McCain ad

[Damocles]

Yes, but that same (or very similar) R Congress turned very irresponsible once they received an R President.

True. But if you think about it, they weren't really the same. Newt wasn't there any longer and many other key players in that particular time.

 

[Cancel7]

Who cares? What a couple of clowns you two are. We are facing Global warming (and I read something interesting recently, in Alterman’s book, I don’t give a shit if you consider him credible or not, I know that he is…he said that there are some business leaders and political leaders who believe we are already past the point of no return, which would explain a lot about gore’s actions this election), which is a crisis, we are grappling with a broken health care system which kills at least 18 thousand Americans every year, we are suffering rising food and energy costs which are directly causing the real suffering, suffering, of more and more Americans, including children, every single day, we are in the middle of a war which is draining our recourses, breaking our military, killing our people, killing other people, and has no end in sight…I can go and on and on.
And what do you two tards have to say? “fissal responwobility”. I picture nothing more than two of the most stupidest nerds, complete with pocket protectors, broken glasses and high-risers.

There is no doubt that the tax cuts and wars of this radical administration has screwed us and future generations, I agree. But to sit there obsessing over that bullshit, as if we were in seriously dangerous waters fiscally (we were not) before Bush, or even before Clinton, is nothing more than masturbation for nerds. And not even cool nerds.

 

[cawacko]

http://www.commondreams.org/views05/1127-25.htm


For more than 25 years, Business Week has conducted an annual survey of the earnings of chief executive officers of the largest U.S. corporations. In 1980, those executives earned 42 times as much as the average American worker, a ratio larger than the corresponding ratios for such countries as Japan and Germany even today. By 2000, however, American CEOs were earning 531 times the average worker's salary. The gains have been even larger for those above CEOs on the income ladder.

With corporate malfeasance much in the news, we know that at least some of the spectacular corporate pay packages were not won on merit. Most of them, however, are a simple consequence of market forces. As local markets have given way to regional, then national, and now global markets, even a few slightly improved executive decisions can now add hundreds of millions of dollars to the bottom line.

More generally, rapid pay growth at the top owes much to the spread of reward structures once confined largely to markets for sports and entertainment. In these "winner-take-all markets," small differences in performance often translate into enormous differences in economic reward. Now that we listen mostly to recorded music, the world's best musicians can literally be everywhere at once. The electronic news wire has allowed a small number of syndicated columnists to displace a host of local journalists. And the proliferation of personal computers has enabled a handful of software developers to replace thousands of local tax accountants. Each change has benefited consumers but has also led to greater inequality.

Around the globe, income inequality has been growing for essentially similar reasons. In most countries, public policy has attempted to counter this trend. Not in the United States. With the market's push toward greater inequality already apparent, for example, Congress reduced the top marginal income tax rate from 50 percent to 28 percent during the 1980s.

These tax cuts have increased inequality not only through their direct effects on after-tax incomes, but also through indirect effects on federal spending policies. Although supply-side economists predicted that the cuts would increase tax revenues by stimulating more than enough income growth to offset the lower rates, this did not happen, and hence the large budget deficits of the 1980s.

Those deficits were eliminated during the Clinton years but have reappeared, larger than ever, under President Bush, who has reduced tax rates on earnings, dividends and large inheritances. Once the enabling legislation is fully phased in, more than half of the resulting cuts - 52.5 percent, according to one recent estimate - will go to the top 5 percent of earners. The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office now forecasts deficits larger than $300 billion for each of the next six years.

Yes you have found left-wing sites that want greater redistribution of money vis-a-vis tax policy. The explosive growth the U.S. has experienced over the last 30 years has come from unshackling people from heavy taxation and releasing the American entrepreneurial spirit.

 

[Socrtease]

Here’s the problem. You’re basically describing socialism. And I have to ask; who gives a fuck?

In case you haven’t noticed, the leftmost party we have in this country, just authorized a fucking fisa “compromise” which was nothing more than a complete and total cave-in to the administration who uses the constitution for toilet paper. In other words, we don’t have a left in this country. So why the fuck are you wasting time bitching about something that doesn’t exist?

