U.S. Supreme Court Ruling: ATHEISM IS RELIGION

Flash said:
Religion only gets tax exemptions because it qualifies as a charity. If Congress said religions do not have to pay taxes that would be unconstitutional be cause it has no secular purpose and the law deal specifically with religion.
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False.
 
IBDaMann said:
That purpose would be the basis for the definition. As you have noted, the US hasn't ever gotten there yet.

One possibility could be to create a statute referencing religion, e.g. in the event that someone is to be excused from compulsory education for reasons of religion, as an example.


None, as of yet, of which I am aware.
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Congress does not get to define a person's religion. If people want to be excused from compulsory education for religious reasons, those reasons may vary widely. The government does not get to decide which of those reasons is a valid religion, only if those reasons are sincely held beliefs.
Those cases I listed explain these factors in more detail including additional cases dealing with freedom and establishment of religion.
 
Hume said:
US law makes religious property exempt from property tax. Court has nothing to do with it.
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The law was challenged as giving special treatment to religion. See Walz v. NY Tax Commission. The court always has somethling to do with it because they can determine if the law is constitutional.
 
Flash said:
They never have been.
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Correct. You are making an error if you are claiming that something that hasn't yet been decided yet is therefore prohibited somehow from being decided.

Flash said:
The founders discussed a national language at the constitutional convention and rejected it.
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... but they also considered it as well. All that matters is that no decision was made and there is no prohibition from Congress declaring an official language ... or an official dance ... or an official holiday ... or to define a term, etc ...

Flash said:
They have no authoirty to define religion
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Congress has full Article I authority.

Flash said:
and it would violate the 1st amendment
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Nope. We've been over this. You have not shown this.

Flash said:
because by definition it would have no secular purpose.
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Secular purpose is all it would have.
 
Flash said:
Which Article I provision gives Congress the power to outlaw?
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Section 1.
All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States

Flash said:
Congress cannot outlaw a power reserved to the states like education.
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Education is not a power. Congress can prohibit Christianity from being taught as science in a public classroom. You might not want it to happen, but Congress can do so under Section 1 of Article 1.

Flash said:
Who decides whether unconstitutional things are unconstitutional? You said the Supreme Court does not get to interpret.
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Correct. Don't make the extremely common mistake of equating basic English comprehension with "interpreting". The Constitution is written in straightforward English, not encrypted Swahili.
 
Flash said:
Congress does not get to define a person's religion.
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OK.

Flash said:
If people want to be excused from compulsory education for religious reasons, those reasons may vary widely.
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Yes. There must be a definition of religion so as to know if said "reasons" pertain to religion or not.

Flash said:
The government does not get to decide which of those reasons is a valid religion,
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OK.

Flash said:
only if those reasons are sincely held beliefs.
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That too is beyond the government.

It seems that you are confused about what constitutes a definition of "religion."
 
Flash said:
The law was challenged as giving special treatment to religion. See Walz v. NY Tax Commission. The court always has somethling to do with it because they can determine if the law is constitutional.
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So for Christian Nation SCOTUS Fourth Reich July the Federal Lynching KKK churchstate of hate drug trafficking fiefdom sends a text message for a Sunpass billing of $7.59 with a late fee of $75.90 in that George Washington University Hospital Washington, D.C. born USA citizens are Islam Fuhere's Brainwashing Inquisition of Federal Lynching KKK churchstate of hate fiefdom drug trafficking fiefdom there were no Arab "death to the infidels" threatening POTUS & to nuke Temple Mount tradition of Nazi economics in SCOTUS Rehnquist "what is 9/11?" Freudian slip as never have driven on a Sunpass toll road......
 
IBDaMann said:
What should I do if that happens?
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Those in Judea will eventually flee to the mountains. You could maybe give THAT a try? ;)

The Bible makes the upcoming "last days" sound like a VERY difficult time to be alive, with evil running fully rampant as it was in the days of Noah just before the great flood.
 
IBDaMann said:
Yes. There must be a definition of religion so as to know if said "reasons" pertain to religion or not.

It seems that you are confused about what constitutes a definition of "religion."
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We have lost all of our freedom of religion when government gets to decide what constitutes religion. If my religious beliefs do not meet the government's definition of religion, I have no religious freedom.

We have no laws defining religion because they would be unconstitutional.
 
IBDaMann said:
Section 1.
All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States


Education is not a power. Congress can prohibit Christianity from being taught as science in a public classroom. You might not want it to happen, but Congress can do so under Section 1 of Article 1.


Correct. Don't make the extremely common mistake of equating basic English comprehension with "interpreting". The Constitution is written in straightforward English, not encrypted Swahili.
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American history is full of court decisions and other controversies based on different interpretations of constitutional or statutory.

The 4th amendment says government cannot conduct an unreasonable search and that warrants must have probable cause. There is nothing straightforward about "unreasonable" and "probable cause. Case law is full of 5-4 decisions about the meaning of these terms.
 
IBDaMann said:
... but they also considered it as well. All that matters is that no decision was made and there is no prohibition from Congress declaring an official language ... or an official dance ... or an official holiday ... or to define a term, etc ...

Secular purpose is all it would have.
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There is no prohibition on creating a national language. The 1st Amement freedom/establishment of religion prohibits government from defining religion.

What delegated power allows the creation of a national language?
 
Flash said:
While all legislative power is vested in Congress, that legislative power is limited to those listed in Article I, Section 8. Which of those powers listed below gives Congress the power to make laws defining religion? The 1st Amenment clearly forbids Congress to pass such legislation.

Section 8: Powers of Congress​

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

To borrow Money on the credit of the United States;

To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;

To establish a uniform Rule of Naturalization, and uniform Laws on the subject of Bankruptcies throughout the United States;

To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

To provide for the Punishment of counterfeiting the Securities and current Coin of the United States;

To establish Post Offices and post Roads;

To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

To constitute Tribunals inferior to the supreme Court;

To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offences against the Law of Nations;

To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;

To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

To provide and maintain a Navy;

To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;

To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of particular States, and the Acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards and other needful Buildings;-And

To make all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.
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how can the constituion protect freedom of religion if it cannot be defined?

I guess you don't want atheism protected.
 
Blackwater Lunchbreak said:
how can the constituion protect freedom of religion if it cannot be defined?

I guess you don't want atheism protected.
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It protects freedom of religion by prohibiting government from making laws restricting those freedoms.

There is no way to define religion without excluding the religious beliefs and practices of many people (atheism being an example). We have survived many years without a definition of religion and have maintained a significant amount of freedom.
 
Flash said:
It protects freedom of religion by prohibiting government from making laws restricting those freedoms.

There is no way to define religion without excluding the religious beliefs and practices of many people (atheism being an example). We have survived many years without a definition of religion and have maintained a significant amount of freedom.
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but what is a religion.

it has to be defined if its in the constitution.
 
Flash said:
It protects freedom of religion by prohibiting government from making laws restricting those freedoms.

There is no way to define religion without excluding the religious beliefs and practices of many people (atheism being an example). We have survived many years without a definition of religion and have maintained a significant amount of freedom.
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I couldn't care less about religion. Pay your property taxes and no one gives a shit.
 
Blackwater Lunchbreak said:
but what is a religion.

it has to be defined if its in the constitution.
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No it doesn't. The Constitution included the term in the original document and 1st Amendment. It did not define it; nor, did it define freedom, establishment, probable cause, or many other terms. Those issues have been settled by court decisions as it dealth with the facts of individual cases.

Defining religion limits the very freedoms the amendment seeks to protect.
 
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