PostmodernProphet
fully immersed in faith..
are you accusing God of being dumb for expecting Biden President to alleviate suffering?.....
Who can explain the logic of God?
- Thread starter NiftyNiblick
- Start date
are you accusing God of being dumb for expecting Biden President to alleviate suffering?.....
No, I accuse you of trying to troll what could be an interesting thread
PostmodernProphet
fully immersed in faith..
its not trolling......Christianity explicitly teaches that it is our job to work against suffering.......people who do not do what he instructs and then complain he hasn't done anything are the source of the problem......perhaps talking instead of doing interests you more.......
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
Yet you deliberately inflict suffering on people daily. Are you confessing you're not really a Christian?
God is a man made creation. But to trick everyone into believing in a loving God that created a world filled with horror, they concocted the nonsensical concept of God allowing man to have 'free will'. Of course the logic breaks down when you make God all powerful and all knowing, since he would have known ahead of time what we'd decide to do with that 'free will'. God is comfort food. Nothing more. We understand our mortality, so we needed to invent a get out of jail card. Here comes God, and then Jesus.
I was not here when dinosaurs roamed the earth, and I won't be here 100 years from now. If I can't accept and find meaning in THIS life, there is very little point. That's all there is folks. No mansion in heaven. No everlasting life. You are born, you live, you die. I consider the experience enriching and fulfilling. No regrets from this guy. But no, there is no God watching over us. We are not the chosen. We're just another one of millions of species on millions of planets in millions of galaxies. And maybe millions of universes. Enjoy the ride.
I was not here when dinosaurs roamed the earth, and I won't be here 100 years from now. If I can't accept and find meaning in THIS life, there is very little point. That's all there is folks. No mansion in heaven. No everlasting life. You are born, you live, you die. I consider the experience enriching and fulfilling. No regrets from this guy. But no, there is no God watching over us. We are not the chosen. We're just another one of millions of species on millions of planets in millions of galaxies. And maybe millions of universes. Enjoy the ride.
Atheists look at life as all there is therefore they look at suffering as forever. It's not. It's finite.
I compare it to kids in school; kids complain about the suffering of growing up and of being forced to go to school. Kids are taught, but it's important that they learn and "suffering" is a learning process. It doesn't do kids any good to just give them the answers, they must study and learn why those answers are correct. Growing up is hard and helicopter parents aren't helping their children.
Some kids, especially HS kids, harm each other over trivial shit because they believe HS life is the most important thing in the world. It's not. There's an entire life of 50-60 years that comes after High School where people have the opportunity to continue to grow and learn. Some don't. Some people are fucking morons. See the IQ Bell Curve.
While the Christian personal god doesn't hold water by the results, that doesn't negate the exist of an all powerful being uniting us all. Panentheism is within the Deist models of an all powerful force uniting everything.
I don't have the answers; I am a seeker.
But I do feel like a strictly materialistic and reductionist view of reality is not only a cop out, it is an inadequate explanation of reality and the human experience.
A collection of quarks and electrons does not explain consciousness, it does not explain Mozart's music, it does not explain Michelangelo's art, it does not explain imagination, intuition, creativity.
It is not even self evident why it is supposedly absolutely required for matter to even exist.. Matter required a very specific balance of universal physical constants.
I do not think a guy in a white robe is a plausible explanation.
But I am the first to say there are a lot of unanswered questions, some of which may be forever beyond the reach of human cognition, inductive logic, and scientific experimentation.
Melchizedek = Michael
Verified User
This world is Hell!
Look where you're at ,living on a spinning rock,inside a flesh body,that's slow but sure dying while you are living in it!
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
Just like physics and psychology, spirituality has theories and models. The Abrahamic model of God is one of these. While I agree this perception of the mysteries of the Universe is man-made, claiming there is nothing beyond the physical is just as man-made since there's no evidence to support it. Atheism and Theism are spiritual theories with no evidence to support either. While we can point to the flaws in man's theories, such as the Torah/Bible/Koran, anyone who claims there's nothing but the physical is equally flawed and the equivalent of a Bible-thumper.
Agreed 100% on "find meaning in THIS life". IF we're here for a purpose, then it's best to find out that purpose. Going back to my school analogy, the purpose is to learn, to grow and to become a better, more enlightened entity is a noble one. People who are narcissistic, solely motivated by physical things don't grow very much as people.
In that regard, it's like Pascal's wager; work to be better. If there's nothing there, one gained the experience of being better. If there is something there, then the person is better off in the long run.
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
Consider life a long Outward Bound trip. You'll have more fun with it.
BidenPresident
Verified User
God is perfect. Man chooses to do evil. Worst theology ever.
