The socialist programs in the U.S.

archives said:
Not many, the purpose of them is to provide the best service while delivering the same service to everyone, there is a reason that medicine isn’t strictly private, nor education, otherwise we would further deteriorate into money dictates what you get, and that ain’t America

Socialism has been part of the U.S. since the 19th Century, if not even earlier
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Except, the government rarely, if ever, delivers "the best service." In most cases, the government delivers expensive, mediocre service to everyone. This is so much the case that in some areas they have contracted out to private companies to do it instead. For example, many municipalities now use companies like Waste Management, a private corporation, to do their garbage pickup. WM does it cheaper and better than the government.
Rural Meto is an ambulance and fire service provided by subscription. It's competitive with government, unsubsidized, and privately operated.

Education is often done better by private providers than public school systems. In Arizona, the government just passed a law allowing anyone to get a voucher from the state to fund their child's education at any school, public or private, they want. There are already close to 20,000 people that have applied--and they aren't going to a public school with that money. Socialism in education has proven an increasing failure.

Truly socialized medicine is a disaster. From the VA, to public clinics, and beyond, socialized medicine delivers mediocre quality in a very poor delivery system with absurd wait times that people only use when they can't get an alternative. It is also grotesquely expensive as there are few if any price controls on it.

Socialism has been proven repeatedly not to work. Europe has moved away from the worst of socialism because it was putting nations there on the verge of economic collapse. Even today, the most heavily socialized nations in Europe have serious economic issues, like Greece.
 
anonymoose said:
Student loans are a loan. Not a socialist program. In fact it's a loan you can't even declare bankruptcy on.
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They are when the government is subsidizing and underwriting them not a private company.

Disability insurance is part of Social Security, the largest Ponzi scheme in history.
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Agreed. But Social Security doesn't have to be. It could have been run like a responsible retirement plan investing the money and only paying out to retirees. Instead, starting with LBJ in the 60's it was turned into a slush fund to finance expansion of government programs, particularly the social-welfare state. Now it is a Ponzi scheme. It's the same sort of irresponsible use of retirement plans corrupt and irresponsible corporations do to keep their bottom line up.

The EPA should be shut down after Obama militarized it and used it to circumvent congress to make his own laws.
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The EPA started out as a good idea that has grown beyond its original mandate and is now a threat to the nation.

The FBI has been proven to be corrupt and an arm of the DNC to stage a soft coup.
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Again, this is what happens when you have irresponsible bureaucrats allowed to operate behind a curtain.

I get no benefit from Medicaid.
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Medicaid is simply one of those pathetically bad socialized public medicine systems that people use as a last resort because it sucks so bad.

Medicare is worthless in Alaska. Very few providers accept it. Those that do are desperate or those doc-in-a-boxes. All that money I paid into it over my lifetime has been completely wasted.
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Same thing. It's less of a big deal to people over 65 when they have other health insurance coverage. It's just gravy for them, and they get to go to whoever they want knowing that the bill gets paid either way.

I get no benefit from welfare.
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Welfare that doesn't require a determined effort from those in the system to get out of it by getting a job, getting training to get a job, or otherwise bettering themselves (with verifiable proof they're doing it) is a drag on society and in the long run a huge negative as it breeds crime, sloth, incompetence, and lethargy.

USPS is a dinosaur that stays in financial trouble. Ever go to a post office to mail a box? There's always at least one clerk "on break". FedEX and UPS are far more reliable.
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UPS, FedEx, etc., prove that the USPS can be privatized and work better. It is a function of government per the constitution, however.

Police depts. in democrat run cities have had their wings clipped. They're not allowed to do their jobs. The mayors and DA's are pro-criminal , anti-police. May as well not have them.
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That's why rich Democrats hire private security firms to keep them safe. If police were doing their job, private security firms wouldn't be necessary. In many ways, the radical Abby Hoffman (look him up) was right. "Got a problem? Call a cop. Get two problems..."

The only vaccine the gubmint paid for was ineffective.
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This is why government shouldn't be involved in medical care.

A lot of that "socialism" could be cut.
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Agreed. Socialism is almost entirely a blight on society.
 
anonymoose said:
Student loans are a loan. Not a socialist program. In fact it's a loan you can't even declare bankruptcy on.
Disability insurance is part of Social Security, the largest Ponzi scheme in history.
The EPA should be shut down after Obama militarized it and used it to circumvent congress to make his own laws.
The FBI has been proven to be corrupt and an arm of the DNC to stage a soft coup .
I get no benefit from Medicaid.
Medicare is worthless in Alaska. Very few providers accept it. Those that do are desperate or those doc-in-a-boxes. All that money I paid into it over my lifetime has been completely wasted.
I get no benefit from welfare.
USPS is a dinosaur that stays in financial trouble. Ever go to a post office to mail a box? There's always at least one clerk "on break". FedEX and UPS are far more reliable.
Police depts. in democrat run cities have had their wings clipped. They're not allowed to do their jobs. The mayors and DA's are pro-criminal , anti-police. May as well not have them.
The only vaccine the gubmint paid for was ineffective.
A lot of that "socialism" could be cut.
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:rofl2: Thanks for the laugh.
 