We do have one radical party that has taken control, and in case you didn’t notice, it’s the radical right. Deregulation, war, tax cuts during war for the rich and for corporations, inequality we haven’t seen since the gilded age, a broken health care system, MORE TAX CUTS, weakening of labor laws, impotent unions. And all of that has done this country a lot of good hasn’t it?

And people are sitting here bitching about a left that exists in a few outlands of san Francisco coffee houses and could not be further away from power if they were Barney fucking Ruble, while a radical right wing revolution has taken place right under their noses.

And I really have to go back to my first question, which was: Who gives a fuck?

The truth is, and you should be honest about it, you have never seen a corporation you couldn't hate. CEO's are all greedy evil bastards, but the normal people who pick the boards that decide how much they make and what their golden parachutes get not shit from you. And despite the countless times SF has asked you continue to avoid the questions about the inherent inequities that exist in Hollywood, in professional sports and even in my field. People get paid for what they add to the company they work for. Yes some CEO's fuck up a corporation and get rewarded none the less. But that is the fault of the PEOPLE WHO OWN THE COMPANY. Not the CEO's, not the Republicans and not the Democrats. There are socially conscious corporations. Starbucks stands out as one. But it is NOT the job of corporation to make the whole world better. It is not job of the corporation to pay everyone on par with eachother. Why not just fess up. You hate large corporations. You want the whole world to be run by local, evironmentally friendly, to each according to his needs, small cottage inudstries. Would make for a wonderful 2d or 3d world country to live in.

 

[Cancel7]

The truth is, and you should be honest about it, you have never seen a corporation you couldn't hate. CEO's are all greedy evil bastards, but the normal people who pick the boards that decide how much they make and what their golden parachutes get not shit from you. And despite the countless times SF has asked you continue to avoid the questions about the inherent inequities that exist in Hollywood, in professional sports and even in my field. People get paid for what they add to the company they work for. Yes some CEO's fuck up a corporation and get rewarded none the less. But that is the fault of the PEOPLE WHO OWN THE COMPANY. Not the CEO's, not the Republicans and not the Democrats. There are socially conscious corporations. Starbucks stands out as one. But it is NOT the job of corporation to make the whole world better. It is not job of the corporation to pay everyone on par with eachother. Why not just fess up. You hate large corporations. You want the whole world to be run by local, evironmentally friendly, to each according to his needs, small cottage inudstries. Would make for a wonderful 2d or 3d world country to live in.

You are full of shit here Soc. You have ignored every post I have made on this thread about corporations. They are not something one “hates”. They are not alive. They exist for one purpose; to make the largest profit that they can. They are neither inherently good, nor inherently evil. Society has an interest in regulating the harm that the pursuit of that profit, without regards to any other concern,can do.
Period.
All the rest of this is just dramatic bullshit. Nothing more so than this nonsense about inequality in Hollywood. For Christ sakes, that is the biggest non-sequitur on this thread. I didn’t answer it because I honestly believed that nobody other than that idiot Superfreak would even take it seriously. On that, you proved me wrong.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

Who cares? What a couple of clowns you two are. We are facing Global warming (and I read something interesting recently, in Alterman’s book, I don’t give a shit if you consider him credible or not, I know that he is…he said that there are some business leaders and political leaders who believe we are already past the point of no return, which would explain a lot about gore’s actions this election), which is a crisis, we are grappling with a broken health care system which kills at least 18 thousand Americans every year, we are suffering rising food and energy costs which are directly causing the real suffering, suffering, of more and more Americans, including children, every single day, we are in the middle of a war which is draining our recourses, breaking our military, killing our people, killing other people, and has no end in sight…I can go and on and on.
And what do you two tards have to say? “fissal responwobility”. I picture nothing more than two of the most stupidest nerds, complete with pocket protectors, broken glasses and high-risers.

There is no doubt that the tax cuts and wars of this radical administration has screwed us and future generations, I agree. But to sit there obsessing over that bullshit, as if we were in seriously dangerous waters fiscally (we were not) before Bush, or even before Clinton, is nothing more than masturbation for nerds. And not even cool nerds.

