Attempt to rekindle Domestic Oil Drilling...

Topspin said:
... What the economic illiterate don't get is that $700billion a year that would stay here and in source jobs.
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That's "direct dollars," not including the multiplier effect, isn't it? Throw in the typical multiplier of 5x* and that's $3.5 trillion.








*5x is something I recall from grad school, and might be off a little now. Even if 3x, it's $2.1 Trillion.
 
Care4all said:
not one bill, opening all moratorium land will change the price to be for gasoline come this november....

but u are probably right, because the American people are IGNORANT on this subject and the GOP is counting on this fact....
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you shouldn't have dropped out of college care, if the price of oil goes way down so does gas. You don't let facts get in the way of good lefty hate do you.:cof1:
 
Care4all said:
How do you figure the $700 billion will stay here and what time period are you speaking about?

Will $700 billion be saved and put here this year, or next year or in 10 years or in 30 years or in 50 years when we have all of these untapped areas tapped? by then it could be a couple of trillion saved yearly if our consumption of oil continues to rise, I suppose....?

What year do we get to oil independence Toppy, and not have to buy any from foreigners? Do you even know? Do we as a country even know?

Or are you just taking Picken's word for it without any scrutiny?
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I know more about the oil industry than you and every lib on the board combined. There are millions of barrells that can be had just off cali that were shut down with the fear mongering of decades ago. the you have Florida and other outer continental that could be done in 5yrs.
All the whinning about jobs going overseas, you could add 100,000 job at $100,000 average salary by doing this.
 
The thing i mentioned about building an electric plant to supply them with the electricity that they will need to run their heaters for 3 straight years to get the temperature of the Shale to above 700 degrees F, where the oil separates reminded me of something local.....that i just found out the history on...which really made me think about how we were as a country way back when....

I live near the Penobscot River's mouth/right next to the Penobscot bay...

Our Electric Company, central Maine Electric....back in the early 1900's paid for and put in a Dam up river to supply the locals with electricity....then after they did this, they realized that they could generate soooo much more electricity than the area's people could consume.

So the Electric Company itself, built a Paper Mill down stream of the Electric Plant and bought up a whole bunch of forest land in the nowhere areas of the state, townships they are called here, so that they could sell their electricity left over, to themselves at this paper plant that they also owned....with the result of also bringing in more people in to the region to work and thus live, and thus use their electricity for their homes.

Very Smart imho....

their first client was Time Magazine, they made the magazine quality paper for TIME, and to this day they still have the TIME contract for most of their magazine paper though the Electric company sold off the papermill at a later date for a huge profit....

And on another note, even when the electric company put in the Papermill and bought up the land for the lumber to supply it, from the very beginning it was noted as a smart logger....always used best conservation practices to acquire the wood for their paper....even back then it was a concern of the Mainers that their state would be stripped of its resourse....its forests and the electric company wanted to be a "do gooder" with the community and to draw others in to moving in to the region....so they began on the right foot.

Today, this plant is noted as one of the cleanest and greenest papermills in the world and is owned by Verso International Paper.... there is absolutely no "papermill smell" that comes out of it....I DON'T know how they do it??? The papermills in Florida stunk to high heaven....

Anyway, i know that was off topic....sorry about that....

but it certainly falls in to play with the movie Field of Dreams in a way....if you build it, they will come....

thus the history of the expansion of the region I live in! :)
 
Damocles said:
It also said in your article that there are more modern methods like a freeze wall to prevent ground water contamination. Instead we just pound on as if technology has not and cannot improve reducing the impact. In situ extraction uses far less water that ex situ extraction and has less impact on the air and ground of the area of extraction, and with new technologies even the fear of ground water contamination will be just more fear mongering.
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Yeah the tech will save us titanic song.

Tech seems to cause at least as meny problems as it solves.
 
I'm betting any material increase in Natural Gas for auto's is increasing the shit out of the price. Period
 
uscitizen said:
Yeah the tech will save us titanic song.

Tech seems to cause at least as meny problems as it solves.
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Yep. Instead we'll just pretend that there is no problem with doing nothing until technology that doesn't exist gets invented. That will fix it, thanks gramps. You are turning into a true kool-aid drinker.
 
Topspin said:
I'm betting any material increase in Natural Gas for auto's is increasing the shit out of the price. Period
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And thus increasing the urge to tap the untapped resources and gain some of that profit, lowering the price. Adding infrastructure, jobs, etc. here. Oil isn't the only solution. There is tons of natural gas resources here in the US, easier to tap than the oil even.

This is an idiot who thinks that lowering demand from oil is going to get him laid off. However, demand for oil will continue, your job is safe.

Plus, the goal is to get off the foreign oil teat, not keep every single thing impossibly cheap.
 
Damocles said:
It also said in your article that there are more modern methods like a freeze wall to prevent ground water contamination. Instead we just pound on as if technology has not and cannot improve reducing the impact. In situ extraction uses far less water that ex situ extraction and has less impact on the air and ground of the area of extraction, and with new technologies even the fear of ground water contamination will be just more fear mongering.
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YES, but if you read further it also said this was only done in a small test and that they need to test it in a larger capacity before they can be certain that it works, though very promising in the smaller test.

If you call this just "fear mongering" then God Bless Fear Mongering!

It is good that these concerns were addressed and are being addressed before jumping head over heals in to it without examining and addressing these concerns imo!!!!

care
 
Damocles said:
And thus increasing the urge to tap the untapped resources and gain some of that profit, lowering the price. Adding infrastructure, jobs, etc. here. Oil isn't the only solution. There is tons of natural gas resources here in the US, easier to tap than the oil even.

This is an idiot who thinks that lowering demand from oil is going to get him laid off. However, demand for oil will continue, your job is safe.
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who thinks they are getting laid off?
 
Care4all said:
YES, but if you read further it also said this was only done in a small test and that they need to test it in a larger capacity before they can be certain that it works, though very promising in the smaller test.

If you call this just "fear mongering" then God Bless Fear Mongering!

It is good that these concerns were addressed and are being addressed before jumping head over heals in to it without examining and addressing these concerns imo!!!!

care
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Yes, hence my point that technology will be created to minimize that risk. Testing will be done, something will be found to solve your fear.

My point is standing and doing nothing while we fund both sides of a war and do nothing to solve the very real problem of foreign sourcing is even worse. We need to bridge the time between now and the next gen energy sourcing and continuing in the status quo is not just undesirable, it is unforgiveable. It should be a lunar-landing style national project.
 
Yeah and we have a system in place to run cars on natural gas ? ie filling stations and such ? One of the few advantages of ethanol as a short term help.
 
exactly and 80% of the American public agrees with drilling.
If Obama shows flexibility he takes that huge card out of the tiny deck Mcfossil has.
 
uscitizen said:
Yeah and we have a system in place to run cars on natural gas ? ie filling stations and such ? One of the few advantages of ethanol as a short term help.
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Actually, such things could be very easily implemented. And yes, there are several places you can fill your car with natural gas in the Denver area.

But heck, pretend that everything will remain as it is now. That we can't provide solutions. We can just cover our ears and shout real loud, "Research!" and it will all go away. We can't use any other method than that which does not exist yet to get us off the foreign oil. We should just mainline it. Nothing can be used to step us into it while limiting the need to buy from foreign sources.
 
Well since I don't live in denver. and do not even have domestic natural gas available here even though 3 36" , 2 20" and several more natural gas lines run less than 5 miles from my home....
 
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