APP - Woopsie! Health bill recalculation

TuTu Monroe said:
I'd like to know why the Democrats rejected every amendment the Republicans proposed in the Baucus bill. Bi-Partisan? Hell no.
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More GOP BS.
At last count, 161 Republican amendments were accepted out of 437 heard. After their passage, the GOP gang still voted againt the bill.
Bi-partisanship? More GOP BS.

"The truth shall set you free."
 
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Damocles said:
Again, what you say is just rubbish. They support a different approach to reform, using regulation and actual competition, they do not support this mess that is so very costly for so little return.
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Round and round we go where we stop nobody knows, where's an alternative bill they support?
 
belme1201 said:
......and those "bills" proposed by Republicans are unavailable for public view and were not published previously by the Republican sponsoring Congress person? I find it amazing that you buy that folly. A Republican supported bill simply does not exist and you are dancing a semantic jig to avoid that fact. If
it did exist, you would post in in a flash, and that's all the evidence needed to prove it is a GOP PR myth.
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Where do you get your info from?

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-2520

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s111-1324

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.3400:

The texts are easily found, they are sitting in committees.
 
Annie said:
Where do you get your info from?

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-2520

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s111-1324

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.3400:

The texts are easily found, they are sitting in committees.
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I know about the Ryan "bill", it doesn't address the problems of the system but, in fact, ignores them which is the reason it has been ignored even by the GOP and not submitted for evaluation or consideration. Which is why you hear the 'NOs' and not the positives of ideas in their own "bills", even by Ryan, Shaddegg, Price etc. I don't know if you have had any experience with the healthcare system, but an annual $5000 tax credit won't cover anywhere close to two days in the OR and ICU, that plus paying insurance premiums and other costs.
All Congressmen can obtain bill numbers, that doesn't necessarily mean they will present them or they're not a sham. Read them youself and tell me how they relate to the numbers uninsured, underinsured, rising insurance costs, the cost of the bill and how to pay for it, the budget, donut holes, medical bankruptcies, pharmaceutical costs, etc. All do address tax credits and tax cuts which have little to do with people who don't have enough money to buy insurance. Yesterday on C-Span, Sen. Roberts was taking credit for a bi-partisan HEALTH bill, it turns out it deals only with hospice care, truly comical.
When you hear a GOP Congressperson say he/she doesn't like something about the Dem bill and then offers what he propses as an alternative in the same situation, let me know.
 
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belme1201 said:
No gotcha. The House bill isn't what we were discussing. tutu brought up the Senate Finance Committee Bill, sometimes called the Baucus Bill. The sources confirming the numbers were the NY Times, Washington Post and a third source which I've forgotten. All confirmed the 161 accepted number, the total heard varied at the point of the publication so I used the lowest number, 437 for fairness, although the total of GOP amendments went, eventually, into the 700s.
I see no references at all to amendments by either party in your links.
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The Senate one begins with the S. I believe it's in the middle.
 
belme1201 said:
I amended my reply to go further in answer to you.
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Yet, the "Republican bills" were published, so they existed though allowed to die in committee, which most bills do. No one was asking you to agree, just admit they were there.
 
Annie said:
Yet, the "Republican bills" were published, so they existed though allowed to die in committee, which most bills do. No one was asking you to agree, just admit they were there.
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He likes to pretend that he has some point, even though he knows that what he is saying is simply an untruth.
 
TuTu Monroe said:
I love how you demand we answer your questions, yet you rarely answer ours.

Since the Iraq war wasn't well planned, yes, I would say most of it was a waste. The Obamacare plan is an even bigger waste.
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The Obama plan is still a plan, not a done deal, so how can it be a waste?
 
Damocles said:
He likes to pretend that he has some point, even though he knows that what he is saying is simply an untruth.
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In other words the Republicans have a bill they SUPPORT? It is the subect I first broached in post #38.
Any Congressman can request bills to be scored by the CBO, these aren't. Amidst grand bruhaha in May and then again in June, the GOP Reps introduced the "bills" seen above. Even you forgot the 4 page "bill" they were waving around, that's because no-one took it seriously from either side. They have received no active support from their own members or even from the folks with their names on them because they were more PR than serious legislation. Aside from their titles such as "The Patient's Bill of Rights", they don't deal with the problems in the system, instead, using a tax credit as the solution to all problems.(A big surprise.)
So, I'll ask again; since the Dem bill is so bad and the Republicans are so vehemently and loudly against it, where (and which) bills do they support as an alternative?
It has been said here several times that GOP amendments have not been heard even though 161 of them were accepted, but Republican Senators, aside from Snowe, still rejected the bill to a man. If they want an alternative, it certainly wasn't mentioned at the time of their negative vote. Why keep it a mystery?
A $5000 tax credit(irrelevant to a Walmart employee e.g.) doesn't cover anywhere close to major out-of-pocket expenses plus premiums, nor are the problems of healthcare inflation, medical bankruptcy, Donut Holes, prescription costs and abuses, etc., addressed. In other words, they are merely words to cover a sham which neither side takes seriously. It remains, they are being paid to come away with the status quo, being, to them, a success. They want no bill, that will keep profits safe.
 