If you did not care, then please choose not to address it. I mentioned it because Desh brought it up. If you don't like it... tough shit. If you think the increases in debt every year prior to Bush (or Clinton) weren't bankrupting this country, then you are ignorant on economics.

I have brought up ways to reduce energy prices and food prices, which are largely ignored by those like you who choose instead to continue to bitch about Bush and his failed policies rather than focus on how to solve his fuck ups. You want to reduce food prices to ease the suffering that is out there.... get people in your organizations to write their respective Reps and Senators and demand they stop subsidizing food for fuel programs. 15% of our grain goes to ethanol production. End this shit and you will see food prices drop dramatically as supply will once again outweigh demand.... and that is JUST if the US does it.

You want to reduce energy prices to ease the suffering... get your organizations to write again on how we should drill every damn site within the US and off our coasts coupled with increasing funding for alt energy installation rebates (primarily for solar right now as that is the most economically viable energy alternative at this time).

Or would you rather to continue to whine about how bad Bush is?

I notice you continue to ignore the fact that there are vast income disparities in groups other than CEOs vs "average workers". I am sure Desh will do the same. Because they don't fall into your "they are evil corps" talking points.

 

[uscitizen]

Do you have any examples of these failed policies over the last 30 years?

umm Enron, Iraq war, deregulation allowing the current junk sub prime crisis and other complications in that area. Lack of a proper energy policy, need i go on ?

 

[evince]

Yes you have found left-wing sites that want greater redistribution of money vis-a-vis tax policy. The explosive growth the U.S. has experienced over the last 30 years has come from unshackling people from heavy taxation and releasing the American entrepreneurial spirit.

Published on Sunday, November 27, 2005 by the Philadelphia Inquirer


Common dreams did not write this you fool

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

You are full of shit here Soc. You have ignored every post I have made on this thread about corporations. They are not something one “hates”. They are not alive. They exist for one purpose; to make the largest profit that they can. They are neither inherently good, nor inherently evil. Society has an interest in regulating the harm that the pursuit of that profit, without regards to any other concern,can do.
Period.
All the rest of this is just dramatic bullshit. Nothing more so than this nonsense about inequality in Hollywood. For Christ sakes, that is the biggest non-sequitur on this thread. I didn’t answer it because I honestly believed that nobody other than that idiot Superfreak would even take it seriously. On that, you proved me wrong.

So the actors who are paid exhorbitant amounts relative to the "average worker" is different from the CEO being paid exhorbitant amounts relative to the "average" worker....HOW???????

Both are paid based on perception of added value to their companies. Some get paid vast amounts of money despite being complete failures. Others are underpaid despite making vasts amounts of money. IT is the same god damn thing.

Take a poll of the "average" workers and see how many of them want their firms to be "less profitable". Because less profits means lower amounts available for the workers as well as the CEOs. It also means less for the owners of the companies (which also tend to represent portions of 401ks and IRAs etc.... of those "average workers").

While regulation is needed to an extent, too often the idiots on the left want to go to such an extreme that they drive the business from our shores and then bitch when the companies take jobs and headquarters overseas.

 

[evince]

The truth is, and you should be honest about it, you have never seen a corporation you couldn't hate. CEO's are all greedy evil bastards, but the normal people who pick the boards that decide how much they make and what their golden parachutes get not shit from you. And despite the countless times SF has asked you continue to avoid the questions about the inherent inequities that exist in Hollywood, in professional sports and even in my field. People get paid for what they add to the company they work for. Yes some CEO's fuck up a corporation and get rewarded none the less. But that is the fault of the PEOPLE WHO OWN THE COMPANY. Not the CEO's, not the Republicans and not the Democrats. There are socially conscious corporations. Starbucks stands out as one. But it is NOT the job of corporation to make the whole world better. It is not job of the corporation to pay everyone on par with eachother. Why not just fess up. You hate large corporations. You want the whole world to be run by local, evironmentally friendly, to each according to his needs, small cottage inudstries. Would make for a wonderful 2d or 3d world country to live in.