BidenPresident
Verified User
Postmodern is a troll. A committed troll and 100% avoidable.
The concept of God that I reject is the anthropomorphized concept. If something exists beyond the physical, and I have no idea whether that's true or not, that something doesn't give two shits about us.
BidenPresident
Verified User
Anyone who believes Jesus walked on water is not spiritual. They are looking for a magic act.
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
What is your evidence? $50 says you have none. LOL There's zero evidence anything intelligence exists off Earth much less another dimension where we ascend like avatars in a game to a "real life" or higher level of play.
Given we are, in fact, creations of an intelligent power, why would they**/it do that? What's the purpose? We are born, we eat, fuck, sleep and finally die. WTF's the point? Entertainment? Growth like arborists grow trees as reforestation transplants? Just to fuck with us because it's cruel?
IMO, intelligence is never cruel. More direct in action, but never cruel, with malice or other animalistic emotion. Doing so anthropomorphizes a force larger than the Universe itself. Therefore, I think the purpose is to learn and grow. Be the best you can, absorb as much as possible, love as much as possible and wring out every bit of life you desire. The main rule is don't hurt anyone since that's a negative.
The Buddhists live the Eight-fold path for similar reasons. https://www.britannica.com/topic/Eightfold-Path
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
Or that Hillary is innocent? LOL
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
No one has definitive answers. IMO, it's up to each of us to seek to our hearts desire. Have no regrets. "If you're not busy being born, you're busy dying."
I just try to avoid these:
Hubris: "Scientific experiments can explain everything"
Cynicism: "We are nothing but a collection of quarks and electrons"
Dogmatism: "I have absolute faith that a trancedent power guides my life and salvation"
Dutch Uncle
* Tertia Optio * Defend the Constitution
It's usually smart to keep one's mind open to possibilities but sucked into absolutism without all the facts. We don't have all the facts.
This is Dostoyevsky's explanation of evil. Humans were given free will and moral freedom. Free will is corruptible. The choice comes down to perfection, or freedom.
The Grand Inquisitor - a short story by Fyodor Dostoevsky
In a town in Spain, in the sixteenth century, Christ arrives, apparently reborn on Earth. As he walks through the streets, the people gather about him, staring. He begins to heal the sick, but his ministrations are interrupted by the arrival of a powerful cardinal who orders his guards to arrest Christ.
Late that night, this cardinal, the Grand Inquisitor, visits Christ’s cell and explains why he has taken him prisoner and why he cannot allow Christ to perform his works.
The Grand Inquisitor tells Christ that he cannot allow him to do his work on Earth, because his work is at odds with the work of the Church. The Inquisitor reminds Christ that he guaranteed that human beings would have free will. Free will, the Inquisitor says, is a devastating, impossible burden for mankind. Christ gave humanity the freedom to choose whether or not to follow him, but almost no one is strong enough to be faithful.
The Grand Inquisitor says that Christ should have given people no choice, and instead taken power and given people security instead of freedom. That way, the same people who were too weak to follow Christ to begin with would still be damned, but at least they could have happiness and security on Earth, rather than the impossible burden of moral freedom.
Thus, the Grand Inquisitor must keep Christ in prison, because if Christ were allowed to go free, he might undermine the Church’s work to lift the burden of free will from mankind.
The Grand Inquisitor - a short story by Fyodor Dostoevsky
In a town in Spain, in the sixteenth century, Christ arrives, apparently reborn on Earth. As he walks through the streets, the people gather about him, staring. He begins to heal the sick, but his ministrations are interrupted by the arrival of a powerful cardinal who orders his guards to arrest Christ.
Late that night, this cardinal, the Grand Inquisitor, visits Christ’s cell and explains why he has taken him prisoner and why he cannot allow Christ to perform his works.
The Grand Inquisitor tells Christ that he cannot allow him to do his work on Earth, because his work is at odds with the work of the Church. The Inquisitor reminds Christ that he guaranteed that human beings would have free will. Free will, the Inquisitor says, is a devastating, impossible burden for mankind. Christ gave humanity the freedom to choose whether or not to follow him, but almost no one is strong enough to be faithful.
The Grand Inquisitor says that Christ should have given people no choice, and instead taken power and given people security instead of freedom. That way, the same people who were too weak to follow Christ to begin with would still be damned, but at least they could have happiness and security on Earth, rather than the impossible burden of moral freedom.
Thus, the Grand Inquisitor must keep Christ in prison, because if Christ were allowed to go free, he might undermine the Church’s work to lift the burden of free will from mankind.
BidenPresident
Verified User
No. The Grand Inquisitor is about FREEDOM FROM THE CHURCH.
And it is not a short story. It is in the novel, Brothers Karamazov.