What is hell?

ZenMode said:
After we're finished discussing what is hell, maybe we can discuss how much gold is at the end of the rainbow. :p
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No gold at the end of refracted light....leprechauns, OTOH, are more likely. :D

Are you an atheist who believes "when you're dead, you're dead"?
 
IBDaMann said:
So when one chooses to cheer on a genocide, how does God judge that? There have been many genocides throughout history. How did God judge those who did not actively participate, but threw in their full support to fuel it? Does God judge differently when His chosen people are the active perpetrators of the genocide? I imagine so, right?
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Into the Night said:
There is no genocide.
There is no genocide.
There is no genocide.
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^^^
sock puppet masturbation.
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Phantasmal said:
It is life, it is family, and friends, it’s the beauty and wonder of nature. It is life!
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Life is fun but it's also painful. Jobs, bills to pay, nasty people, authoritarian racist governments, etc, etc, etc.

Since we all die, what's to prevent a pure atheist from ending their pain...and taking out a few assholes on the way?
 
Dutch Uncle said:
Life is fun but it's also painful. Jobs, bills to pay, nasty people, authoritarian racist governments, etc, etc, etc.

Since we all die, what's to prevent a pure atheist from ending their pain...and taking out a few assholes on the way?
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Morals, atheist and agnostics still have them, they just aren’t based on a punishment from a deity,
 
Dutch Uncle said:
I'm highly skeptical of reincarnation. It'd be more likely IMO that the people were somehow contacted with the past than a spirit has returned to this plane. Still, there's zero factual evidence to back up either idea.
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Agreed, generally better to err on the side of skepticism, absent independent corroborating evidence.

In principle, it's still important to find that balance between hyper-skepticism and gullible open mindedness.
 
Phantasmal said:
It is life, it is family, and friends, it’s the beauty and wonder of nature. It is life!
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I agree with that, but on the other hand not everyone is fortunate enough to have grandchildren, family, opportunities to visit national parks and museums.

I've always had trouble myself articulating what political prisoners in North Korean labor camps, or inmates serving life sentences in Russian prisons are supposed to be living for.

It seems like there should be purpose and meaning in life all humans can share in, regardless of their circumstances.
 
Phantasmal said:
Morals, atheist and agnostics still have them, they just aren’t based on a punishment from a deity,
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Agreed social conditioning applies to atheists as it does to everyone...well, except for the crazies. LOL

A person can believe in an existence beyond the physical one without fear of punishment. As discussed earlier, I believe "Hell" is self-induced. It's a choice. Nirvana can be achieved without living in fear. My understanding is that it's best achieved by not living in fear and in seeking to simply live right, do right and respect others.


3SplEy8.jpg

www.merriam-webster.com

Definition of NIRVANA

the final beatitude that transcends suffering, karma, and samsara and is sought especially in Buddhism through the extinction of desire and individual consciousness; a place or state of oblivion to care, pain, or external reality; also : bliss, heaven… See the full definition
www.merriam-webster.com www.merriam-webster.com
1: the final beatitude (see beatitude sense 1a) that transcends suffering, karma, and samsara and is sought especially in Buddhism through the extinction of desire and individual consciousness
2: a place or state of oblivion to care, pain, or external reality
also : bliss, heaven
 
Cypress said:
I agree with that, but on the other hand not everyone is fortunate enough to have grandchildren, family, opportunities to visit national parks and museums.

I've always had trouble myself articulating what political prisoners in North Korean labor camps, or inmates serving life sentences in Russian prisons are supposed to be living for.

It seems like there should be purpose and meaning in life all humans can share in, regardless of their circumstances.
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A good reason why I support reinstituting the draft, even if including non-military organizations like Peace Corps, Americorps, etc. We have it really good in the United States, but like spoiled rich kids telling poor kids "let them eat cake", too many Americans don't realize how good we have it. Better, IMO, to show them by taking them to foreign shitholes for a few years to let them know how good it is to go home. :)
 
ZenMode said:
Morals and legal consequences.
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Are babies born with morals or is that simply social conditioning?