AProudLefty said:
I see. So 1114 children found is irrelevant. Good one.
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You miss the point with this response which amounts to another irrelevant appeal to popularity by way of cherry picking.

Aside from that, amber alerts on the whole are ineffective.

AMBER Alerts are public announcements designed to elicit citizen tips that could help rapidly recover abducted children before they can be harmed by their kidnappers. Using various media accounts as a data source to garner a convenience sample of 275 alerts, the authors gathered basic information, including victim–offender relationship, recovery time, and the direct effects of the alert. AMBER Alert does appear to provide some positive benefits in recovering abducted children, although the evidence suggests that the alerts are not often used in “stereotypical” stranger abduction cases, and rarely do they appear to have the effect of possibly saving lives. The alerts appear most likely to be “successful” in familial abduction situations instead of the more menacing stranger abduction cases for which they were intended. Policy implications are discussed.
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https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0887403407302332

AMBER ALERTS LARGELY INEFFECTIVE, STUDY SHOWS

The system, designed to expedite the rescue of abducted children who are in grave danger, is one of the highest-profile law-enforcement initiatives of the past 10 years. But according to Timothy Griffin, assistant professor of criminal justice at UNR, the alerts seldom work as intended.

The report contradicts the claims of the Department of Justice, which insists the program "has saved the lives of hundreds of children nationwide." Marking National AMBER Alert Awareness Day on January 11th, 2007, Assistant Attorney General Regina B. Schofield called the system "one of the most effective tools employed to protect children."

The available evidence simply does not back up such assertions, Griffin says. In fact, it shows AMBER Alerts are least likely to be successful in the most dangerous cases, where the child is kidnapped by a stranger.
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https://psmag.com/social-justice/amber-alerts-largely-ineffective-study-shows-4792

According to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, Amber Alerts have a success rate of roughly 20 to 25 per cent in the U.S. But there’s another statistic: 95 per cent of the kids in Amber Alert cases make it home safely. These kids are making it home safely anyway—the Amber Alert had nothing to do with it.
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https://torontolife.com/city/the-sy...ing and,Amber Alert had nothing to do with it.

That last one shows that despite, not because of, amber alerts most children involved in one end up back home regardless of the alert system.

Amber alerts, on the whole, are a knee jerk reaction by bureaucrats and busybody people to "Do something." That is, the system is mainly in place regardless of effectiveness and cost because those sorts want something, anything, done to show they're doing something to respond to a problem. Instead of doing something that is truly effective, they slap a bandaid on an amputation and call it good. Look! We did something!
 
T. A. Gardner said:
You miss the point with this response which amounts to another irrelevant appeal to popularity by way of cherry picking.

Aside from that, amber alerts on the whole are ineffective.

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0887403407302332


https://psmag.com/social-justice/amber-alerts-largely-ineffective-study-shows-4792


https://torontolife.com/city/the-sy...ing and,Amber Alert had nothing to do with it.

That last one shows that despite, not because of, amber alerts most children involved in one end up back home regardless of the alert system.

Amber alerts, on the whole, are a knee jerk reaction by bureaucrats and busybody people to "Do something." That is, the system is mainly in place regardless of effectiveness and cost because those sorts want something, anything, done to show they're doing something to respond to a problem. Instead of doing something that is truly effective, they slap a bandaid on an amputation and call it good. Look! We did something!
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Okay so what is your proposal?
 
AProudLefty said:
WQMzoll.jpg
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If that constitutes socialism then all countries are socialist. In socialist countries the government owns the means of production--shipbuilding, oil industry, hospitals and doctors.....

Medicare, for example, is funded by government but the hospitals, doctors, clinics, medical supplies are all private.
 
Flash said:
If that constitutes socialism then all countries are socialist. In socialist countries the government owns the means of production--shipbuilding, oil industry, hospitals and doctors.....

Medicare, for example, is funded by government but the hospitals, doctors, clinics, medical supplies are all private.
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You remember the other thread on Social Security. I made reference to it being called an entitlement, because that what's the government calls it. A poster pushed back thinking I was making a derogatory statement (not realizing that's what the government calls the program). If being called an entitlement is no bueno I wonder if calling it a socialist program is ok?
 
cawacko said:
You remember the other thread on Social Security. I made reference to it being called an entitlement, because that what's the government calls it. A poster pushed back thinking I was making a derogatory statement (not realizing that's what the government calls the program). If being called an entitlement is no bueno I wonder if calling it a socialist program is ok?
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It is probably more acceptable to those who are not anti-socialism (Bernie Sanders) than those conservatives who are anti-socialism. I have seen many of them say SS and Medicare are not socialism because "we pay for them." Of course, we pay for all governmental programs. We just don't have dedicated funds for things like food stamps or housing programs.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
How many of those could be done better by the private sector? How many aren't even necessary at all?
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I like the USDA. They have a great list on their webpage about all the great advances that came from USDA led research. Today the USDA has an ARS (Ag Research Service) that hires some great chemists and scientists who, below industry rates, investigate things that help agriculture. And they are required to make their technology freely available or at reduced licensing rates to American farmers and ag companies.

It's a great return on your tax dollars.

https://www.ars.usda.gov/oc/timeline/about/

(I could be a bit biased, my first postdoc was with the USDA. Met some great folks there doing really impressive science).
 
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