Hillary won't get the nomination

Cypress said:
SF, traveling back in history to try to draw analogies to today is foolish. The country is different than 20, or even ten years ago.

Ronald Reagan won four statewide elections, at a minimum, in california going into the 1980s. He would get totally blown out today, by barbara boxer or any other competent Dem.

So, pointing to Gore's senate victories in tennesse, is just poppycock. As Darla said, it a republican talking point to avoid the topic of the theft of the election, and the absolute and unmitigated harm caused to the country by a guy you voted for twice.
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That's bullcrap. He won in '92 and '96 in Tennessee. To say he had no chance to win 4 years later is just wrong.
 
Sure the Democrats should do all they can about it, but come on... to blame them for the evil the Republicans have done over the past 8 years is rubbish. Blame the criminal, not the underfunded police!
 
Darla said:
I'll tell you what's funnier - yourself, superfreak and Damo hiding behind bac's skirts, because he is blaming gore which is who you want to blame.

without any of you ever daring to squeak a word when he mentions that the 2000 election was stolen.

Cause it was. Now here is the split:

I know it was stolen, and I put 3/4 of the blame on the actual thieves.
Bac knows it was stolen and puts the entire blame on the person who was robbed
You, SF and Damo, desperately try to blame Gore because you would rather die than admit george w bush was never a legitimate president and will go down in history that way.
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A. It wasn't stolen.

B. The election was Gore's to lose and he lost.
 
Darla said:
I'll tell you what's funnier - yourself, superfreak and Damo hiding behind bac's skirts, because he is blaming gore which is who you want to blame.

without any of you ever daring to squeak a word when he mentions that the 2000 election was stolen.

Cause it was. Now here is the split:

I know it was stolen, and I put 3/4 of the blame on the actual thieves.
Bac knows it was stolen and puts the entire blame on the person who was robbed
You, SF and Damo, desperately try to blame Gore because you would rather die than admit george w bush was never a legitimate president and will go down in history that way.
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1) I am not hiding behind anyone at 5'1 423 pounds that is rather hard

2) I am not denying that voter suppression occured, nor is that the main point of this argument.

3) The argument here is Lorax trying to act as if Nader voters wasted their vote because they didn't vote the way he wanted them too.

4) Gore ran a shitty campaign and he lost because of it.
 
blackascoal said:
Hundreds of thousands of innocent people are dead

Tens of thousands of our own soldiers are dead or wounded

America has lost it's image, stature, respect, influence, and power all over the world

Cowardice is never the answer. If democrats do not have the courage to lead, which they continue to prove over and over again, why are you voting for them?
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I myself, have not been voting for them. I was able to vote against Hillary before any of you! I voted for Jonathon Tasini in 06. He received 17% of the vote, and he had no money, and Hillary never debated him. He had very little coverage from the media. So that was significant I thought.

I will not vote for Hillary in 08, I have already said that. However, I will vote for Edwards, maybe for Obama, and definitely for al Gore if he enters.

I think that winning the presidency and not becoming president is a life-changing event. I think Gore is different, sincerely. I'd give him that chance.
 
Darla said:
I'll tell you what's funnier - yourself, superfreak and Damo hiding behind bac's skirts, because he is blaming gore which is who you want to blame.

without any of you ever daring to squeak a word when he mentions that the 2000 election was stolen.

Cause it was. Now here is the split:

I know it was stolen, and I put 3/4 of the blame on the actual thieves.
Bac knows it was stolen and puts the entire blame on the person who was robbed
You, SF and Damo, desperately try to blame Gore because you would rather die than admit george w bush was never a legitimate president and will go down in history that way.
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I don't "blame" Gore, I speak on strategy. He chose to focus basically on Florida and ignored his own state which would have won him the election.

The idea that he was such a great candidate pretty much flies in the face of reality when you begin to focus on who he lost to.

Then attempting to blame Nader. Sheesh... Fire his strategist and never let them near another campaign.
 
Darla said:
I agree. Gore does share some of the blame.

I have never said he didn't, but I don't put the whole blame on him.

I hope you don't mind my arguing with you! I love to argue with a leftist, while having two or three conservatives on me at the same time, it's the most exhilarating debating I've ever done. :)


And we do disagree here.
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I don't mind our disagreement at all my sister. Doesn't alter or change my TREMENDOUS respect for you and your thoughts.

But the reason democrats are so wimpy-weak, is because most of gheir constituents are .. not implying you of corse.

Gore should have been used as an example of what not to do in a race for the White House. Democrats even to this day pay little attention to the integrity of the vote .. so expect to be robbed again.
 