Soc there are corporations who dont opperate like this and that doi take into consideration the American people and our economy when they act. When an industry acts irresponsibily there are always member who refrain from doing so. The regulations actually protect them from the others excesses. Why do you always refuse to recognize this?

 

[Cancel7]

So the actors who are paid exhorbitant amounts relative to the "average worker" is different from the CEO being paid exhorbitant amounts relative to the "average" worker....HOW???????

Both are paid based on perception of added value to their companies. Some get paid vast amounts of money despite being complete failures. Others are underpaid despite making vasts amounts of money. IT is the same god damn thing.

Take a poll of the "average" workers and see how many of them want their firms to be "less profitable". Because less profits means lower amounts available for the workers as well as the CEOs. It also means less for the owners of the companies (which also tend to represent portions of 401ks and IRAs etc.... of those "average workers").

While regulation is needed to an extent, too often the idiots on the left want to go to such an extreme that they drive the business from our shores and then bitch when the companies take jobs and headquarters overseas.

IT HAS NOTHING TO FUCKING DO WITH THE RISING INEQUALITY YOU FUCKING MORON.
When Liz Taylor was paid 1 million buck to make Cleopatra, you probably couldn’t have found a CEO who made that amount of money. It was indicative of ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOTHING, just like it is today.

 

[Cancel7]

If you did not care, then please choose not to address it. I mentioned it because Desh brought it up. If you don't like it... tough shit. If you think the increases in debt every year prior to Bush (or Clinton) weren't bankrupting this country, then you are ignorant on economics.

I have brought up ways to reduce energy prices and food prices, which are largely ignored by those like you who choose instead to continue to bitch about Bush and his failed policies rather than focus on how to solve his fuck ups. You want to reduce food prices to ease the suffering that is out there.... get people in your organizations to write their respective Reps and Senators and demand they stop subsidizing food for fuel programs. 15% of our grain goes to ethanol production. End this shit and you will see food prices drop dramatically as supply will once again outweigh demand.... and that is JUST if the US does it.

You want to reduce energy prices to ease the suffering... get your organizations to write again on how we should drill every damn site within the US and off our coasts coupled with increasing funding for alt energy installation rebates (primarily for solar right now as that is the most economically viable energy alternative at this time).

Or would you rather to continue to whine about how bad Bush is?

I notice you continue to ignore the fact that there are vast income disparities in groups other than CEOs vs "average workers". I am sure Desh will do the same. Because they don't fall into your "they are evil corps" talking points.

I want you to know something; so I’m going to say this straight out, this is on my own mother’s life.
I did not read one fucking word of this. YOU ARE A FUCKING BABBLING FOOL. You come on to thread after thread on this board and go on and on and on and say nothing. You are I guess you could say, a Faulknerian poster. I swear to God to you, I don’t have the time or interest to waste on your fucking nonsense. Neither you nor Soc addressed my post about the fact that there is effectively no left in this country, and yet a radical right wing revolution has taken place right under your noses while you are bitching about something that has as much power, and I’ll say it again, as Barney Rubel. You do it because you have nothing else to say. I do. Now, shut the fuck up fool.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

umm Enron, Iraq war, deregulation allowing the current junk sub prime crisis and other complications in that area. Lack of a proper energy policy, need i go on ?

Enron was a result of a tax code that is so complex that Enron was able to cook their books (with the help of their auditors) to an extent that no one could tell without a comprehensive look into their books (which is what the auditors are supposed to protect shareholders from).

The Deregulation (or elimination of Glass Steagall) was begun under the first Bush (with a Dem Congress) continued by Clinton (with first a Dem Congress and then a Rep one) and finished by Bush II (with a Rep Congress). For the final friggin time... this was the result of BOTH parties trying to engineer "more home ownership" for those who would not have previously qualified to own a home.

We have not had a good energy policy in the past 40 years. That again is not a result of either conservative or liberal policies but rather it is the result of too many idiots in BOTH parties in DC.