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belme1201 said:
In other words the Republicans have a bill they SUPPORT? It is the subect I first broached in post #38.
Any Congressman can request bills to be scored by the CBO, these aren't. Amidst grand bruhaha in May and then again in June, the GOP Reps introduced the "bills" seen above. Even you forgot the 4 page "bill" they were waving around, that's because no-one took it seriously from either side. They have received no active support from their own members or even from the folks with their names on them because they were more PR than serious legislation. Aside from their titles such as "The Patient's Bill of Rights", they don't deal with the problems in the system, instead, using a tax credit as the solution to all problems.(A big surprise.)
So, I'll ask again; since the Dem bill is so bad and the Republicans are so vehemently and loudly against it, where (and which) bills do they support as an alternative?
It has been said here several times that GOP amendments have not been heard even though 161 of them were accepted, but Republican Senators, aside from Snowe, still rejected the bill to a man. If they want an alternative, it certainly wasn't mentioned at the time of their negative vote. Why keep it a mystery?
A $5000 tax credit(irrelevant to a Walmart employee e.g.) doesn't cover anywhere close to major out-of-pocket expenses plus premiums, nor are the problems of healthcare inflation, medical bankruptcy, Donut Holes, prescription costs and abuses, etc., addressed. In other words, they are merely words to cover a sham which neither side takes seriously. It remains, they are being paid to come away with the status quo, being, to them, a success. They want no bill, that will keep profits safe.
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http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3400/show
Democrats stifle Republican health care plans
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/p...lican-health-care-plans-8224780-58644807.html
 
tinfoil said:
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3400/show
Democrats stifle Republican health care plans
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/p...lican-health-care-plans-8224780-58644807.html
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30 "plans"? The poor Dems only had time for how many?
Which are supported by the GOP members of the Senate Finace Committee? Or for that matter, by the rest of the GOP Congressional Members? Which has been endorsed by the Wash.Times, WSJ, Fox, the Weekly Standard or any other in that camp. Who has signed on to these "plans"? They complain about the silence of the press, but what explains their silence? That is, if they were serious, which I hold, theyare not.
 
belme1201 said:
I know about the Ryan "bill", it doesn't address the problems of the system but, in fact, ignores them which is the reason it has been ignored even by the GOP and not submitted for evaluation or consideration. Which is why you hear the 'NOs' and not the positives of ideas in their own "bills", even by Ryan, Shaddegg, Price etc. I don't know if you have had any experience with the healthcare system, but an annual $5000 tax credit won't cover anywhere close to two days in the OR and ICU, that plus paying insurance premiums and other costs.
All Congressmen can obtain bill numbers, that doesn't necessarily mean they will present them or they're not a sham. Read them youself and tell me how they relate to the numbers uninsured, underinsured, rising insurance costs, the cost of the bill and how to pay for it, the budget, donut holes, medical bankruptcies, pharmaceutical costs, etc. All do address tax credits and tax cuts which have little to do with people who don't have enough money to buy insurance. Yesterday on C-Span, Sen. Roberts was taking credit for a bi-partisan HEALTH bill, it turns out it deals only with hospice care, truly comical.
When you hear a GOP Congressperson say he/she doesn't like something about the Dem bill and then offers what he propses as an alternative in the same situation, let me know.
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The Democrats just wanted a bill, any bill would do and they don't even know what's in it. No wonder they rejected the Republican amendment to put the bill on the internet.
 
TuTu Monroe said:
The Democrats just wanted a bill, any bill would do and they don't even know what's in it. No wonder they rejected the Republican amendment to put the bill on the internet.
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That's because when they were forced to slow down enough for people to understand their first humongospendnotgetmuch bill it was rejected by their constituency. They know that this one would too, and would prefer to pass it without that kind of oversight.
 
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