Do You Think The Rich Should Be Taxed More?

PoliTalker said:
With that attitude we are. Nothing in the Constitution said it would be easy.
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tell that to the 75% of apathetic drones in our population who are more concerned about their fears of what the other party will do. i'm near giving up on everyone and just making sure i've got enough guns and butter to make it through the shitstorm that is certain to occur.
 
Hello SmarterthanYou,

SmarterthanYou said:
put together a proposed constitutional amendment because you can be assured that you will have to fight billions of dollars worth of lobbying by thousands of corporations and at least 500 congress critters, along with most state legislations, to put together an amendment that will clearly state what is to be done and that leaves zero room for reinterpretation by pissed off jurists on the bench who will seek to undermine it every step of the way......then the lawsuits to stop it.
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Agreed. But the challenge of writing that hopefully simple wording is huge. I sat down one time and tried to write one which would do that. I worked on it for months and gave up. Every time I thought I had it I would let it sit a while and then read it with new eyes. Those new eyes would always find a flaw, a chink in the armor. I think it is a mammoth undertaking. I wonder if anybody with more power than me has tried to write something. It ain't easy. The founders were geniuses. But they are gone. It falls upon us to protect the Constitution and make sure the nation lasts far beyond our short lives.
 
Hello SmarterthanYou,

SmarterthanYou said:
tell that to the 75% of apathetic drones in our population who are more concerned about their fears of what the other party will do. i'm near giving up on everyone and just making sure i've got enough guns and butter to make it through the shitstorm that is certain to occur.
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That's your choice. I still have faith in the USA. I like a challenge.
 
the constitution was written to give the federal government only that power that was needed to protect the rights of the people and provide for the nations defense. everything else was left alone so that we as individuals would have the freedom to live our lives in peace and keep what we earn. then people got stupid and lazy and wanted a government that would do it for them. here we are.
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello evince,



True, but nothing is free. Taxing the rich more will have an impact. Much of what conservatives say is correct. There would be less investment. Markets would be impacted. Anything we do would have to be implemented gradually to lessen the impact. 50% would be a tough sell as it is. 70% would be a non-starter.

We must take all views into consideration.

Any one-sided policy is destined to impart force upon the political pendulum. It is swinging much too wildly as it is. It would be better to reduce the gyrations and get the nation more united.
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Warren Buffet has been an investor for many years. He says when he makes an investment, he never considers the tax rates. A good investment is still a good investment.

When Ike was president, the top tax rate was 90 percent. WE built the interstate highway system then. Now we cannot maintain it. Corporations used to put in over 30 percent of the total revenue collected. Now near 12 . The fact is, the tax burden of the wealthy has dropped over and over. Trump just gave them another huge cut. The plutocracy is becoming a reality. We also allow them to rip us off with capital gains.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...y-twice-as-much-in-taxes-as-wealthy-investors
 
Nordberg said:
Warren Buffet has been an investor for many years. He says when he makes an investment, he never considers the tax rates. A good investment is still a good investment.

When Ike was president, the top tax rate was 90 percent. WE built the interstate highway system then. Now we cannot maintain it. Corporations used to put in over 30 percent of the total revenue collected. Now near 12 . The fact is, the tax burden of the wealthy has dropped over and over. Trump just gave them another huge cut. The plutocracy is becoming a reality. We also allow them to rip us off with capital gains.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...y-twice-as-much-in-taxes-as-wealthy-investors
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When Ike was President we were on the gold standard. Should we go back to that as well?
 
How do you define fair? Is it fair to charge more for gas if the person has a more expensive car? How about charging more for a cuppa joe if you wear a suit instead of jeans? Why shold someone who works hard and invests their money well and lives frugally have to pay a higher rate of taxes per dollar earned than someone who sits at home and receives welfare and all the other forms of welfare?

Fair means we all pay the exact same percent tax on each dollar earned/received regardless of the source of the dollar adn any other factors. No more deductions or exemptions for anyone for any reason. No more taxes on anything but personal income for individuals.

You want fair - there it is.
 
Hello SmarterthanYou,

SmarterthanYou said:
the constitution was written to give the federal government only that power that was needed to protect the rights of the people and provide for the nations defense. everything else was left alone so that we as individuals would have the freedom to live our lives in peace and keep what we earn. then people got stupid and lazy and wanted a government that would do it for them. here we are.
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OK, If we accept that, the problem is: your vision is unrealistic. If we tried to implement it the economy crashes. It's too late to go back to a minimalist government. We are here, that was long ago. If you take away all that stuff you don't like, the economy crashes. It's a no brainer. We are not doing that. You are free to argue for it, and I am glad you do. We need all views represented. Just as your idealistic visions need to be said, so does my rational and very real reason why that has never happened and is not going to. There simply are not enough people who believe what you do to cause that.
 
Nordberg said:
Warren Buffet has been an investor for many years. He says when he makes an investment, he never considers the tax rates. A good investment is still a good investment.
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He is a very smart man. Despite all his wealth he lives in a very ordinary house. He is able to separate happiness from wealth.

Nordberg said:
When Ike was president, the top tax rate was 90 percent. WE built the interstate highway system then. Now we cannot maintain it. Corporations used to put in over 30 percent of the total revenue collected. Now near 12 . The fact is, the tax burden of the wealthy has dropped over and over. Trump just gave them another huge cut. The plutocracy is becoming a reality. We also allow them to rip us off with capital gains.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...y-twice-as-much-in-taxes-as-wealthy-investors
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What a great point.