Jarod said:
Who said he had no chance? idiot!
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Idiot? Read what Darla and Cypress wrote. They claim the times changed and the South (Tennessee) was all Republican in 2000 even though Gore won Tenneessee in '92 and '96.

Damn man, read the thread. As an aside, I'm sure you believe Auburn is the victim losing to USF and MSU.
 
cawacko said:
That is not an excellent point. It's apples and oranges. Bush never won an election in CT. Gore won multiple elections in Tennessee.
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Cawacko I've addressed this at lenght on this thread, and I'm not going to do it again.

All I can say is that you and Damo apparently are the kinds of people who need to learn about what happened, WHILE YOU WERE LIVING AND AWARE, in history books.

lol

So, whatever.

Someday, they'll write one.
 
Jarod said:
Sure the Democrats should do all they can about it, but come on... to blame them for the evil the Republicans have done over the past 8 years is rubbish. Blame the criminal, not the underfunded police!
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Jarod... who is blaming them for the actions of Bush? If I gave that impression then I will clarify right now. I am not doing so. But Lorax was trying to blame the Nader voters and that is what sparked all of this. People were saying .... had Gore won, things would have been better. Then the discussion warped into why Gore lost.
 
blackascoal said:
Forget blame .. what lessons were learned from 2000?

One should have been weakness doesn't work

Another SHOULD have been protect the integrity of the vote

Democrats haven't learned either lesson and you cannot continue to blame republicans for democratic weakness.
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Well, I agree with this, they did not learn from the 2000 election theft, you're absolutely right.
 
Darla said:
Cawacko I've addressed this at lenght on this thread, and I'm not going to do it again.

All I can say is that you and Damo apparently are the kinds of people who need to learn about what happened, WHILE YOU WERE LIVING AND AWARE, in history books.

lol

So, whatever.

Someday, they'll write one.
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Then I don't agree with you because what I stated is clear as day.
 
Darla said:
I myself, have not been voting for them. I was able to vote against Hillary before any of you! I voted for Jonathon Tasini in 06. He received 17% of the vote, and he had no money, and Hillary never debated him. He had very little coverage from the media. So that was significant I thought.

I will not vote for Hillary in 08, I have already said that. However, I will vote for Edwards, maybe for Obama, and definitely for al Gore if he enters.

I think that winning the presidency and not becoming president is a life-changing event. I think Gore is different, sincerely. I'd give him that chance.
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I totally agree with you.

Had Gore had the balls he has now in pushing global warming or even speaking directly to the issues, he would have been elected in 2000.
 
cawacko said:
That's bullcrap. He won in '92 and '96 in Tennessee. To say he had no chance to win 4 years later is just wrong.
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We're you asleep during the 1990s?

Monicagate and the "culture warriors" on the right made "morality" and "christain values" a test for public office in the south by the late 1990s. Faux clinton-hatred was so embedded in the south by the late 1990s, that Gore and any Democrat of a national ticket wrote it off. Just like republicans wrote off the northeast and west coast in the 1990s - despite the fact that they had been winning northeast and west cost states mere years earlier
 
Darla said:
Well, I agree with this, they did not learn from the 2000 election theft, you're absolutely right.
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They didn't learn in 2004 when the fraud was proven and activists and IT experts all over the country were BEGGING them to take a firm and outspoken stand on voter fraud. They wimped out and did nothing .. then when the fraud happened in Ohio and Florida, just as we said it would, democrats acted surprised that republicans would steal the election.

That's bullshit.
 
Damocles said:
Do you really think it would work this way?
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You know, I read this interview with Tina Fey of 30 Rock? And her charcter on there makes the comment that she's one of those who will say they are going to vote for Obama, but then will vote for McCain and not tell anybody.

And fey admitted it was autobiographical, because she tells people she'll vote for Obama, but "I live in NY, when push comes to shove, I want the tough guy, I want Rudy".

Ok?

And I thought, shit, she's not the only one out there. there's a lot of them.
 
blackascoal said:
I totally agree with you.

Had Gore had the balls he has now in pushing global warming or even speaking directly to the issues, he would have been elected in 2000.
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Nope, many/most did not even acknowledge that global warming existed then. Public views have changed a lot since then.
 
Superfreak said:
Yes, I think Bill could win damn near every state right now. People look at the 90's and say "I want that again"... they would vote for him in a heartbeat. I don't like the guy and I would vote for him over any of the frontrunners in either party.
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I dont think he could get the south today SF. I think you are wrong. They still use Clinton to raise money in the south.
 
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