not a christian, according to the teachings of the religion.

Are you really this stupid?
 
AssHatZombie said:
If you choose to be a christian, god is not negotiable. If you don't believe in god, you are not a christian, according to the teachings of the religion.

Are you really this stupid?
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???...at least I am smart enough to keep track of what we are discussing.....

remember this?....it's your question...
Which religion teaches that you must make your own choice regarding a belief in a deity?
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now, do I get to choose whether I believe in God?....yes, I do.....if I choose to believe in Jesus Christ, then I am a Christian.....if I choose not to believe in him, I am not.....does my religion teach that I must make a choice, and that the choice is my own to make?....yes, it does....that is why, when you asked which religion teaches I must make my own choice regarding belief in a deity, I answered Christianity......now, I realize that "intelligent" is not your native tongue, but I expect that was clear enough for even you.....
 
I find it fascinating that here we have a thread nearly 100 posts long, mostly from so-called "atheists" who wish to denounce God on a message board. It's sad but revealing, that your lives are so shallow and devoid of purpose, that this has become your sanctuary. Relegated to protesting with words, an ideology you can't match with your intellect, and doing so in crude fashion. It's absolutely stunning to watch, and it happens over and over again here and on other forums. It's as if this serves as some kind of 'reaffirmation' for your disbelief in God... by posting here, you obtain some sense of support from your fellow "atheists" and it serves to pacify you for another day. Tomorrow you will be faced with yet another day of emptiness and void in your life, and you will again seek to fill that void with anger and rage, directed at a God who you feel has forsaken you in life. It's really quite sad to see humans in such a condition.
 
Dixie said:
I find it fascinating that here we have a thread nearly 100 posts long, mostly from so-called "atheists" who wish to denounce God on a message board. It's sad but revealing, that your lives are so shallow and devoid of purpose, that this has become your sanctuary. Relegated to protesting with words, an ideology you can't match with your intellect, and doing so in crude fashion. It's absolutely stunning to watch, and it happens over and over again here and on other forums. It's as if this serves as some kind of 'reaffirmation' for your disbelief in God... by posting here, you obtain some sense of support from your fellow "atheists" and it serves to pacify you for another day. Tomorrow you will be faced with yet another day of emptiness and void in your life, and you will again seek to fill that void with anger and rage, directed at a God who you feel has forsaken you in life. It's really quite sad to see humans in such a condition.
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I feel no anger and rage. Religious people are evil, and you should be executed for the good of humanity in the most painful possible way.
 
Bittermark said:
I feel no anger and rage. Religious people are evil, and you should be executed for the good of humanity in the most painful possible way.
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Yes you are right Waterhead, people who wish another human to die a miserable death, are certainly not angry or full of rage, I don't know what I was thinking!
 
and what did you think it was that abiogenesis was "without"?.....

Life without organic origin.

????....how does eternal "work"?....I think eternal simply "is".....

A little convenient don't you think?

no, simply defining faith as "belief in the absence of proof"

Given the impossibility of absolute knowledge, then that would mean we have faith in everything. Which makes the term faith meaningless.

Faith is belief despite any contradictory evidence. Science doesn't work like that. A single piece of contradictory evidence makes a scientific notion fall.

well actually no....science is a methodical process of examining the universe around us.....factories produce things, farmers farm food.....science is just a tool that is used to bring those things about.....

Errrrm. Exactly my point. Science has brought about everything you use and know.

and my belief in a creating deity will bring as much to the table as your faith that scientists will someday be able to observe and study a nontheistic origin of life........

I asked what it has brought to the table, not for your to restate your position that it can.

circular argument.....you make the assumption that reality is nihilistic and conclude from that there is no deity......my response is that reality is NOT nihilistic....does that then prove there IS a deity?.....

No, you aren't addressing my point. I stated that:

'If there is no deity, then innately nihilism exists.'

You said

'????....there is no rational basis for that conclusion.... '

So, going from the inital statement, answer this. If there is no deity, what creates innate meaning?
 
I find it fascinating that here we have a thread nearly 100 posts long, mostly from so-called "atheists" who wish to denounce God on a message board.

I find it fascinating that when backed into a philosophical corner theists so quickly rely on ad hominems.

It's sad but revealing, that your lives are so shallow and devoid of purpose, that this has become your sanctuary.

Que? I haven't been on these boards for years Dixie.

Relegated to protesting with words,

How would you prefer a protest to be presented?

an ideology you can't match with your intellect, and doing so in crude fashion.

Dixie, if this is true, you wouldn't rely on this appalling list of ad hominems...

It's absolutely stunning to watch, and it happens over and over again here and on other forums. It's as if this serves as some kind of 'reaffirmation' for your disbelief in God... by posting here, you obtain some sense of support from your fellow "atheists" and it serves to pacify you for another day.

Au contraire Dixie. I would rather a board full of people who oppose me to people who support my position. Where is the fun in that?

Tomorrow you will be faced with yet another day of emptiness and void in your life, and you will again seek to fill that void with anger and rage, directed at a God who you feel has forsaken you in life. It's really quite sad to see humans in such a condition

Condition? I am not full of any anger or rage. I am quite calm

And am eagrely awaiting your reply to the above posts. Any chance of any reasoned argument?
 
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