Highest tax rate at 93% - America was great. We BUILT the interstates from scratch. We also built schools, airports, hospitals, bridges. And the rich were richer than everybody else.

Highest tax rate at 39.6% - America yearns for greatness back. We can't even maintain the interstates we built when we collected more taxes. And we certainly can't afford a wall that Mexico is never going to pay for.

Taxing the rich more makes America great.
 
Hello and greetings flyboyut,

flyboyut said:
How do you define fair? Is it fair to charge more for gas if the person has a more expensive car? How about charging more for a cuppa joe if you wear a suit instead of jeans? Why shold someone who works hard and invests their money well and lives frugally have to pay a higher rate of taxes per dollar earned than someone who sits at home and receives welfare and all the other forms of welfare?

Fair means we all pay the exact same percent tax on each dollar earned/received regardless of the source of the dollar adn any other factors. No more deductions or exemptions for anyone for any reason. No more taxes on anything but personal income for individuals.

You want fair - there it is.
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Your idea of fair would crash the economy. Insufficient revenue would be collected, the government would go bankrupt, lay off millions, trash the national credit rating, rocking the world wide financial world to the very core.

Ya know what I think - fair - would be?

Fair would be if somebody is willing to work a full time job...

One income would support a family to be minimally comfortable in the modern sense. That they would also have full health care for the whole family from birth to death, paid sick leave, paid maternity leave, 12 weeks of paid vacation per year, enough wealth to purchase a small home, educate their children thru college, and a pension plan for comfortable retirement if the job is worked 30 years. That would be fair.
 
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PoliTalker said:
He is a very smart man. Despite all his wealth he lives in a very ordinary house. He is able to separate happiness from wealth.



What a great point.

Highest tax rate at 93% - America was great. We BUILT the interstates from scratch. We also built schools, airports, hospitals, bridges. And the rich were richer than everybody else.

Highest tax rate at 39.6% - America yearns for greatness back. We can't even maintain the interstates we built when we collected more taxes. And we certainly can't afford a wall that Mexico is never going to pay for.

Taxing the rich more makes America great.
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We were on the gold standard back then. Do you think we should return to it?
 
Hello cawacko,

cawacko said:
We were on the gold standard back then. Do you think we should return to it?
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No, but I think rich greedy corporations should give workers back what they had when conservatives say America was great. Things like a pension, paid vacations, and paid sick leave.
 
Our country is incredibly wealthy.

Here is the distribution of wealth...in an excellent video. (You don't have to watch the entire thing, although you should. The first minute and a half tell you everything you need to know.)



Anyone not sickened by this should be ashamed of themselves.
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello cawacko,



Because wealth creation can exceed the amount of available gold.
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But we had a lot less inequality under the gold standard. We get off it and inequality explodes.

And if we're talking about taxing at 90% rates that right there reduces wealth creation
 
PoliTalker said:
Hello SmarterthanYou,



OK, If we accept that, the problem is: your vision is unrealistic. If we tried to implement it the economy crashes. It's too late to go back to a minimalist government. We are here, that was long ago. If you take away all that stuff you don't like, the economy crashes. It's a no brainer. We are not doing that. You are free to argue for it, and I am glad you do. We need all views represented. Just as your idealistic visions need to be said, so does my rational and very real reason why that has never happened and is not going to. There simply are not enough people who believe what you do to cause that.
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so really all we're doing is rewriting the constitution every so often for the changing views of an idiotic and apathetic society because government.......k.
 
cawacko said:
But we had a lot less inequality under the gold standard. We get off it and inequality explodes.
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Pure conjecture. No cause and effect shown.

cawacko said:
And if we're talking about taxing at 90% rates that right there reduces wealth creation
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Why guess? We already did this and wealth creation was fine enough to build interstates, airports, hospitals and schools, AND allow every worker to have a home, a car, a vacation and a family supported by one income. Rich executives earned 10-15-even 20 times what the average worker earned. The rich lived a life of luxury. About the only thing the rich were not able to do was catapult their wealth into the stratosphere by screwing workers and consumers. Check out that video posted by Frank. Great graphics to show just how extreme wealth inequality has become. If you dare...

After top tax rates fell, the rich were able to do all that, tear our nation apart with extreme crony capitalism, and that's when wealth inequality grew.
 
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PoliTalker said:
Pure conjecture. No cause and effect shown.



Why guess? We already did this and wealth creation was fine enough to build interstates, airports, hospitals and schools, AND allow every worker to have a home, a car, a vacation and a family supported by one income. Rich executives earned 10-15-even 20 times what the average worker earned. The rich lived a life of luxury. About the only thing the rich were not able to do was catapult their wealth into the stratosphere by screwing workers and consumers. Check out that video posted by Frank. Great graphics to show just how extreme wealth inequality has become. If you dare...

After top tax rates fell, the rich were able to do all that, tear our nation apart with extreme crony capitalism, and that's when wealth inequality grew.
Click to expand...

But what gets left out here is the advancement of technology and geo-politics (which includes globalization).

It's possible to call those conjecture and no cause and effect as well. But just looking at tax rates misses the forest for the trees
 
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