A big "so what" on the legal consequences. We're all gonna die anyway so what's the point of prolonging the inevitable? Why not take out some really awful people for the greater good?
 
Dutch Uncle said:
Are babies born with morals or is that simply social conditioning?

A big "so what" on the legal consequences. We're all gonna die anyway so what's the point of prolonging the inevitable? Why not take out some really awful people for the greater good?
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I think all animals are born with instincts. Some of them could be viewed as an expression of morality, even though the animal doesn't think of it that way.

I have a wife and two kids. Intentionally doing something That would result in me being removed from their life, and result in a severe negative impact to their lives, would be immoral, in my opinion.

The fact that we are all eventually going to die, does not mean that I want to spend my remaining life in prison.
 
Dutch Uncle said:
A good reason why I support reinstituting the draft, even if including non-military organizations like Peace Corps, Americorps, etc. We have it really good in the United States, but like spoiled rich kids telling poor kids "let them eat cake", too many Americans don't realize how good we have it. Better, IMO, to show them by taking them to foreign shitholes for a few years to let them know how good it is to go home. :)
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Americans in general are pretty spoiled, myself included.

I guess in a certain sense it's easy for me to say life has purpose and beauty. I have lots of leisure time, loving family, plentiful opportunities for enriching experiences like education, vacations, concerts, museums, world class natural beauty.

I always wondered what life's value and meaning would be if I was a political prisoner in the gulag with no chance of getting paroled, and cut off from family, love, culture, any kind of enriching experiences. Are we supposed to say the lives of those kind of people have no value or meaning? Is their life hollow and meaningless? Should they just commit suicide? I don't know the answer to that kind of situation.
 
ZenMode said:
I think all animals are born with instincts. Some of them could be viewed as an expression of morality, even though the animal doesn't think of it that way.

I have a wife and two kids. Intentionally doing something That would result in me being removed from their life, and result in a severe negative impact to their lives, would be immoral, in my opinion.

The fact that we are all eventually going to die, does not mean that I want to spend my remaining life in prison.
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Animals don't have morals. They have experience and genetic programming. Humans have the ability to rise above their baser instincts...not that all do as JPP demonstrates daily. Morals = social conditioning.

I'm still waiting for a reason if there is no purpose other than to suffer through life and everyone ends up D-E-A-D regardless of how they live their lives. Would it be better to heavily insure yourself then have an "accident" in a head-on with a cement truck thus providing your family more money than you could make over the span of their lives?

That's why mass murders, even of scumbags, would end in suicide. Unfortunately, most insurance companies don't pay on suicide. I'm certain you could figure it out if you wanted to do so. LOL
 
Dutch Uncle said:
Animals don't have morals. They have experience and genetic programming. Humans have the ability to rise above their baser instincts...not that all do as JPP demonstrates daily. Morals = social conditioning.

I'm still waiting for a reason if there is no purpose other than to suffer through life and everyone ends up D-E-A-D regardless of how they live their lives. Would it be better to heavily insure yourself then have an "accident" in a head-on with a cement truck thus providing your family more money than you could make over the span of their lives?

That's why mass murders, even of scumbags, would end in suicide. Unfortunately, most insurance companies don't pay on suicide. I'm certain you could figure it out if you wanted to do so. LOL
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Right, animals have instincts that could be moral behavior. Female lions, for example, obviously, but moral behavior. In humans I would say that protecting and taking care of children is moral behavior.

In the example of getting a hefty insurance policy and having a so-called accident, you would be wrongly taking money from the insurance company. That would seem to be immoral to me, also.
 
Cypress said:
I agree with that, but on the other hand not everyone is fortunate enough to have grandchildren, family, opportunities to visit national parks and museums.

I've always had trouble myself articulating what political prisoners in North Korean labor camps, or inmates serving life sentences in Russian prisons are supposed to be living for.

It seems like there should be purpose and meaning in life all humans can share in, regardless of their circumstances.
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Nature! It is available to everyone!
 
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