Note.... to all those who are currently bitching about oil/food speculators.... why did you not bitch when the speculators kept prices artificially low? (yes, this is a rhetorical question)

 

[Annie]

I want you to know something; so I’m going to say this straight out, this is on my own mother’s life.
I did not read one fucking word of this. YOU ARE A FUCKING BABBLING FOOL. You come on to thread after thread on this board and go on and on and on and say nothing. You are I guess you could say, a Faulknerian poster. I swear to God to you, I don’t have the time or interest to waste on your fucking nonsense. Neither you nor Soc addressed my post about the fact that there is effectively no left in this country, and yet a radical right wing revolution has taken place right under your noses while you are bitching about something that has as much power, and I’ll say it again, as Barney Rubel. You do it because you have nothing else to say. I do. Now, shut the fuck up fool.

Not defending anyone, but how do you know that your point wasn't addressed if you didn't read it?

 

[Cancel7]

You know what, you fools are impossible, and I think that the comfort I have is that you have failed. Your ideology has failed, your mindfuck of the American people has finally, failed.
You’re getting thrown out on your collective asses, and are poised to enter, my guess is, 30 years in the political wilderness.
So really, what is the point of this? To argue with the only handful of fools, bloviaters and outright liars, left in this country who believe that the left is a problem in this country…this country that the radical right has fucked up so badly.
Enjoy it, you earned it. I should really just sit back and smile. With the way things are, a left might actually take hold in this country. A real left. And boy would I smile then. You have that coming too.

 

[Cancel7]

Not defending anyone, but how do you know that your point wasn't addressed if you didn't read it?

Because I made it what, two hours ago? So SF just addressed it now? Doubtful!

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

I want you to know something; so I’m going to say this straight out, this is on my own mother’s life.
I did not read one fucking word of this. YOU ARE A FUCKING BABBLING FOOL. You come on to thread after thread on this board and go on and on and on and say nothing. You are I guess you could say, a Faulknerian poster. I swear to God to you, I don’t have the time or interest to waste on your fucking nonsense. Neither you nor Soc addressed my post about the fact that there is effectively no left in this country, and yet a radical right wing revolution has taken place right under your noses while you are bitching about something that has as much power, and I’ll say it again, as Barney Rubel. You do it because you have nothing else to say. I do. Now, shut the fuck up fool.

I want you to know.... I read the first sentence and then stopped. Because that right there says you are a closed minded fool. You refuse to listen to anything that might disrupt your precious view of the fantasy world you live in.

Had you bothered to read my last post, you would have seen what we need to do to reduce energy and food prices. But again, you ignore it because you would much rather BITCH about the grave injustice the high prices are inflicting upon the masses rather than actually DO anything to try to solve the fucking problem.

So please, if you have nothing of value to add, follow your own advice and shut the fuck up.

If you truly think there is no "left" in this country then you are indeed a fool. Socially this country has been moving further and further to the left over the past several decades (and this is a good thing). The problems are not solved by any means, but they are indeed improving. Otherwise we would not be talking about a black man running for President. Economically we have been screwed fiscally for almost five decades. So don't tell me we have been conservative in that regard. The "I want it now, the costs be damned" mentallity of the left has overwhelmed our society.

 

[Epicurus]

Your ideology has failed, your mindfuck of the American people has finally, failed.
You’re getting thrown out on your collective asses, and are poised to enter, my guess is, 30 years in the political wilderness.

Careful not to count your chickens before they hatch.

I heard similar blabberings in 2004.

 

[Cancel7]

Careful not to count your chickens before they hatch.

I heard similar blabberings in 2004.

You didn't hear them from me. This time I said it. Bank on it.

 

[Cancel 2016.2]

IT HAS NOTHING TO FUCKING DO WITH THE RISING INEQUALITY YOU FUCKING MORON.
When Liz Taylor was paid 1 million buck to make Cleopatra, you probably couldn’t have found a CEO who made that amount of money. It was indicative of ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOTHING, just like it is today.

This is why you are so ignorant on the topic. It is exactly the same situation you fucking moron, yet because Liz Taylor isn't an evil CEO, it just doesn't matter to you.

It is just as indicative of a corporation paying someone for their perceived value to the corporation. If it wasn't then the grip would make just as much as Liz. But that doesn't happen..... does it? No. But you want to continue your pathetic little rant.... so go right ahead. I'll just sit back and laugh.